Just wondering, no offense intended but is English your first language?
The Legacy of Saint Brendan: A History of the Western Hemisphere, 512 to 1400
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The Persian part sounds very likely given the region’s fragmentation before the rise of the Ismailis. If they did overrun Persia completely I could see it becoming totally Arabic unlike IOTL. As for India, it’s just a Hindu Kush away...
I think he mentioned Khorasan would likely stay Zoroastrian for the foreseeable future
Chapter Three, Part Four: The Advent of the Britons
Chapter Three, Part Four: The Advent of the Britons, 880-882
From The Owainid
“And thus fell the Lion, Cadog, the great hope of all Britain [1], at the hands of the Beast of Bernicia. The death of the Lion placed all of Britain in a feeling of great anxiety, for they feared that the sword of the Saxon would fall upon them now. The eldest sons of Cadog despaired, for they feared that soon they would follow their father into the grave, their lands and patrimony passing to the Saxon.
“But Owain, the third son of the Lion, did not despair.
“’My brothers,’ he said, addressing the other four by night, ‘I have seen a land where we would need not fear the sword of the Saxon, a land where we and our people could live out our days in peace and plenty and enjoy the blessings of God. I speak of the land wherein dwell the Wanderers of the Goodheylon [2] and the Helhti [3]. I have visited this land, and I know that it is desirous and choice.
“But the elder brothers of Owain grew angry.
“’If you had stayed in our land instead of going over the sea, our Father would not have mourned you, and he would not have been weakened in heart. We would still have our crown secure upon our heads.
“But the younger brothers of Owain harkened to his words.
“’We will travel with you to the West. It is God’s Mighty Hand working upon you that caused you to travel there, to find a place where we could flee.
“And Owain’s elder brothers went away, and were captured some days later by the Beast of Bernicia and torn by his dogs. [4] But Owain and his younger brothers gathered their people, and counted them by Captains [5].
“Bely and his, 1000 persons.
“Duwnwal and his, 2000 persons.
“Gwaskolomm and his, 1500 persons.
“Redherch and his, 3000 persons.
“Toudir, the younger brother of Owain, and his, 4000 persons.
“Arthal, the youngest brother of Owain, and his, 3000 persons.
“Owain and his, 6000 persons.
“Thus, all the souls departing with Owain were twenty-thousand and five-hundred persons. [6]
“And Owain and his people sailed across the sea, to the land of the Goodheylon, and searched for passage.
“And the sailors of the Goodheylon laughed at Owain and his brothers and their company, and said that there would be no berth for them all on their ships. For they were a tremendous host, and they would surely sink the ships if they got on them.
“And Owain and his brothers talked, one with another, and they agreed to use the last of their father’s treasury, which they had carried from his halls, to seek to purchase vessels and sailors.
“And when Gold was discussed, the sailors of the Goodheylon became more willing to allow Owain and his brothers and their company to embark on their vessels. All the vessels of Iwerdhon were gathered to ensure that the voyage could succeed. [7]
“And so Owain and his brothers and their company loaded the vessels with their war-gear, their helms, their coats of mail, their horses, and their provender [8]. And they departed, one year after the realm of the Lion had fallen.
“As they voyaged across the sea, they saw many great signs and wonders, sent by God to speed them on their way...
“And after all these, they arrived in the West, on the Ynys Gybi [9]. There, Owain was joyous for one of his friends, the monk Kolomm [10], had become the Bishop of all the land. Colom welcomed them to the Ynys Gybi with open arms, and a great feast was held to honor the Britons.
“Shortly after the feast, Kolomm approached Owain and spoke with him with a grave look on his face.
“’Owain, dear Prince of Britain, you are a man mighty in both word and deed. I come to you to ask you of a boon, which I would not ask of any other unless they were as daring as you.’
“’Speak, friend Kolomm.’
“’I ask for your aid, my Prince, in helping to secure this land. As you know, my great predecessor, Brendan, sailed to this land and built this monastery with his bare hands, with only the angels and a few sainted companions to assist him. You know that they did a great work among the Croeni [11] and brought them to the Faith of Christ Jesus.
“’You know also that Brendan’s Holy Work was hindered by the Kings of the Goodheylon, who sent their men, the Wanderers, to take the wealth of this land to line their treasuries with fine things. These same Wanderers ravaged the daughters of the Croeni and turned them into harlots, and from thence sprung the Helhti, who are easily led by the designs of the Wanderers.
“’Now the children of these Wanderers and the Helhti that they have corrupted live upon the fat of the land, dwelling in Arthtir [12] and refusing to recognize the authority of the Holy Faith. For my predecessors were granted the rule over all the lands in the West, for to bring the inhabitants thereon to the Church and to help them praise the Glory of God.
“’We monks are not warriors, and those that are loyal to us are not either. I therefore ask you, Owain, to be my Gorfodi [13], to gather your Captains and warbands, and help bring the Wanderers back to the Authority of the Church. If you do so, God will reward you and your children with glory and riches.
