Probably not at the levels of OTL, but the CIA can eventually promote some Mafia rejuvenation from the US to weak and discredit the regime. At the best to distract some resources from Italian side.
The Footprint of Mussolini - TL
Probably not at the levels of OTL, but the CIA can eventually promote some Mafia rejuvenation from the US to weak and discredit the regime. At the best to distract some resources from Italian side.
Dolan
Banned
Just be careful not to end up with Mafia infestation in US again.
Why not try to help The Greeks and Serbs here?
Ah, I think I've seen this movie before... Mussolini orders Balbo to go to the moon, he spends four years up there gathering soil samples and sending them back to Earth, Mussolini then passes on and Balbo returns to Earth only to discover his samples in some forgotten back office in Rome and that Mussolini just sent him up there to tie up a potential rival...
Dolan
Banned
Well, gathering moon soil for 4 years is just too ridiculous.
A quick series of orbits around earth at late 1950's, with modified V2 Rockets made by joint Italo-British-German engineering rushed with proverbial spit and duct tape is more likely. Especially if the aim is to avenge humiliation when Soviet launch their jury rigged Sputnik.
While British and German might be thinking twice about sending highly experienced pilots to their potential death, I think senile Mussolini will end up 'volunteering' Balbo for the role, even if he's rather old by this point (but considering John Glenn, well).
First manned mission to outer space end up being a success, and Balbo becoming too popular to even challenged that Mussolini end up peacefully stepping down and get into comfy retirement now before it's too late. The very fact that the second joint manned mission (with British and or German astronauts) end up in fatal disaster only made Balbo seem to be more badass.
The first camera sent to space was in 1949 aboard a modified V2. The photos were super blurry, but it was a first notheless. Depending who gets who, they could try to replicate the Aggregat-10/12, but it was really a crude rocket. It's guidance system was totally inadeguate for space travel, even a ballistic one.
I'm pretty curious about the Silbervogel, the "skipping" antipodal rocket/automatic bomber. It was in early speculations and it would be absourdly inefficient, but it could be used as a propaganda coup, menacing to hit everywhere in the world. A paper tiger for sure, but only after it's first use.
I'm pretty curious about the Silbervogel, the "skipping" antipodal rocket/automatic bomber. It was in early speculations and it would be absourdly inefficient, but it could be used as a propaganda coup, menacing to hit everywhere in the world. A paper tiger for sure, but only after it's first use.
As is being mortally wounded and being revived by a serum that turns one into a gorilla man... ;-)
Well, why looking on the Moon, when the fascist ambition will look beyond...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...BMAF6BAgKEAg&usg=AOvVaw2LJA2rhwa8FRCayzyvv4U-
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...BMAF6BAgKEAg&usg=AOvVaw2LJA2rhwa8FRCayzyvv4U-
Let's get real. The US will win the moon race and the other countries will just give up, safe the usual probes. Maybe the fascist bloc would organize the firsts multinational space missions (like, one italian astronaut/cosmonaut and a spaniard or a bulgarian).
Oh right, quick poll (hoping Sorairo will permit it, nobody hijacking TLs here): will Italy use the word astronaut or cosmonaut? OTL they were used as distinction between West and East. With a third (smaller) faction, what could we get?
Oh right, quick poll (hoping Sorairo will permit it, nobody hijacking TLs here): will Italy use the word astronaut or cosmonaut? OTL they were used as distinction between West and East. With a third (smaller) faction, what could we get?
Eh, maybe. Ok, if we want a third word, Stellanauta is probably the only not-horrible option. Things like Sidernauta (from "sidereum", starry) are intollerable and using the (rare) french term spationaut to spazionauta ("spacenaut") sound weird.
Tried to say Olimponauta aloud. Never again, sorry, it's just absurd. Still, thanks.
Dolan
Banned
How about "Adeptus Astartes"
Grandoise enough, and would definitely kick a thing or two with a certain man from Anatolia that wander across the world
I can see a European space agency organized by the fascist bloc but along more military lines.
Pandora
Hey all, here's the current situation with respect to the Pacific:
The Italian entry into the War made little immediate difference to British fortunes in the Pacific. Indeed, the initial consequence was the loss of Italy’s concession in Tientsin. Military aid was initially low, though grain was shipped to help relieve a famine that had begun in Bengal and it provided much needed relief for British resources in the region [1]. It did provide a much-needed boost in morale for the British in the fighting in Burma – the fading ‘Singapore Spirit’ being rejuvenated [2]. By early 1944, the first offensives back into Burma began, with Meiktila being taken that summer.
