The Holocaust Covered Up

Evidence of the Holocaust had leaked to the outside world shortly after the industrialised murder had begun, Spring 1943 would be far too late to save anyone at the top from the noose. You just can't cover an operation that size up.
 
Of course some conspiracies have succeeded. We know who killed Caesar, for instance. And of course there are some we don't know about. Some secrets are successfully kept; that's obvious. Also, not all conspiracy theories are bunk. If some guy asserts at any point in history, "So-and-so is involved in a conspiracy to kill X and Y", or "President So-and-so is involved in a conspiracy to profit from his position", and his assertion is true, then that's a conspiracy theory that wasn't bunk.

The more people who are involved, the less plausible the cover-up. So:

- New Coke was an intentional failure in order to distract people from the switch from sugar to corn syrup: plausible, only a few corporate heads need to know.

- The moon landing was faked: pretty implausible, thousands of people were involved enough to know the truth.

- Covering up the Holocaust: Impossible, millions of perpetrators and survivors know the real story or at least large enough fractions of it to disprove any coverup.
 
Try November 28, 1941. That is the date of the conference of industrialists chaired by Reich armaments minister Fritz Todt that concluded that the war ‘was no longer winnable by military means’ and that only a negotiated solution was now feasible.

The Wannsee Conference, chaired by Reinhard Heydrich to determine the means of enacting ‘the Final Solution to the Jewish Question’ did not take place until the 20th of January 1942; two months after it had been determined that the war was not going to be won militarily.

Which leads to a question of the causal connection between these two decisions.

The fact that, 2 weeks after the Wannsee conference, Fritz Todt died in a plane crash under not entirely clarified circumstances, does not need to distract you :rolleyes:
 
The problem with conspiracies is not that there always exists a paper trail, but that there quite often doesn't. Iran-Contra or Watergate may have been revealed, but the notion that all such illegal or immoral actions by the government have been made known to us is laughable. I mean, the statement that we know the "origin and full truth" of everything that every person who has ever been in power ever did (and used that same power to cover up) - that's the most ridiculous assertion I've ever heard.

Of course some conspiracies have succeeded. We know who killed Caesar, for instance. And of course there are some we don't know about. Some secrets are successfully kept; that's obvious. Also, not all conspiracy theories are bunk. If some guy asserts at any point in history, "So-and-so is involved in a conspiracy to kill X and Y", or "President So-and-so is involved in a conspiracy to profit from his position", and his assertion is true, then that's a conspiracy theory that wasn't bunk.

What you're asserting is more ridiculous than holocaust denial. The holocaust obviously happened, but it takes empirical evidence to know that. Saying "powerful people throughout the ages have been involved in schemes, and the public doesn't always find out the details" - that's something you don't even have to think about.

There is always, always, always a trail of evidence, and you can always follow it back and uncover the truth from it. That is because humans have never ever been able to cover up everything and every detail, and it only takes some evidence to lead to another bit of evidence to another bit of evidence to another bit of evidence, eventually cracking open what happened. The bigger that which is attempted to be hidden, the more residue is left behind which will uncover the truth. Not to mention the factor that humans are severely incompetent, which is the reason evidence exists and not all loose ends are tied (which all loose ends can never be tied anyway) and why Illuminati-sized nefarious conspiracies are impossible, because some things will go wrong and people will screw up.

If I steal cookies with friends when I'm 7, then no, that conspiracy will have a likelihood never to make it out. If I knock over a bank with a gang, that's a different story. If I kill the president or fake a space effort, that's a very different story. If I oversee and take part in the genocide of millions of Jews, homosexuals, leftists, and disabled persons, that is a very different story.

A real conspiracy and how a real conspiracy unfolds was shown with Watergate. People cannot keep a lid on anything, evidence is always left behind, and people cannot shut up. And any action you try to take to cover up a loose end and/or to hide the truth and try to keep a lid on it makes more loose ends and more evidence. And the bigger the effort, the more chance for screw ups and people talking and evidence and loose ends, and any major conspiracy requires it to be big since it requires a large infrastructure and it requires power, and power is based on size and invites growth in size.
 
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I'm completely serious - even if every piece of evidence of the camps and murders are destroyed, you're still left with millions of missing people. How the hell do you cover THAT up?
 
I'm completely serious - even if every piece of evidence of the camps and murders are destroyed, you're still left with millions of missing people. How the hell do you cover THAT up?

They've all gone fishing.
 
I'm completely serious - even if every piece of evidence of the camps and murders are destroyed, you're still left with millions of missing people. How the hell do you cover THAT up?

And how do you make sure none of those people slip the net? We know there are instances of people escaping from concentration camps and in some very rare instances infiltrating and then successfully escaping from them. When you're talking about mass murder on the scale of millions it's a given at least a few hundred, if not a few thousand, are going to escape from the death camps and tell the world. One or two people might not be believed at first but when you start getting a few hundred or thousand from all over Eastern and Central Europe it gets very hard to ignore.
 
People are going to talk.
Train drivers, soldiers, medical personell, admnistrative staff... Someone will always say something. That's the issue with covering up such a big operation.
Furthermore just like in OTL destroying death camps won't destro all evidence, the Soviets found tons of evidence in razed death camp sites.
 
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