Wow, he's already half way to fascism. All he needs now is to harp on about "rebirth of the nation" or some such.
The Glowing Dream: A history of Socialist America
- Thread starter Iggies
- Start date
if America enters WW early that means no Bolshevik Revolution but the doesn't mean the socialist won't be stronger in Russia they may have a governing majority and with a shortened WW 1 and a friendly Red America they may have a stable government.
Hi there, first time reading this TL (just finished binging it). So far I'm really enjoying it, and as for that election, talk about barely scraping through with just one EV. McKinley's a lucky SOB given everything that's happened. Let's see if his luck holds up or if he's still have an encounter with a certain Polish anarchist with a concealed gun.
I think that there could still be February and Bolshevik Revolutions in Russia, even if the Americans are involved from the beginning. The Russian Empire was not a stable institution and it was riddled with contradictions. The OTL postwar revolutionary surge affected countries that had been on both sides of the war or had even been neutral and it's likely that Russia would still experience widespread dissent. There's even an argument to be made that WW1 may have delayed the outbreak of revolution rather than causing it, unrest and labour militancy having been steadily on the rise before the outbreak of the war. There's also a possibility that the US might enter on the side of the Central Powers or that the alliance blocs that form ITTL might be different, which could result in the course of WW1 going in radically different directions.
The upcoming revolution in America would certainly play a role as well. If it happens in America first, it would significantly add fuel to the simmering fire in the Russian Empire, being a beacon for world revolution and all that. Like you said, the Russian Empire was in it's death throes even before WW1, with the the 1905 revolution and it's aftermath to prove that. It was only a matter of time before all that social unrest explodes into civil war.
On the other hand, it would certainly be interesting to see how the USSR would develop when they have someone they could confidently call an ally during it's socialist construction though. Having a big industrially advanced nation backing you up all the way would do wonders for the Bolshevik siege mentality, which forced them to take... let's say stringent measures OTL in order to survive, being isolated and surrounded on all sides by hostile powers and all. But that's supposing the USSR would even exist ITL, so we'll see.
there wouldn't be an October Revolution because that only happened because the provisional government kept fighting and Who knows how Lenin and the rest of Bolsheviks will change if there is a Red American and the way Red America treats yeomen farmers will be critical in more agrarian countries like Russia.
the Eastern front is too large for it to be a stalemate meet grinder like the western front and the eastern front was just as brutal it just moved more.
well Russia and the USA would be on the entente side so the war will be over more quickly still bloody but no where near the slaughter of OTL
A big part of an early US in WW1 is going to be anti German-American sentiment, if they side with the entente as OTL. Considering they're likely to be already trending towards socialism as immigrant workers tend to do here, I could see the socialists having a strong German identity component.
German-Americans were also a big component of the Republican voting bloc and one of the largest ethnic groups in the US (something like a third of White Americans have German ancestry). That would be a boon to the Socialists.
One thing I've been thinking about is the state of reformist socialism ITTL. The SLP remains quite doctrinaire in its commitments to Marxism and revolution and Daniel De Leon is a sectarian asshole at heart so I imagine that Lassale/Bernstein types committed to a parliamentarian path to socialism would be pretty alienated. I wonder if there might be a split at some point or if the Populists have or will develop a Socialist wing for moderate socialists put off by the SLP's revolutionary Marxism?
that not work here, the op wants an entente victory it seems...and yet both russian revolution and now a copy pasted russian revolution one in USA
No reason this can't work? German-Americans got a lot of distrust over both world wars despite the US winning and it contributed to them assimilating as much as they did OTL. Here I could see stronger socialists swinging them and remaining more distinct.
Poor Debs is going to be an example for them, and if not him, everyone else targeted by the Red Act. I don't think this US has much room to be a socialist without radicalizing under pressure or disavowing the label and just being a populist/progressive.
The February revolution was inevitable from the moment WW 1 started but was not was the October revolution. We don't what February revolution is going to look like with a Red America around.
Nothing is inevitable...till it happen. We could see a far different conflict and no revolutions at all, this feels forced, like wanting reverse cold war in a way,....
Russian Empire was a rickety state going against galefore winds the Tsar was going to fall.
Okay that sounds interesting. And speaking of revolutions I don't predict an American revolution until at least around WWI, support of the SLP is high but not that high yet and revolutions typically require a spark of some kind and mass mobilization against the wishes of the working class or a post-war economic crash may very well trigger one.