Sorry, but I agree, war with Italy sounds unrealistic to me. Maček and his leadership would be rounded up and shot by local german garrison within hours. Also, Italians would most definitely used Ustasha as a pressure against Maček, similar to Arrow Cross Party in Hungary or Iron Guard in Romania.

Not saying that they can't go to war with Italy, but NOT YET. You see, Croatia must talk with Italians, try everything to appear that they want peace and cooperation with Italy ( and Axis in general ), but Italian greed for purely Croatian territory makes that impossible. Also, it's much better to refuse Italian proposals in June, then offer them some own proposal ( after all, we haven't seen any Croatian proposal as of yet ), and then, when Italians refuse our proposal and start to occupying what they want, then you can fight against them.

Military isn't ready and it won't be ready in June or July too, but a month or two can mean a lot of difference. Especially once Barbarossa starts and eyes of Germany are on East.
 
Giving the Serbs the Interior Ministry is not going to go over well with the people, you know. It will seem like people are finally free of the Žandars only to have Maček re-instate them.

Anti-Serb sentiment did not come with Pavelić from Italy, it brewed during the tyranny of the Kingdom.
 
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Giving the Serbs the Interior Ministry is not going to go over well with the people, you know. It will seem like people are finally free of the Žandars only to have Maček re-instate them.

Anti-Serb sentiment did not come with Pavelić from Italy, it brewed during the tyranny of the Kingdom.

Better to have that than rebellion of the Serbs in Croatia. Also, that was some sort of tradition, especially during A-H.
 
Thanks a lot for your support, man! I am very happy to see people liking what they read here.

The stuff with Italy will all be revealed in a very short time, and I will try my best to write those upcoming chapters as best as I can.

The idea with the Republic doesn't seem that farfetched to me, since (to my knowledge) Tiso's Slovakia was called Slovenská republika (Slovak Republic) as well as Slovenský štát (Slovak State).

About the election stuff - I still believe they would have to be held, because the 1938 parliamentary election was notoriously unfair, with Stojadinović's JRZ winning 306 seats (out of 373) with only 54.1% of the vote (!!), so I think it would be in Maček's best interests to win a sizable majority in the new elections that he arranged.
I really don't think that the word Republic was that offensive at the time. Disliked maybe, but I still think the Axis leadership wouldn't think much of it, since Slovaks have already shown that it isn't much of an issue.

Absolute Serbian domination is to be expected, they have supported the Chetniks until December 1943 after all, and all Prime Ministers were Serbs until Šubašić in July 1944.
I don't think having Krnjević sent to Britain is such a good idea, like other people have said somewhere on Pages 1 and 2, if an HSS member was sent there then it would ruin Maček's legitimacy and he would be considered a Yugoslav revivalist.

I will try and cover the diaspora stuff in the following chapters, I have found a few good opportunities to throw them in.



Your guess is as good as mine. I found a few links mentioning that, but I haven't really found that many reasons that justify it.
Indeed Slovakia by constitution of 1939 was Republic. Slovak state was to my knowladge not official name but often used.
 
II.II | He's Walking Like A Dead Man - June 2, 1941
„Vladko Maček, you are under arrest for working against the German Reich as well as spreading dissenting activity outside the jurisdiction of the German Wehrmacht!“

Ambassador Kasche stared into the enraged Plenipotentiary General Horstenau's brown eyes. He calmly gave him a calculated reply.

„That will not happen.“

„What?! Get out of our w…“

„No. The Ban has done nothing, I repeat, nothing against the German government or its interests. In fact, he is doing exactly the opposite, by actively expanding the rights of Volksdeutschers and keeping them safe from rogue Yugoslav army groups still going around Slavonia. This is only a minor border dispute with Italy that will be solved shortly…“



„The German people of Croatia have been demanding their own autonomous administrative unit for some time now. Are you willing to fulfill their wishes?“

Maček couldn't help but take another swig of his drink he held in his shaking hands. He disliked the liquid vehemently, but the painful sensation he felt in his throat helped him cope with the stressful quagmire he inadvertently pushed his country into. Siegfried Kasche, the man Maček would declare a deplorable human being in any other circumstance, was now his most valuable ally who saved him from certain doom. Who knows what would have happened had he not been in the office when Horstenau and his goons arrived to arrest him.

But now he was given a deadline, and if he does not finish this soon, then even Kasche will not be able to save him.

It has been a day since the exchange between the two men, and Maček felt his decision to answer Kasche's question affirmatively was a reasonable one. But the fact he already sold so much of his own homeland away to his only ally Germany wasn't going to go over well with the public, especially if he survives the war with Italy. I can only imagine what a treaty with our enemy is going to be like… Maček thought cynically.