“And Owain knelt before Kolomm, and kissed his hand, and declared that he would do this thing.”
[1] - Cadog was the ruler over a large portion of Northwestern Britain, and some contemporary British chroniclers held him as the “hope of all Britons”, but more in a metaphorical sense, as a man who they should aspire to be.
[2] - Cumbraek for “Gaels”. “Wanderers of the Goodheylon” refers to the Fanaithe. (Author’s Note: I’m using someones reconstruction of Cumbric for this part. It seems kind of sketchy, but I like the sound and look of it.)
[3] - Cumbraek for “Split”, referring to the Measctha. Split in this context meant they had split heritage.
[4] - An invention of the author, really. The elder brothers of Owain ended up fleeing to Pictland, where they and the vast majority of those fleeing the fall of their father’s kingdom traveled to. Of course, this was not fully known in the West when this was written.
[5] - “Counted them by Captains” is a good indication that these were not civilians being brought to the New World; these were fighting men. There would have been no space on the ships Owain would have utilized to take large bands of men, women, and children.
[6] - Like all chronicles of the time, the Owainid exaggerates numbers. In all likelihood, it was closer to around two-hundred or two-hundred and fifty men.
[7] - While likely a slight exaggeration, it is true that fewer and fewer sailors were risking the voyage to the New World, so perhaps they did get the services of many of the remaining men brave enough to risk the trip.
[8] - It sounds much more like a supply list for an army going on campaign than a band of refugees.
[9] - The Holy Island, or the “Insula Benedicta”.
[10] - Columb
[11] - The “Skin People”
[12] - Bear Land
[13] - Enforcer; this would later become a title in the West.
From The Owainid
“And thus fell the Lion, Cadog, the great hope of all Britain [1], at the hands of the Beast of Bernicia. The death of the Lion placed all of Britain in a feeling of great anxiety, for they feared that the sword of the Saxon would fall upon them now. The eldest sons of Cadog despaired, for they feared that soon they would follow their father into the grave, their lands and patrimony passing to the Saxon.
“But Owain, the third son of the Lion, did not despair.
“’My brothers,’ he said, addressing the other four by night, ‘I have seen a land where we would need not fear the sword of the Saxon, a land where we and our people could live out our days in peace and plenty and enjoy the blessings of God. I speak of the land wherein dwell the Wanderers of the Goodheylon [2] and the Helhti [3]. I have visited this land, and I know that it is desirous and choice.
“But the elder brothers of Owain grew angry.
“’If you had stayed in our land instead of going over the sea, our Father would not have mourned you, and he would not have been weakened in heart. We would still have our crown secure upon our heads.
“But the younger brothers of Owain harkened to his words.
“’We will travel with you to the West. It is God’s Mighty Hand working upon you that caused you to travel there, to find a place where we could flee.
“And Owain’s elder brothers went away, and were captured some days later by the Beast of Bernicia and torn by his dogs. [4] But Owain and his younger brothers gathered their people, and counted them by Captains [5].
“Bely and his, 1000 persons.
“Duwnwal and his, 2000 persons.
“Gwaskolomm and his, 1500 persons.
“Redherch and his, 3000 persons.
“Toudir, the younger brother of Owain, and his, 4000 persons.
“Arthal, the youngest brother of Owain, and his, 3000 persons.
“Owain and his, 6000 persons.
“Thus, all the souls departing with Owain were twenty-thousand and five-hundred persons. [6]
“And Owain and his people sailed across the sea, to the land of the Goodheylon, and searched for passage.
“And the sailors of the Goodheylon laughed at Owain and his brothers and their company, and said that there would be no berth for them all on their ships. For they were a tremendous host, and they would surely sink the ships if they got on them.
“And Owain and his brothers talked, one with another, and they agreed to use the last of their father’s treasury, which they had carried from his halls, to seek to purchase vessels and sailors.
“And when Gold was discussed, the sailors of the Goodheylon became more willing to allow Owain and his brothers and their company to embark on their vessels. All the vessels of Iwerdhon were gathered to ensure that the voyage could succeed. [7]
“And so Owain and his brothers and their company loaded the vessels with their war-gear, their helms, their coats of mail, their horses, and their provender [8]. And they departed, one year after the realm of the Lion had fallen.
“As they voyaged across the sea, they saw many great signs and wonders, sent by God to speed them on their way...
“And after all these, they arrived in the West, on the Ynys Gybi [9]. There, Owain was joyous for one of his friends, the monk Kolomm [10], had become the Bishop of all the land. Colom welcomed them to the Ynys Gybi with open arms, and a great feast was held to honor the Britons.
“Shortly after the feast, Kolomm approached Owain and spoke with him with a grave look on his face.
“’Owain, dear Prince of Britain, you are a man mighty in both word and deed. I come to you to ask you of a boon, which I would not ask of any other unless they were as daring as you.’
