The Sloppiest Alternate Histories Out There...

I have never quite understood where Turtledove's obsession with Horace Wilson comes from, given that he was literally just some guy.

Maybe for TL-191 he couldn't think, or didn't know, of any famous British politicians to use for the role of leading the post war government so he decided on him semi randomly. I guess for his War that Came Early series he decided to use him again just for the heck of it. :p:rolleyes: And yes, he literally was some guy. Seriously, look the guy up, his wiki page is less than a page short. :p

As for the War that Came Early series, I've never read it, but I've read about the plot and everything, and it seems way to implausible to take seriously. I mean Britain and France fight a war with Nazi Germany, only to make peace and join them in fighting the Soviets? :eek: The most implausible thing he's ever written.

I know Turtledove gets allot of critics around here, but I honestly feel people give him too hard a time. None of his other works I can think of off the top of my head are as egregiously implausible as so many poeple make them out to be. I especially feel this way about people criticizing Timeline 191. IMO, its not really that implausible at all. I now its not up to certain standards some people have around here, but he got aheluvalot more right than he did wrong. Keep in mind he's studies AH and he doesn't dig into ever ounce of detail like some people do around here, but it still works for his stories, and they still manage to be plausible for the most part. Just my two cents.
 
Last edited:
I can't find it any more, but a couple months back somebody posted a TL where Microsoft and Apple team up with Sega and Nintendo respectively to make consoles, and it was obvious that the guy didn't just not do any research, he clearly had no clue what the fuck he was talking about.

I don't want to sound mean-spirited, but yeah, I remember seeing that one a while ago and just facepalming right from the first post when I saw the name 'X-3DO'.
To be fair though, he did take note of the criticisms and at least tried to adjust things accordingly.
For those who are curious, a link to the thread.
 
As a Titanic researcher, I consider this to be one of the worst AH's I've ever read:

http://blog.timesunion.com/chuckmiller/if-titanic-didnt-hit-the-iceberg/12749/

Okay, what did I just read. I am really supposed to take this seriously? Its actually pretty comical how stupid these scenarios are. :rolleyes::p

Scenario One sounds like it was written by a fourteen year old kid (no offense to any on this site :p:)). It is way too convergent. I mean as if the Titanic as a Lusitania analog wasn't enough, Germany wins WWI as a result. And Churchill and De Gaulle leading a dictatorial Britain and France? I can maybe this with an earlier POD, as they would be very different people, but with a POD in 1912, they all of a sudden become evil? No comment.

Scenario Two is just as goofy. Theres no way in hell the Bolsheviks would declare war on the US for harboring the Russian royal Family. The Bolsheviks could not even have invaded the US in any way just after winning the Civil War. There not idiots. Plus the Canadians gave them access through British Columbia? No way in hell that would happen either.

Scenario Three is the most comical because of how plain goofy it is. :p The Titanic crashes into the Statue of Liberty because Captain Smith had one too many. That sounds like something out of some mediocre comedy sketch. What would have happens to the Titanic if it crashed into the Statue anyway? Would there really have been that much damage? Not sure about that either way to be honest.
 
On the Alternate History Wikia:

http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/An_Independent_in_2000

In which a guy literally is found out of no where, and goes on to win the 2000 presidential election as an independent, and makes the US into a liberal paradise with energy independence, and space colonies, ending the Israel-Palestine dispute, brings democracy to Afghanistan and Iraq, and passes the following amendments to the US Constitution:

  • Amendment 28: Creates a balanced budget, but ensures deficit spending during a time of economic crisis.
  • Amendment 29: Freedom of Marriage Amendment; Outlaws discrimination against gay and transexual couples from engaging in Civil Unions.
  • Amendment 30: Right to Choose Amendment: Allows women the right to have an abortion within their doctor's discretion.
  • Amendment 31: Establishes the US Jobs Corps that requires that ever person who wants a job is given employment.
  • Amendment 32: Establishes a national minimum wage as a constitutional right, as well as overtime benefits and the 40 hour work week.
  • Amendment 33: Placed much more strict regulations on unfair business practices from domestic and foreign corporations.
  • Amendment 34: Establishes a right to a home.
  • Amendment 35: Social Security and Single Payer, Universal Healthcare are a right of birth for every citizen. Private insurance can be added onto the existing basic coverage.
  • Amendment 36: Free and Universal Education up to the first four years of college are a right of birth for every citizen.
  • Amendment 37: Abolishes the Electoral College
  • Amendment 38: Abolishes 16th Amendment. (No income tax.)
  • Amendment 39: Increases security, puts policemen, and makes workers give people a limited amount of alcohol in all nightclubs in the US.

