The Greatest Mercantile and Manufacturing Empires Unitied?

Ok, this time line will explore my favourite What If.

It will deal with Britain and Germany drawing closer in the latter half of the 19th Century rather than becoming competitors.

I am going to try to keep butterflies as small as possible, so much of what happens in OTL will happen in my timeline, unless otherwise stated.

For conveniance I have translated all languages into English!

I would appreciate all the feedback you can give.
 
Part 1

Early Morning 25 August 1858: Balmoral Castle

“Fire ……………. Fire in the Royal Quarters” Colour Sergeant Dunross shouted into the night. The word was taken up quickly by the soldiers of the guard, half rush to follow the sergeant into the building the other rushed to get hoses to fight the fire.

When Captain Campbell arrived five minutes later the fire was blazing, driving back those who sort to reach the Queen and her family. His first reaction was to see if any of the Royal Family had been rescued, but the Queen, her husband and all but one of her children were trapped or already dead in the inferno.

He organised his men into a bucket train and soon the brave soldiers of the Black Watch were fighting their way up the narrow stairs of the servants’ staircase to gain access to the Royal Quarters.

“Who’s in charge here? Who can tell me where her majesty is?” the powerful voice of Lord Derby, the Queen’s First Minister pierced the confusion of people watching the fire from outside the kitchen garden.

“I am sir” responded Captain Campbell. “My men are trying to reach Her Majesty by the back staircase, the main stairs being to damaged. As yet we have had no contact with the Family, although I am hoping that the Prince of Wales was still in Aberdeen as safe.”

“No such luck, he returned some hours ago with his equerry. What do you think the chances are that anyone is still alive up there?” the First Ministers voice dropped to a whisper for the last sentence.

“Not good I am afraid” came the reply. The two men turned to watch the efforts of the guards as the hurled bucket after bucket on the fire.


27 August 1858: Berlin

Princess Victoria looked up when her husband entered the room, then looked down and started to weep again. Her husband, Prince Fredrick of Prussia quickly crossed the room to his wife and took her hands in his as he knelt by her. He whispered words of condolence and support to his wife of only 7 months as his eyes fell on the letter that had rocked their world this morning.

To Her Majesty Victoria

Your Highness, I is deep regret and profound personal lose that I write to you with the news that your mother has died, alongside your father, and all your brothers and sisters ……

Fredrick tore his mind back to his wife and the distress she was feeling, in a moment she had been not only orphaned but had lost her four brother and four sisters. He could only imagine the pain she was in, and now the Earl of Derby had demanded that she return to London to take her mother’s throne.


1 September 1858: Downing Street

“Bloody Bismarck… he knows he has us over a barrel…… Favoured nation status, no import duty on Prussia goods….. the French will go potty” the Earl of Derby stormed into the Cabinet Room, being followed by James Harris and Benjamin Disraeli, his Foreign Secretary and Chancellor.

“The Queen was very popular, the people expect her daughter to take the throne…. We saw what happen in 48 went governments did the unpopular…..” the Earl of Malmesbury started before Disraeli cut him off.

“He is a chancer, but it could work for us too. Access to all those chemicals, our textile industry would love it. Plus it could help with negotiations with the French is we strengthen our European ties ……….” his voice faded as the trio walked into the rose garden.

3 September 1858: Exerts from the special (no ads) front page of the Times
“The world mourns the passing of a great Queen.”

“Queen Victoria was laid to rest with her family in a tomb in Frogmore at Winsor Castle after a state funeral at Westminster Abbey. A crowd of almost a million people attended the Queen and lined her passage from central London to Winsor.”

“Amongst those attending the funeral was Her Majesty Queen Victoria II, the only surviving child of the Queen, along with her husband Prince Fredrick of Prussia, whom yesterday was named Prince Consort after he renounced his rights to the throne of Prussia in favour of his uncle Prince Charles”.

