The Pink Map was Accepted?

Lusitania

Donor
If the question is if Great Britain will let Portugal keep the land between Portuguese East Africa and Portuguese West Africa with everything in the same circumstances the answer is no.

But if you change a few things, If Portugual Pedro V dies not die in 1861 the country could of had a chance of developing and becoming a stronger country which could of resulted in it receiving the lands in the scramble for Africa.

The other aspect is on the British side you need someone else in charge of British government.

Else you can avoid the whole thing and just follow my TL then there will be no pink map, it was always green.
 
If the question is if Great Britain will let Portugal keep the land between Portuguese East Africa and Portuguese West Africa with everything in the same circumstances the answer is no.

But if you change a few things, If Portugual Pedro V dies not die in 1861 the country could of had a chance of developing and becoming a stronger country which could of resulted in it receiving the lands in the scramble for Africa.

The other aspect is on the British side you need someone else in charge of British government.

Else you can avoid the whole thing and just follow my TL then there will be no pink map, it was always green.

Do you have me on ignore? You just said exactly the same thing I said last page.
 

Lusitania

Donor
Do you have me on ignore? You just said exactly the same thing I said last page.

Really??? Must of been written in code. Sorry but I did see about if this or that but if the question is what has to happen to Portugal then the only thing is to change Portugal make it more capable of standing up to bullies like UK.
 
Really??? Must of been written in code. Sorry but I did see about if this or that but if the question is what has to happen to Portugal then the only thing is to change Portugal make it more capable of standing up to bullies like UK.

I'm not sure why Salisbury didn't take advantage of the situation to acquire Delagoa Bay, which was a couple of years later considered a place to get "at all costs". I don't think he needed to give up the whole Pink Map territory - just enough for a connector. He had shown in the past that he didn't really give a fig about Cape to Cairo - he never made more than rote gestures in its favor to please people like Rhodes.

He simply had contempt for Portugal, whereas someone else might not have. Portuguese administration might not have been super-impressive, but I don't see why it was worse than anyone else's. The perception was just based on Victorian prejudices.

So in short, I think there are any number of PODs that could give Portugal at least the substance of the Pink Map, which was to connect East & West.

I wonder what would have happened had Portugal responded with "Bring it!" Was Britain really going to use force against Portugal over Zambia? I just don't see it. The consequences of treating an ally like that would have to be problematic.
 
I don't think he needed to give up the whole Pink Map territory - just enough for a connector. .

That was pretty much what the Portuguese thought they would get too. After the "British ultimatum" in 1890 there were declarations of members of the Portuguese government claiming that the Pink Map was never intended to be fully claimed, but instead it was supposed to be used as a base of negotiation. The Portuguese would accept to give Matabeleland to Britain, but they wanted the area in the South of Lake Niassa and the highlands of Manica, both to ensure the possibility of connection Mozambique and Angola through this corridor as also to secure to Portugal most of the navigable area of Zambeze River.
 
That was pretty much what the Portuguese thought they would get too. After the "British ultimatum" in 1890 there were declarations of members of the Portuguese government claiming that the Pink Map was never intended to be fully claimed, but instead it was supposed to be used as a base of negotiation. The Portuguese would accept to give Matabeleland to Britain, but they wanted the area in the South of Lake Niassa and the highlands of Manica, both to ensure the possibility of connection Mozambique and Angola through this corridor as also to secure to Portugal most of the navigable area of Zambeze River.

In my TL, that's what I gave them - the Shire Valley (the south half of Malawi), plus about half of Northern Rhodesia. In exchange, Delagoa Bay for which the British pay something - maybe BP 1M or so. I'm not sure why this wasn't done in OTL - I really think it's because Salisbury was a dick and just thought those silly Latins were too buffoonish to talk to. A big mistake, since he could have gotten Delagoa, controlled the Boers, and avoided the later war.
 
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