“’Speak, friend Kolomm.’
“’I ask for your aid, my Prince, in helping to secure this land. As you know, my great predecessor, Brendan, sailed to this land and built this monastery with his bare hands, with only the angels and a few sainted companions to assist him. You know that they did a great work among the Croeni [11] and brought them to the Faith of Christ Jesus.
“’You know also that Brendan’s Holy Work was hindered by the Kings of the Goodheylon, who sent their men, the Wanderers, to take the wealth of this land to line their treasuries with fine things. These same Wanderers ravaged the daughters of the Croeni and turned them into harlots, and from thence sprung the Helhti, who are easily led by the designs of the Wanderers.
“’Now the children of these Wanderers and the Helhti that they have corrupted live upon the fat of the land, dwelling in Arthtir [12] and refusing to recognize the authority of the Holy Faith. For my predecessors were granted the rule over all the lands in the West, for to bring the inhabitants thereon to the Church and to help them praise the Glory of God.
“’We monks are not warriors, and those that are loyal to us are not either. I therefore ask you, Owain, to be my Gorfodi [13], to gather your Captains and warbands, and help bring the Wanderers back to the Authority of the Church. If you do so, God will reward you and your children with glory and riches.
“And Owain knelt before Kolomm, and kissed his hand, and declared that he would do this thing.”
[1] - Cadog was the ruler over a large portion of Northwestern Britain, and some contemporary British chroniclers held him as the “hope of all Britons”, but more in a metaphorical sense, as a man who they should aspire to be.
[2] - Cumbraek for “Gaels”. “Wanderers of the Goodheylon” refers to the Fanaithe. (Author’s Note: I’m using someones reconstruction of Cumbric for this part. It seems kind of sketchy, but I like the sound and look of it.)
[3] - Cumbraek for “Split”, referring to the Measctha. Split in this context meant they had split heritage.
[4] - An invention of the author, really. The elder brothers of Owain ended up fleeing to Pictland, where they and the vast majority of those fleeing the fall of their father’s kingdom traveled to. Of course, this was not fully known in the West when this was written.
[5] - “Counted them by Captains” is a good indication that these were not civilians being brought to the New World; these were fighting men. There would have been no space on the ships Owain would have utilized to take large bands of men, women, and children.
[6] - Like all chronicles of the time, the Owainid exaggerates numbers. In all likelihood, it was closer to around two-hundred or two-hundred and fifty men.
[7] - While likely a slight exaggeration, it is true that fewer and fewer sailors were risking the voyage to the New World, so perhaps they did get the services of many of the remaining men brave enough to risk the trip.
[8] - It sounds much more like a supply list for an army going on campaign than a band of refugees.
[9] - The Holy Island, or the “Insula Benedicta”.
[10] - Columb
[11] - The “Skin People”
[12] - Bear Land
[13] - Enforcer; this would later become a title in the West.
Yes. Owain and brother would be Celtic Britons from what is today northern England/southern Scotland. The language they would speak would be in the Brythonic group (which today consists of Welsh, Cornish, and Breton) although it would probably register more as a dialect than a separate language in this period as there doesn't seem to have been much language barrier. In this period there wouldn't have been much cultural difference between northern England and Ireland and Owain and followers should probably be considered Celtic rather than Irish/Scottish/etc.
The Bernicia that displaced them was an Angle kingdom that in our history was largely responsible for the fracturing of Celtic culture into distinct Irish/Welsh/Scottish. (Bernicia later merged with Deira to become the Kingdom of Northumbria)
Roganvald can clarify if I'm wrong but (if my dates are right) it looks like there are butterflies creeping in and that the Celtic Britons held out a lot longer against the Angles than they did in our history.
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While I understand this, I was referencing that the new colony would be an alt-Brittany, set up by British Britons fleeing the 'Saxon Invasion'
Cumbric was a form of Brythonic and rather distinct from the Gaelic of Northern Ireland.
There wasn't a single "Celtic" culture at the time though. There was roughly a Gaelic one (that became Irish, Scottish, Manx) and a post Roman Brythonic one (that became Cumbric, Welsh, Cornish, Breton). The split between the two happened way before any Angles settled Britain.
That's a good summary of the situation, yes. Just spit-balling, it would be the difference between, say, the culture of Viking-era Norway and the Anglo-Saxons. There are certain cultural similarities, yes, and even a bit of a shared folklore. But, though the languages are related (to the point that people would have recognized them as similar) they were not fully comprehensible to one another.
To put it another way, if you took a 6th century Cumbrian and a Gael from Mumu and put them in the same room: they will recognize that their cultures and languages are related, and there might be a bit of cultural affinity for one another, especially when compared to how different both are from the Anglo-Saxons (and due to the influence of Irish monks throughout the region), but they certainly wouldn't have considered themselves part of the same 'group.'
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The footnotes established the opposite - It was warbands, civilians weren't brought over.