“The French Emperor was booed by sections of the crowd as his carriage passed, feelings are running high over the rumours that 2 French men were seen running from Balmoral when the fire was starting. The Sheriff of Argyll, who leads the investigation has only said he wishes to talk with people who were in the area on the night of the 25th.”
 
If Turtledove can get away with Space Lizards...

Hi Last of the Stuarts

It is certainly true that your POD is unlikely, but if Turtledove can get away with Space Lizards... why not?

The plausibility problems may need you to dream up some novel constitutional arrangements to join the Prussian Zollverein (customs union) with England, on the other hand, this had already been done with the supposed crowns of Ireland and Scotland, and there was Austro-Hungary in Europe to compare. However all these places are next door to one another.

You have to go back to the 17th century for disparate countries united by a crown - such as in the Habsburg dynastic set up. Dynastic empires were not very 19th Century, but don't let that stop you. Give Vicky II a capable son and kill off Willy, he's got to go to give it all anything like a fair wind.

On the other hand if the Germans of the time associated this novel arrangement with the unification of Germany that would give it a strong push.

It would be a union of the whale and the lion: they would misunderstand each other a lot.

About this time is when the Brits lost it as far as the Industrial Revolution went. Previous to the 1850s steam and iron only worked for Britain. As the efficiency of the engines improved, it suddenly began to work everywhere. It was 20 years before Britain started mass education, importing Prussian education would make a huge difference to the speed of technical advance.

On the German side the moment is well chosen, the Prussian army's later doctrines of schrechlichkeit (being bloody dreadful) which had such a bad effect on later world opinion had not yet become entrenched.

I see that you have the relatively young Disraeli speaking in economic terms. I suggest that he would not dare use such language - you are talking of Trade. Can't do that, you know. Wouldn't do. Not even at Horse Guards.

Check out George MacDonald Fraser's Flashman books, and indeed you could check Disraeli's own novels - they are probably on Gutenberg.org.

One thing you have got going for you is that I imagine the sales in Germany would go through the roof - they'd love to lose that particular century 1850-1950.
 
Thanks for the feedback.

I am not trying for a polical union (you will note the Fredrick removed himself from the sucession) I realise that it is far to late for that. We may have a personal union in 1888 with the death of the Kaiser leaving the top job in Germany open (Charles will die when he did in OTL).

I am aiming to blend German efficency and manufactoring with British libralism and mercantile know how to get two countries who are friendly and share more similar outlooks than they did in OTL.
 
LotS

Interesting idea but a number of queries/points.

a) I think by this time Britain was already fairly well committed to free trade so I can't see any way there would be special tariff access to German goods as there were no British tariffs.

b) I think versipellis's idea of Britain joining the Zollverein would be a definite no-no. It was designed to protect the budging Prussia [and related German states] industries so allowing access to the world's economic super-power would be a disaster for it and would not be allowed.

c) Do agree that if you can get Britain to modernise it's education system earlier and also make it more efficient would be very, very good for Britain. Ditto if you could reduce Prussian reliance on militarism. However both would be difficult, especially the latter since the main POD is basically a new British queen with a Prussian consort.

Hence I can't see the Prussian monarchy being able to impose any terms on Britain. If they don't accept Victoria returning to be queen and her consort joining her then Parliament would pass legislation to change the succession to get another monarch. It is awkward that Fredrick has to give up his claim to the Prussian throne but I think that would be necessary to avoid upsetting too many other powers.

That's another reason for Prussia not imposing links on Britain. Something that makes too close a set of ties between the two will upset [greatly] at least France and Austria and probably several other powers.

If you can get a good blend of the best characteristics of both powers in both and provided that didn't make them bitter rivals that would be very good. However it would probably also mean, sooner or later, a very, very big war, especially if Prussia becomes the core of a German empire similar to OTL. Such a combination will make everybody else far too nervous.

Anyway, looking to see more and subscribing.:D

Steve
 
Make it seem as though France, especially with regards alliance with Russia, are the continents rising power. If Austria retained ambitions of being the head of a united Germany, and France supported that goal as part of their rivalry with Germany, that could work too.