Things become so good, every single country in all of North America voluntarily joins the United States. The existing US states are then merged and/or split to become equal.
USAi.PNG

Despite having so many third-world countries join, the US (now under the inevitable presidency of Barack Obama, the successor to independent Charles M. Edwards) still manages to have

  • Overall Health: 1st
  • Infant Mortality: 2nd
  • Freedom of the Press: 1st
  • Literacy: 4th
 

Oh, I remember that one. :rolleyes:

Basically a number of people went and tried to give the author some constructive criticism who, if I remember correctly, reacted quite poorly. Eventually the administrators came in and told the others to let the author have his fun, despite any ASB elements that might be included.
 
You forgot Japan and Southeast Asia.

That was intended less as serious alternate history and more as satire of race relations. It was blatantly ASB, and your point still stands, but I kind of enjoyed that film anyway, as anvilicious as it was.

Tv tropes, woop woop!(sorry) On a more seriuse note, Fatherland by robert harris, although intertaining, dissapointed me as is showed a german empire that had conqured most of its possasble and real allys, eg: Spain. Hell, a nazy victory at all is, in my opinion is asb
 
^ In Fatherland Germany didn't conquer Spain. Its a puppet state that fell into their sphere of influence after they won WWII.

I never read it, but I've heard it was a pretty damn good. :cool: The POD seems plausible as well, even if a bit of a stretch.
 
From my personal Masterwork Archives... :p :eek: OK, OK, that one was meant to be silly and ludicrous... ;)


Dishonourable AH.com mentions :

Enoch's National Front by cumbria - A British cryptofascist's fantasy...

Thatcher's Last Stand
by cumbria - Not as bad, but I think even Maggie (RIP) would find some of the tone and implications really distasteful. Also, even in this, the author does more Powell pushing, though this time a bit more under-the-radar. Enoch must have been cumbria's darling... Frankly, I think even he would be embarassed by how cumbria had portrayed him in both timelines.

Lado Kingdom in Africa by Lado - What is this, I don't even... :eek:

Modern Poland has already been mentioned, so that duty is off my shoulders. :D


AH Wikia mentions :

Aztec Empire - feels like a more South American flavoured knockoff of TL-191, just far more amateurish and butterfly-killing and not concerned with any details or nice twists whatsoever

Vegetarian World - I admire the idealism and originality, but on a level of everyday realism, it's borderline complete nonsence


Books ?

Most things by Conroy suck. I don't think Stirling's Draka series or Anderson's Destroyermen are well-written or have enough literary merit. Some of Harry's AH novels, including several of his standalones, have significant logical problems (and no, I don't even mind parallelism-whoring, as long as it's at least creative - but he has bigger problems than that). Many AH novels by European authors are also not anything to write home about...
 
Last edited:
Another stinker from the AH Wikia :

http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Category:World_of_the_Rising_Sun

http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Differences_from_OTL_%28World_of_the_Rising_Sun%29

Rather hilariously, my homeland seems to have a large role in the backstory :

http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Kingdom_of_Slovakia_(World_of_the_Rising_Sun)
http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Republic_of_Argentina_(World_of_the_Rising_Sun)

But I detest it, since it's nothing but illogical dribble. This is bigger butterfly murder than Patton fighting Roman tanks...

Anyone remember this thread?......:eek:

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=204390&highlight=label

Even more shocking is that these books are a freakin series. No joke.

Yeah, I've read posbi's review of that multiple times. Classic. :D
 
Tv tropes, woop woop!(sorry) On a more seriuse note, Fatherland by robert harris, although intertaining, dissapointed me as is showed a german empire that had conqured most of its possasble and real allys, eg: Spain. Hell, a nazy victory at all is, in my opinion is asb

^ In Fatherland Germany didn't conquer Spain. Its a puppet state that fell into their sphere of influence after they won WWII.

I never read it, but I've heard it was a pretty damn good. :cool: The POD seems plausible as well, even if a bit of a stretch.

Yeah, Fatherland basically takes the most plausible (though still highly implausible PoD) of some better decisions taken around Stalingrad which means that the Nazis still have an army in the south the fight on through 1943 on the offensive. In any case, what's far more important is the way how it's one of the few books to get something close to an accurate portrayal of what a post-victory Nazi germany would be like for the German people.

And yeah, Spain and Portugal are part of what can basically be defined as a 'German dominated Nazi EEC'
 
I found this timeline by the same person who made the "RFK & JFK survived" one and this is also stupid. If anything, he might made this because he's a fan of them but when it comes to this...

Nov 2024(Future): Jedward wins the Presidential Election and Defaets Jon Huntsman Jr and Became First Twin Elected President of USA

...Yeah, these two running for office is as unlikely as Paris Hilton doing the same thing (if there's a timeline for that, of course but hopefully there isn't).
 
Speaking of Alternate History wiki, I have never before seen an alternate history this bad, biased and overall stupid in my life.

This is bad

Yep. This is very stupid idea. USA not be anything banana state. This is impossible in stabil democracy. Any institution can't accept that kind.
 
Top