He had every right to be skeptical of his chances of making it through this ordeal. Štancer's Home Guardsmen were bogged down on Velebit and taking heavy casualties, while Laxa slowly trudged through the fields of southern Dalmatia toward Makarska. On a more positive note, Colonel Franjo Šimić still held onto Knin and the surrounding countryside without any retaliation by Italian forces, but it still meant that only one out of three intended military operations ended in time.

13:45, Italian Army Headquarters exterior, Zara, Kingdom of Italy

General Vittorio Ambrosio took in the relaxing sunshine and ever-constant chirping of crickets, smiling as his straight shoulders dropped a little. He patiently waited while looking at the peaceful environment surrounding his calm figure. The conversation he held with Mario Roatta the night before yielded fruitful results regarding the Slavic insurrection in the east. Solutions brought to the table by the military duo are going to, Ambrosio hoped, bring a quick end to the rogue state and extend Italian influence all the way to the Drina and Belgrade.

„…After all, decapitating a snake not only makes the rest of its body wither away but also gives other members of the food chain an opportunity to step in and take over.“

Ambrosio chuckled at Roatta's comparison, as if hearing an amusing anecdote during family dinner.

The general, still smiling, asked one of his assistants, who was close to him.

„Are our brave pilots on their way?“

14:03, Zagreb, Republic of Croatia

Ringing.

All he could hear was ringing. He felt completely deaf to the world. He could hear nothing but the insanely loud sound emanating from seemingly everywhere around him after the explosions. Ban Maček could not comprehend what just happened. His sight was blurry as he stumbled out of the broken door of his ruined office. The hall looked like it had seen better days. Debris was everywhere, anything from pieces of rocks and wood to metal shards from the chandelier that used to be above him. Small flames could be found scattered on the old dusty carpet, unable to engulf the piece of cloth completely. Far off in the distance were crumbled remains of a wall.

He staggered awkwardly toward the broken construction, beginning to slowly hear more sounds in the distance as he progressed. They weren't pleasant in any way, though. His ears have tried to adjust to the new sounds, but they were still distant. He could hear weeping and screaming coming far from him, most likely outside of the building. Warning sirens cried somewhere far away. His vision was still unclear, and he felt like he had to keep going, because his strength was draining with each passing second.

With each step taken, he felt his legs becoming shakier and shakier. He started coughing badly due to the unpleasant grey smoke that started filling the interior of Banski dvori. Trying to rip his black coat off his body, afraid of burning on the inside from high temperatures, he tripped and almost fell over but he kept going forward. He passed the corner and noticed bloody finger trails on the wall.

His hand lightly touched the crimson-colored wall, with some of the iron fluid remaining on his fingers, indicating it is still fresh. He couldn't worry about any of that now, he had to get out of the building if he wanted to live.

In the distance he saw more ruins. And more blood. He followed the trail of cruor on the floor that led him to the debris he noticed before, but as he approached the fallen wall he saw something that made him gasp in surprise.

He found the body of one of his most trusted colleagues, the man he depended on for years. Someone who has committed himself to the HSS and Croatia completely. He was crushed under the fallen debris, his head in a pool of blood with more oozing out of his neck with each passing minute. The man's left hand was extended toward Maček's direction, as if inviting him to take it.

His heart broke in two.

No, not you… Anyone but you…

Those were Vladko Maček's final thoughts before he collapsed to the floor with a heavy thud.

upload_2018-1-11_21-6-28.png


*****
Infobox stuff: The photo depicting TTL bombing was actually taken on October 7 1991 and showed the consequences of a Yugoslav Air Force strike on the same building, with the goal of killing Franjo Tuđman (first democratically elected President of Croatia) and demoralizing the Croatian rebels. This action proved unsuccessful in the end, and Croatia officially declared its independence the following day.
 
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I allready stated my opinion that this seems as far too uncompatibile with Maček's personality ( he was careful man, allmost a pacifist ). He wasn't someone that would push his people in a war he knows that he will loose, at least not lightly.
 
That 4 millions won't rebell against you. Milion and half could very easily, and you don't need that, not now, at least.

Those four million also won't just meekly accept a continuation of Yugoslav power dynamics in what is supposed to be their own country.

And besides, Serbs have already rebelled. Chetniks roam around freely in the south, and I don't have much confidence in a Serb interior minister being so willing to persecute Serbs, especially if, as the counterargument goes, the Serbs will rebel as soon as they don't hold the reins of power.
 
Giving the Serbs the Interior Ministry is not going to go over well with the people, you know. It will seem like people are finally free of the Žandars only to have Maček re-instate them.

Anti-Serb sentiment did not come with Pavelić from Italy, it brewed during the tyranny of the Kingdom.