Britain's goal, not that it's any secret, is to make sure nobody gets to have a hegemony in Europe. Fiddle with history to make Germany look like it might fail, and France, or Austria-Hungary, or Russia, might devour part or all of it, and Britain will prop them up. This would be a middling preference, to be greatly amplified politically and culturally once a war breaks out, and German and British soldiers start dying alongside one another in the same cause.

And the best we could hope for in terms of alliance is that Britain and Germany divide the continent up into sphere's of influence, after a general war like the Great War, as part of an ostensibly unified European Customs Union. This works best if Russia is untouched by the war, or at least obviously resurgent as a communist power. If communism encourages enough agitators in the rest of the world, and especially in the defeated powers of Europe, then Britain and Germany grow closer, against communism. So not a literal union of the two powers, but a special relationship.
 
Part 2 1858-59

16 September 1858: Headline of The Scotsman

“Not Proven.
In the Sheriff’s court today a verdict of not proven was handed down by the jury at the case of Alphonse and Gaston Deville, the two Frenchmen accused of setting the fire at Balmoral last month.

The brothers, who confessed the crime to George Smithers of Aberdeen, are known to be radical republicans who have threatened to smash monarchies across Europe. The defence argued that the brothers were suffering from mental illness and had little control over their actions.

After their release the brothers were mobbed by a irate crowd and the police had to intervene to stop the two from being lynched. The two will now be sent back to France and will not be allowed to re-enter Britain.


20 September 1858: Downing Street, exerts from Cabinet Minutes

Earl De La Warr (Lord Chamberlin) stated the problem that the Queen is pregnant, therefor the coronation will have to be put off until at least February to allow the Queen to regain her strength for the rigors of the public special. The child is expected on or about the 27 January. It was agreed that the coronation would take place at Westminster Abbey on 15 March next.

The Earl of Malmesbury informed the cabinet of an exchange between the French Ambassador and himself over the attacks on French property and people in London. There have now been seven incidents including a fire which killed three people (all French). He had reassured the French Ambassador that the matter was under investigation and that he treated the events as very serious.

31 May 1859 – Outside of the Palace of Westminster

The Queens voice rose to try to overcome the cheering of the crowds around Parliament Square, but after a few false starts she gave up, and tried to pitch her voice at the more intimate group of 50 or so standing in a loose semi-circle around her. Her eyes sought first her husband, then her senior minister the Earl of Derby. Both smiled at her as she started her speech.

“At this, the birth place of Democracy I honour my mother’s memory. The clock of the Palace of Westminster is a technological marvel, as so my father is honoured here too. I dedicate the Great Clock to Victoria and Albert.”

The crowd could hear nothing of the speech, but cheered madly for their new Queen. It seemed her popularity could climb no higher.

16 June 1859: Downing Street (exert of conversation between Viscount Palmerston the First Minister and John Russell the Foreign Secretary)

“Her Majesty seems very keen about us taking a guiding hand with Prussia, eh Pam” Russell said stirring his tea.

“hmmm… oh yes… very keen” was the somewhat vague reply from the elderly Palmerston. This lead to a shape look from Russell who knew the only time the razor sharp Henry Temple was vague was when there was serious trouble ahead that only he had seen.

“What’s on your mind Pam, what else did she say?”

“No so much her, as the Prince Consort. He seemed shocked that the greatest nation on earth didn’t provide for it’s poor. He started to bang on about universal education, like those Radicals, I just hope he keeps his ideas to himself. We’ve only been in office for 4 days we can’t be seen to support such an idea, it would sink us from the start.”

“Universal education? Can you imagine all the people that would want to go to Oxbridge! My god, it would be a disaster.”
“hmmm….. yes….but…….” Palmerston stopped to consider were his mind was going. “But think if we ensured that everyone could read, write and add up. It may help things along. You know like Cadbury is doing in Birmingham.”
 
