It creates huge problems for both NY and Massachusetts (MA claims western NY). NY refused to let Vermont join the US for quite some time, I can see NY refusing to let the Iroquois become a 14th state. This is an extremely hard question what happens next.Inspired by the Native American nations thread. What happens to the Iroquois and the Thirteen Colonies if both join forces against the British alongside the French and Spanish?
details may vary, but this is pretty much it in any outcome."Thanks for all the help, now give us your land."
Allying doesn't mean integrating into the United States though. Can't the Iroquois remain independent allies with their sovereignty respected?
If you check the map in my post above you'll see the Iroquois already claimed pretty much the entire Northwest Territory, so why would they give those lands only for Congress to give them a vague promise to some of them in return?The Iroquois have their lands sold by Congress and as recompense, are given some vague promise to some lands in the Northwest Territory. They move to this land and despite heavy resistance from the locals, manage to carve out a living in their new homeland as American citizens. The problem is that 20-30 years down the road, white settlers will encroach on their land and demand that they leave. Rinse and repeat.
That son in law is Alexander Hamilton.I think General Schuyler (the man who tried to negotiate their neutrality for the Patriots) had some interest in helping to create industry among the Iroquois, and IIRC he had family connections (son in law?) in investment banking. So he could advocate for them to maintain their independence. There is a place in upstate New York near/in Iroquois land that is great for making salt IIRC, so that would be a nice start up venture. They could supply victuals, and guides to New England settlers looking to move west into Ohio.
If they join as allies the Continental Congress may even decide to buy the territorial claim off of New York and let a chunk of Upstate (maybe even part of north western Pennsylvania) go to be Iroquois territory maybe as an independent country, or a type of semi-autonomous subjugate (more independence than Puerto Rico, but not to the level of a federated state). I suspect they wouldn't get full state status in the union for close to a century.
If you check the map in my post above you'll see the Iroquois already claimed pretty much the entire Northwest Territory, so why would they give those lands only for Congress to give them a vague promise to some of them in return?
If the Iroquois join them, they could negotiate the land claims. I agree that the newly created US would want to have the entire Iroquois country, but it is too unstable to do anything major for the first decades of its existence and would want as many allies as possible to check the British. It's the reason they didn't go for the Spanish colonies in the vicinity from the get go, and only managed to buy Florida which the Spanish ceded rather happily.No, because US states have claims on their land that the Federal government isent going to have the ability or inclination to make them give up
If the Iroquois join them, they could negotiate the land claims. I agree that the newly created US would want to have the entire Iroquois country, but it is too unstable to do anything major for the first decades of its existence and would want as many allies as possible to check the British. It's the reason they didn't go for the Spanish colonies in the vicinity from the get go, and only managed to buy Florida which the Spanish ceded rather happily.
yes, but I was apparently mistaken, the man I was thinking of was not a relation, rather a business partner.That son in law is Alexander Hamilton.
Racism didn't stop the French and British in the same period from recruiting Native Americans and respecting their sovereignty when it suited them.Maybe if it was a smaller state, it'd be different. But we are talking New York here: a state that already wasen't entirely on board with the Constitution and who's refusal to sign onto the new nation could easily strangle it in its cradle. Who's going to run that risk for the sake of the land claims of mere Native Americans given the racial attitudes of the time?