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Were most Japanese people OTL like Muto? Did they hate what their government was doing, but powerless to do anything about it?
The Sun, The Stars and The Sickle: Alt-WWII and a Tripolar Postwar World
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Were most Japanese people OTL like Muto? Did they hate what their government was doing, but powerless to do anything about it?
The sad fact is, if more people OTL were more like Muto and less like Kishi, things would not have happened the way they did, and all the talk of honour and ancient renown would have meant something.
But now that Prince Pujie is in charge, Emperor in all but name, all that has changed. It's probably no coincidence that the Manchu Imperial Army suddenly gained a boost in confidence and competence alike once Prince Pujie became Prince Regent.
I guess we can all agree that Baron Muto whether IOTL or ITTL is the one who actually embodied what Bushido really meant. Not just in form the way the rest of the IJA or so much of the IJN IOTL did, but in essence as well.
Something about the mention of Russian service reminded me - I'm torn here. Obviously the Nazi eastern front should be thrown back as quickly as possible, since they're just as quick TTL as OTL to inflict atrocities on the Poles and Russians. On the other hand, I'm kind've hoping that the USSR's greater beating means that the Western+J Allies can pull a little more of Europe into their sphere postwar; no country deserves the tender mercies of "Uncle Joe" if it can be helped.
Speaking of Kuribayashi, perhaps it was for the best that he died in battle on Iwo Jima. For all that General Smith expressed respect for the man, Kuribayashi having fought in China and giving the Americans a hard time on Iwo Jima might easily have led to him getting the same fate as Yamashita in the Tokyo War Crimes Tribunal. Better he got buried with all the soldiers he led to the bitter end, than be hanged just to satisfy MacArthur and his gang's desire for revenge against all the tactical setbacks the genuinely-talented commanders Japan had actually pulled on them.
Yes, yes, I know, command responsibility...though TBH implementation of that's always seemed spotty to me, when that son of a bitch Shirou Ishii walked free and he was a three-star general. And that doesn't count all the BS rules lawyering America's pulled to wriggle free of international (or even domestic) condemnation at the stunts they pulled (like the use of Agent Orange in Vietnam which affected their own troops and which they either refuse to admit or cheapen up on compensating for) decades after the war.
Laws should not have exceptions. It affects all or no one at all.
Yes, yes, I know, command responsibility...though TBH implementation of that's always seemed spotty to me, when that son of a bitch Shirou Ishii walked free and he was a three-star general. And that doesn't count all the BS rules lawyering America's pulled to wriggle free of international (or even domestic) condemnation at the stunts they pulled (like the use of Agent Orange in Vietnam which affected their own troops and which they either refuse to admit or cheapen up on compensating for) decades after the war.
Laws should not have exceptions. It affects all or no one at all.
Absolutely!
Yamashita hung for what troops not under his command did, and also what troops under his command but openly disobeying his orders did. It didn't help that he had subordinates like Akira Muto, who was an absolute bastard and richly deserved the noose he got. It was a tough call, and I believe that while punishment was justified, capital punishment may have been too far.
Even with the Imperial Family, the one member that was prosecuted was Prince Nashimoto, which was a strange choice, as he was notably not radicalized, and was actually shunned by the militarists for refusing to lend credence to their cause. Instead, he was prosecuted while Prince Asaka wasn't- and if it wasn't he who perpetrated the Rape of Nanking, at the very least he didn't do enough to stop it, and if it was Isamu Cho who stole his cipher and issued the order, he should have run Cho through with his own sword, or run himself through for allowing it to happen.
Kuribayashi was an interesting case- his men disliked him because he upheld standards of discipline that other commanders could not or would not.
Ishii was especially horrfying as he was obsessed with cutting up Chinese prisoners alive.
*eyebrow rises*
Didn't you just put Akira Muto in command of the Kwantung Army after Tojo's cashiering? IIRC, assignments at present are:
- Kwantung Army - General Akira Muto
- Northern China Expeditionary Army - Field Marshal Count Hisaichi Terauchi
- Central China Expeditionary Army - Field Marshal Shunroku Hata
- Southern China Expeditionary Army - General Tomoyuki Yamashita
Ironically, once the fighting started, they really started respecting him, as his ideas worked.
And that SOB walked away. Where's the justice?
Akira Muto and Nobuyoshi Muto are two very, very different people!
As of now, command is:
KA: Hata
1CEA: Terauchi
Southern General Army (renamed from 2CEA): Yamashita
Field Marshal N. Muto is Ambassador to Manchukuo, having chosen to retire from the Army due to his advanced age.
Absolutely! His personal bravery and insisting on sharing the hardships of his men helped too. Even Baron Nishi who served with him, a man of vast personal wealth, also shared the privations of Kuribayashi and his men.
Miscarried, 100%. Ishii would have been long since purged from the Army ITTL, his disturbing quackery unwanted.