I really don't think that there would be any kind of backlash because of that. I mean, the SDS was in coalition with the Croatian Peasant Party since 1927, and this sort of alliance brought far more pros than cons. The only people that will complain would be members of Ustaše (Mile Budak, Jozo Dumandžić, etc.) and people who support them, and numbers are really going in Maček's favor regarding overall support.
 
I really don't think that there would be any kind of backlash because of that. I mean, the SDS was in coalition with the Croatian Peasant Party since 1927, and this sort of alliance brought far more pros than cons. The only people that will complain would be members of Ustaše (Mile Budak, Jozo Dumandžić, etc.) and people who support them, and numbers are really going in Maček's favor regarding overall support.

There`s a world of difference between being in a coalition in Yugoslavia and giving them such an important ministry in an independent Croatia.

And you must have a really rose-tinted view of Croat-Serb relations in 1941. to think that solidifying Serb dominance over the police and law enforcement in a Croatian state would bother only Ustaše types.
 
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There`s a world of difference between being in a coalition in Yugoslavia and giving them such an important ministry in an independent Croatia.

And you must have a really rose-tinted view of Croat-Serb relations in 1941. to think that solidifying Serb dominance over the police and law enforcement in a Croatian state would bother only Ustaše types.

The fact is, the Serbs are about 1/4 of citizens of this Croatia. So, what to do with them? Here, ITTL, the answer is, they are citizens of Croatia like any else. So, they need to be represented. That means in Cabinet too. And not just any ministerial post or something not important.

Also, I'm not so sure that Chetniks are anywhere near of their original strength...
 
The fact is, the Serbs are about 1/4 of citizens of this Croatia. So, what to do with them? Here, ITTL, the answer is, they are citizens of Croatia like any else. So, they need to be represented. That means in Cabinet too. And not just any ministerial post or something not important.

Going by the numbers, more like 1/5. And even so why does that mean they even need to be in the Cabinet, let alone get anything important? These things do not naturally follow. Croats were a significant part of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia's population, and yet got fuck all in terms of power during its entire length.

Why does this supposedly independant Croatia need to bend over backward to appease them? Is Maček trying to enter the EU or something?

Also, I'm not so sure that Chetniks are anywhere near of their original strength...

They still exist. They're massacring Croat villages even ITTL. And frankly, I don't have a lot of confidence that a Serb interior minister would be so eager to take action against them.
 
Going by the numbers, more like 1/5. And even so why does that mean they even need to be in the Cabinet, let alone get anything important? These things do not naturally follow. Croats were a significant part of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia's population, and yet got fuck all in terms of power during its entire length.

Why does this supposedly independant Croatia need to bend over backward to appease them? Is Maček trying to enter the EU or something?

I agree, honestly I get why he want tem in the government, but honestly I don't see why he would let them get significant power. The Serbs can choose between a Zagreb or Berlin, and a Zagreb which are willing to let them join the government and accept them as citizens of Croatia as Serbs, would be something any sane Serbian politician would gladly embrace.
 
Going by the numbers, more like 1/5. And even so why does that mean they even need to be in the Cabinet, let alone get anything important? These things do not naturally follow. Croats were a significant part of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia's population, and yet got fuck all in terms of power during its entire length.

Why does this supposedly independant Croatia need to bend over backward to appease them? Is Maček trying to enter the EU or something?



They still exist. They're massacring Croat villages even ITTL. And frankly, I don't have a lot of confidence that a Serb interior minister would be so eager to take action against them.

Because Croatia don't need 1,5 million of chetniks now with all the problems with Italians, hungarians, soon Communists etc.
Also, even during Kingdom SHS/Yugoslavia, every Government of Yugoslavia had at least a few Croats. True, they were mostly Croats that were more Serbs than real Serbs, but they were from Croatia. You can't give Serbs in Croatia any less. Also, during Austria-Hungary Serbs traditionally had position of Interior Minister in Croatia.

Why do you think that: a) Police will not do the best they can even if minister isn't eager? and b) Military will have far greater role in fght against Chetniks than police anyway. On the other hand, a Serb in position of Minister of Interior, allmost guarantees the loyal Serbs of their lives and freedom, and that's a lot. Also, as Pribićević said, Interior Ministry is the most important government post in Balkan countries, and having a Serb as minister makes sure that police will not be abused for internal politics in Croatia.
 
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A question for JS: Will Maček try to organise Croatian Orthodox Church? I'm sure that his partners from SDS will get a fit if he mentions that...
 
Because Croatia don't need 1,5 million of chetniks now with all the problems with Italians, hungarians, soon Communists etc.

So your argument is that the Serbs are so unruly that as soon as they lose the reins of power they start a rebellion?

, even during Kingdom SHS/Yugoslavia, every Government of Yugoslavia had at least a few Croats.