LotS

That sets things up nicely. Tension with France over the Balmoral deaths and resultant public unrest. Popularity for the new queen, and a heir which also helps. [Notice you mention her being pregnant with birth being mentioned in Jan 59 but a later coronation than initially suggested and the queen sounding a bit weak then. Hopefully both mother and child are doing well? If so was it a boy or girl?

Also Fredrick is starting to stir things up over education. If that starts leaking into public knowledge it would be a big boost to reform and also making the monarchy even more popular, with many anyway. Need to try and solve the religious problem, which delayed matters so much OTL but especially if you can get something rolling this early there's likely to be a more technical bent to the schooling, which would also be a big plus.

One other thing coming up which such a progressive royal couple might stick their noses into. Bound to hear about Mr Darwin's new book and an invitation to the palace to discuss it might well put the noses of a lot of the more reactionary elements out of joint.

On the wider field you will start to see a series of wars in Europe and also a big one in N Amercia and a different British response to any of those could have some important butterflies. Especially if 1866 comes around as OTL and you have Prussia attacking Hanover amongst others the royals will have an awkward position. Unless butterflies means that Bismarck doesn't get the same power possibly? Or the Pig War goes hot?

With Fredrick having withdrawn himself from the Prussian succession who is the heir to the current king?

Steve
 
efficiency liberalism and manufacturing

I am aiming to blend German efficiency and manufacturing with British liberalism and mercantile know how to get two countries who are friendly and share more similar outlooks than they did in OTL. (Last_0f_Stuarts)

Thanks for the clarification.

It is true that by the 1900s Britain and Germany were at loggerheads and conducting an arms race, but this was not so earlier on. The British Royal Family was as German as the soon-to-be-Kaiser's already at your POD. But Britain was a constitutional monarchy and the Saxe-Coburgs had nowhere near the power of the Hohenzollerns.

I would suggest that the period say 1850-1870 saw Britain and the incipient German Empire as close as you could wish, OTL.

If your object is to 'blend German efficiency and manufacturing with British liberalism you have something of a problem X 3.

Victorian Age businessmen only had to be comparatively efficient, compared that is, to the other manufacturers in the market. In real terms their Victorian Age levels of efficiency scraped the floor: they were dreadful.

From Germany Alfred Krupp of Essen toured England earlier in the century and copied many of the processes used but also kept a closed mouth about his own experiments. certainly he could cast larger steel ingots than anyone in the world at the time of your POD. But as far as manufacturing is concerned, these guys were years behind the diversity of British manufacturing - mainly because they had smaller and poorer markets to sell into.

As for British liberalism with or without a capital letter, don't forget the country was half Conservative. I think it is Gilbert in Iolanthe who put it best in 1883:

SCENE. – Palace Yard, Westminster. Westminster Hall, L. Clock tower up, R.C. PRIVATE WILLIS discovered on sentry, R. Moonlight.

SONG – PRIVATE WILLIS.

When all night long a chap remains
On sentry-go, to chase monotony
He exercises of his brains,
That is, assuming that he’s got any.
Though never nurtured in the lap
Of luxury, yet I admonish you,
I am an intellectual chap,
And think of things that would astonish you.
I often think it’s comical – Fal, lal, la!
How Nature always does contrive – Fal, lal, la!
That every boy and every gal
That’s born into the world alive
Is either a little Liberal
Or else a little Conservative!
Fal, lal, la!

When in that House M.P.’s divide,
If they’ve a brain and cerebellum, too,
They’ve got to leave that brain outside,
And vote just as their leaders tell ’em to.
But then the prospect of a lot
Of dull M. P.’s in close proximity,
All thinking for themselves, is what
No man can face with equanimity.
Then let’s rejoice with loud Fal la – Fal la la!
That Nature always does contrive – Fal lal la!
That every boy and every gal
That’s born into the world alive
Is either a little Liberal
Or else a little Conservative!
Fal lal la!

(Enter Fairies, with CELIA, LEILA, and FLETA. They trip round stage.)

And if you'll just excuse me I shall now trip off stage.:D
 
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