Oh I see. So what's Akira Muto doing ITTL? Or Generals Doihara and Umezu? IIRC General Itagaki's now assigned to rear echelon duty at Army HQ, while Prince Asaka been honorably discharged to take up the post of a priest at one of the Imperial shrines.
Yeah, I remember that. IIRC, Princes Morimasa and Kan'in wanted to assign him as Kwantung Army Commander again, but decided it would be too taxing for his age (and would have been an unsubtle jab at Tojo).
Though I imagine the princes are privately wondering if Tojo deserved such courtesy, considering the fiasco at Xuzhou.
Baron Nishi was an old school officer, another example of the nobility and dignity the IJA once possessed (during the Eight-Nation Alliance and again in the Russo-Japanese War, the IJA impressed western armies with their discipline and good treatment of prisoners, which made the fall decades later so much more jarring).
Whatever happened to him ITTL, what with Unit 731 focusing on practical research i.e. shoe sealant and foot powder among other things.
Laugh now, but Doctor Sato will ensure that when the first man sets foot on the moon decades later, that man will be wearing boots prepared with the products of Japanese invention!
Akira Muto would likely have been purged and his commission cashiered, or likelier still, been "encouraged" to resign from the Army. He would have been a poor fit with the standards expected of an officer post-1932 TTL.
TTL, Doihara was dismissed from the Army in 1933. Field Marshal Baron Muto recommended his dismissal due to Doihara's radical sympathies, appalling quality of staff work, and his increasingly obvious opium addiction. Since his dismissal, he has become a moderately successful import broker, and associate of Nobosuke Kishi. Kishi ITTL, is President of Fushun Coal & Aggregates Limited, known for middling quality coal, and appalling safety records and bookkeeping practices.
Seishiro Itagaki shares a similarly ignominous fate- during a party, a visibly drunk General Itagaki groped a geisha, and proclaimed that it was a "good night to be a Japanese man!" The Army General Staff apparently disagreed, and placed now- Colonel Itagaki on the retirement list.
The geisha incident did happen OTL and Itagaki was never punished, although later the Emperor came to dislike him.
Umezu would likely be stuck at field officer level, bouncing between low prestige positions.
Hideki "The Razor" Tojo is still a man utterly obesessed with etiquette- so his rather polite and proper dismissal is the ultimate blow. He cannot claim he was mistreated in any way. He brought the shame of defeat to the Kwantung Army, and was justly relieved of command for it. Even if he tries to blame Mutaguchi for his flawed assault, Tojo was ultimately in command of the operation, and Mutaguchi's career is dead ended anyway.
Plus, I can imagine the amusing conversations that must arise. Tojo was a man who had no interests outside of work and his family. Prince Nashimoto, by contrast, was a man of culture, and spoke French, enjoyed opera, sumo, and martial arts...
Absolutely!
TTL, I could see him rising to if not a field command of his own, then Deputy Inspector General of Cavalry.
I remember reading about Baron Nishi: "Few people comprehended him, and only Uranus (his horse) understood him".
Ah, Ishii... TTL, he is something of a mad scientist, but not in an endearing way like Buckminster Fuller or a useful one like Sir Barnes Wallis... he is a researcher of little note, scraping out a living from publications, an associate professorship, and occasional expert witness. His colleagues regard him with thinly veiled disgust, owing to his excessive enthusiasm for vivisecting pigs and other animal subjects.
I can see him resigning just to save face, plus an additional star on his lapels and another zero on his pension.
Well, that explains why the OTL Kwantung Army was so big on opium. But with Doihara booted out, and Muto actually followed, things have worked out just fine.
How has this guy not been declared persona non grata in Manchukuo, or even ostracized in Japan ITTL with his excesses, when patriotic fervor is high and he's riding high while everyone else is tightening belts for the common cause?
I imagine the Emperor likes him even less now
Yeah, that sounds like a fitting post for that guy.
I can see the prince making small talk of Tojo during an intermission at a sumo tournament.
That...makes sense. He was an Olympic-grade jockey and gold medalist. There is absolutely no way he would achieved that without such a...bond, with his horse. I know, I know...no scientific evidence...but then again they also say psychology isn't a real science...
Good, that's the least that bastard deserves.
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Laugh now, but Doctor Sato will ensure that when the first man sets foot on the moon decades later, that man will be wearing boots prepared with the products of Japanese invention!
Indeed they will! I recall that IJA boots for the other ranks were of poor quality, especially towards the end of the war, and that caused a lot of problems. Progress in sealants can also be put into applications larger than tubes of Formula 713. Officers had to purchase their own boots (OTL and TTL), but they no doubt will purchase tubes of the strangely effective sealant!
I can see him (Akira Muto) resigning just to save face, plus an additional star on his lapels and another zero on his pension.