With irrelevant positions. Which is the point.

, they were mostly Croats that were more Serbs than real Serbs, but they were from Croatia. You can't give Serbs in Croatia any less

Why not?



Also, during Austria-Hungary Serbs traditionally had position of Interior Minister in Croatia.

Croatia also had an Austrian Emperor during the Monarchy. Should he be brought back too?

Why do you think that: a) Police will not do the best they can even if minister isn't eager?

Because he will stack the police forces with Serbs, many of which will habe Chetnik sympathies. This happened IOTL.

b) Military will have far greater role in fght against Chetniks than police anyway.

Granted, but that doesn't diminish the effect of having a Serb-dominated law enforcement branch on supressing Chetniks.


the other hand, a Serb in position of Minister of Interior, allmost guarantees the loyal Serbs of their lives and freedom, and that's a lot.

So a HSS interior minister wouldn't?

Pribićević said, Interior Ministry is the most important government post in Balkan countries, and having a Serb as minister makes sure that police will not be abused for internal politics in Croatia.

How does having a Serb as interior minister make sure that police wont be used for internal politics? It only makes sure the police are used for internal politics that favour Serbs.
 
So your argument is that the Serbs are so unruly that as soon as they lose the reins of power they start a rebellion?



With irrelevant positions. Which is the point.



Why not?





Croatia also had an Austrian Emperor during the Monarchy. Should he be brought back too?



Because he will stack the police forces with Serbs, many of which will habe Chetnik sympathies. This happened IOTL.



Granted, but that doesn't diminish the effect of having a Serb-dominated law enforcement branch on supressing Chetniks.




So a HSS interior minister wouldn't?



How does having a Serb as interior minister make sure that police wont be used for internal politics? It only makes sure the police are used for internal politics that favour Serbs.


Basicly yes. And really, anybody else would rebell if you make him a second-class citizen.

Yes, and did you see what happened with Yugoslavia when first stronger wind blowed?

Because then you legitimise evereything that Serbs have made in Yugoslavia as normal and good.

No.

He don't needs to do that. There's allready a lot of Serbs in police. Better to keep them in, than out.
Also, you have to be aware that Police is just in the cities. Oružništvo is in villages and that's 95% of national territory, and Oružništvo is part of the Domobranstvo. At least in regards to manning and personell issues they are under military.

See above.

No, at least not in their eyes.

A lot, at least various factions of HSS or ustashe simpathizers will not be able to use it in their conflicts.
 
In order to counter the sweeping generalisations happening (which admittedly would in tense times), keep in mind a couple of things.

Adam Pribićević was an active member of the Croat-Serb coalition in Austria-Hungary and in the opposition to King Alexander's dictatorship. I'm fairly certain that he would be seen as trustworthy in the position.

Having him or a member of his party would also make the republic more trustworthy in the eyes of the Serbs, likely lowering membership in anti-croatian chetnik groups (that and no Ustaše helps a lot on that front).
 
Basicly yes. And really, anybody else would rebell if you make him a second-class citizen.

Not having ministers makes you a second class citizen, eh? So do you believe that SDP voters are currently second-class citizens in Croatia?

And really, if not having an Interior Minister is the reason Serbs will rebel, they will rebel for literally anything.

Yes, and did you see what happened with Yugoslavia when first stronger wind blowed?

"Stronger wind" as in the Wehrmacht?

How would having an ultra-loyal Serb population help in a war against any of Croatia`s massively stronger neighbours in 1941.? Unless you think it would help against Serbia, and if you think the local Serbs would be more loyal to Croatia than Serbia, then I have a bridge on the Sava to sell you.

Because then you legitimise evereything that Serbs have made in Yugoslavia as normal and good.

Great, so giving up institutional power is all right as long as you get to have a round of moral grandstanding.

*sigh*

It`s no wonder it took us 900 years to gain independence...

He don't needs to do that. There's allready a lot of Serbs in police. Better to keep them in, than out.

Yes, better to have all those guys who terrorized Croats during Yugoslavia keep their jobs. That sure won`t make anyone except Ustaša types angry, eh?

Also, you have to be aware that Police is just in the cities. Oružništvo is in villages and that's 95% of national territory, and Oružništvo is part of the Domobranstvo. At least in regards to manning and personell issues they are under military.

So the Interior Ministry is Schrödinger`s ministry then? At the same time as you put it the "most important government post" and toothless?

No, at least not in their eyes.

So why not give them a Serb Ban to make extra sure the loyal Serbs have guarantees on their lives and freedom.:rolleyes:

A lot, at least various factions of HSS or ustashe simpathizers will not be able to use it in their conflicts.

Except the Serbs will be able to use it now. Again, how is it any better?
 
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