I imagine the Emperor likes him (Itagaki) even less now
Yeah, that sounds like a fitting post for that guy(Umezu).
To the deserving, go the spoils! They reap what they have sown.
And how! If you ever need someone who is comic book levels of evil, there is Kenji Doihara. He rose to prominence by essentially pimping out his 15 year-old sister to an elderly general, and ran Manchukuo as a terrifying state-terror sponsored narco-kelptocracy.
Kishi, for all of his many flaws, is a man of vast personal wealth, and can be very charismatic. He does not cross social circles with someone as well-bred as Princess Hiro, nor can his wealth sway someone with as vast a personal fortune as Count Terauchi. He has what the Army, Navy and big business want, so he is tolerated for now, but there is often a fall for those with such great, if questionably warranted pride.
Kishi's behaviour has made him too few of the right kind of friends. A rogue like Kishi is not welcomed by the increasingly aristocratic IJA officer corps, and he has no friends of note at all in the Navy. He has spoken disdainfully about the zaibatsu, which is a huge mistake. They are just as strong TTL, and his mining operation would be a welcome addition to any of their portfolios- and Yasuda would eagerly fund it for any of the other Big Four.
Not all of his potential enemies need hold such lofty positions. A junior tax auditor or safety inspector may notice the cracks. Who Kishi might think is an easy mark for his wiles, may in fact be a modern girl, who is willing and capable of defending herself and her honour...
That is a vignette I will definitely write!
I totally belive that. Uranus even looks at ease in what would have to be an uncomfortable posed photograph:
I cannot yet reveal it, but I have his fate prepared for him!
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Now, while the IJA TTL is much, much better behaved and much more organized than OTL, it still isn't perfect, and there is one issue in particular that sticks out:
There is a huge and ever-widening class gap between officers and NCOs and other ranks in the IJA. Officers are disproportionately drawn from the upper middle class to sons of peers, whereas the NCOs and other ranks are almost always from the working to lower middle class. Burakumin (persons disriminated against during the feudal era for being in the lowest class and working in occupations tainted with death, such as undertakers or tanners) volunteer in disproportionately high numbers as well.
Officers are typically well-off and highly educated, especially those accepted into the War College 1932-1939. There is a bias towards accepting such applicants due to their greater reliability- a wealthy officer is harder to bribe and more invested in the status quo, and an educated officer is less likely to be seduced by the rhetoric of the militarists.
The kit is expensive as well. Swords, headdress, boots, and uniforms are all privately purchased, and the tailored gear is not at all cheap. Top-quality tailoring is especially prevalent in the Imperial Guards, which scrupulously uphold the highest standards of dress and deportment. This is in contrast to the OTL IJA which viewed such polish unnecessarily ornamental.
Posters of the "Ideal Japanese Gentleman Officer" are widely distributed, and a mess system has emerged to help less well-off officers afford their kit.
There is a huge and ever-widening class gap between officers and NCOs and other ranks in the IJA. Officers are disproportionately drawn from the upper middle class to sons of peers, whereas the NCOs and other ranks are almost always from the working to lower middle class. Burakumin (persons disriminated against during the feudal era for being in the lowest class and working in occupations tainted with death, such as undertakers or tanners) volunteer in disproportionately high numbers as well.
Officers are typically well-off and highly educated, especially those accepted into the War College 1932-1939. There is a bias towards accepting such applicants due to their greater reliability- a wealthy officer is harder to bribe and more invested in the status quo, and an educated officer is less likely to be seduced by the rhetoric of the militarists.
The kit is expensive as well. Swords, headdress, boots, and uniforms are all privately purchased, and the tailored gear is not at all cheap. Top-quality tailoring is especially prevalent in the Imperial Guards, which scrupulously uphold the highest standards of dress and deportment. This is in contrast to the OTL IJA which viewed such polish unnecessarily ornamental.
Posters of the "Ideal Japanese Gentleman Officer" are widely distributed, and a mess system has emerged to help less well-off officers afford their kit.
Would there not still be NCO's promoted into offership because of deeds on the battlefield? These men would have a much stronger supporting base among the lower ranks, and when the IJA sees the loyalty and respect these officers command among the men, it may encourage them to promote more NCO's up the ranks??
That is still better than the horde of undisciplined rapists, murderers, and looters that the IJA was IOTL.
Not to mention that the US armed forces are still segregated (as are the New Zealand forces, although that was because the Maori wanted it that way). The IJA isn't that bad by comparison.
Granted, the battlefield-promoted IJA officers will be well-respected by the NCOs and other ranks, but the technical expertise (especially for artillerists and other branches) that the War College educated officers hold will be essential as well- even with class friction at play.
Yeah, the worst it gets TTL is similar to the post- Cardwell, pre-WWI British Army
Officers still have to be Gentlemen, but they don't purchase their commissions?
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