Over time, a more practical form of aid would arrive. Mussolini had little opportunity to use his navy in the war and was tempted to test out his latest developments, not the least of which was the Aquila, Italy’s first Aircraft Carrier. The Littorio battleships were likewise ready to be used. Though initially used mostly in the Indian Ocean to support the British, necessity forced them to back up the Americans in the far off waters of the Pacific, their first major mission being to support the American navy at the Battle of the Philippine Sea that April. It even managed to score a crippling blow on the Taihō, Japan’s premier Aircraft Carrier, which allowed American submarines to finish her off. The Italian navy distinguished themselves admirably, much to the surprise of American naval commanders. Mussolini, never one to miss a chance, lauded his genius in ‘discovering’ the power of the Aircraft Carrier (which was Balbo’s idea).
Ultimately, the losses of Japan were crippling by mid-1944. The military leaders knew that Germany was soon to fall, but there had been one event that quite interested them. The initial advance of Operation Ragnarok had astonished them, even though it was quickly beaten back by chemical retaliation. The militarists were inspired. They were sure the only reason the Germans had failed was their internal dissent and lateness in using them. If the Japanese used chemical weapons, they would use them before the Americans ever reached Honshū. The thought was beautiful – imagining the slaughter of American soldiers in the millions as they fought for every street under chemical bombardment. There was no way the Americans could endure – they would have to make peace. And thus, Japan embarked on yet another disastrous path.
Unit 731 had mostly been quiet during the war, working primarily on undercover human experimentation with all the cruelty their infamy would indicate. They had already experimented on three thousand unwilling volunteers by September 1944, but their most infamous days remained ahead of them. On August 1st, General Shirō Ishii met the Cabinet in Tokyo, and was asked about his program. After affirming their effectiveness in both the lab and the field, he was told that Japan needed a final ace up the sleeve to pull them through the ‘present discomfort’ as Tojo called it. To that end, the strategy was approved – one that would make Pearl Harbour look good in retrospective. They would deploy chemical weapons on every island the Americans tried to invade. They would bleed them out and thus get a great peace deal, or that was the plan anyway.
While a suggested attack on the American mainland was proposed, it was rejected because it would likely stir up the American public. What the militarists wanted was a campaign to make any invasion of Japan so costly that the Americans would be forced to come to terms. For that reason, the first use of chemical weapons occurred during the invasion of the Philippines that September. Though it was simply mustard gas and hardly of the more developed, terrifying nature of later weapons, American leaders knew that the Pacific War had entered a dark phase. With the use of gas, casualties began to rise exponentially on both sides. Perhaps the best summary of the reaction of American leaders was found in Admiral Nimitz when he told his subordinates, “We’ve entered a level of Hell I didn’t even think could exist”.
But Unit 731 would not simply be content with mere mustard gas. They had something special planned. On October 26th, the same day that Himmler and Goebbels fell into Allied hands, the US Marines landed in Iwo Jima, to what seemed to be initially promising results. The sight of small, smashed canisters along the landing zone was ignored. However, by October 30th, strange events started to occur behind the lines. Soldiers started to vomit uncontrollably, showed up in the hospital with appalling lymph node swelling and collapsed. When the doctors investigated what had happened, they gave the answer – the bubonic plague. There was only one way this Medieval disease had somehow come back from the dead – the Japanese had prepared a cruel arrival party for the Americans. It should be noted that Japanese civilians – even many Japanese soldiers - were just as clueless to the disease as the American soldiers and died just as pointlessly.
The news hit the Western Press on November 2nd, one day after V.E. Day, and was a quick, sobering reminder of the reality of the conflict. ‘Plague Craze’ swept the yellow press of America, Australia and Canada as people saw evidence of a Japanese chemical weapon attack on their homeland from all sides. None of it was true, but hysteria had reached such a peak that it would leave a permanent mark on the healthcare question of the United States in particular. As expected, enthusiasm (though not support) for the War faded.
At the subsequent Tokyo Tribunals, Ishii stated that both his reaction and his superior’s reaction to the news of American casualties in such numbers was joyous, as they expected any American invasion to be too costly for Wallace. They were right, though not in the way they had intended. One wonders whether they would have just signed the surrender right there if they knew what was soon to come.
After the liberation of Berlin, American military leaders were stung hard by the experience. Bradley described it as ‘trying to claw yourself out of the dirt while buried alive’. The number of casualties, on top of the horrifying pictures coming out of Berlin of gas-clouded streets patrolled by gas-mask wearing GIs had dampened enthusiasm at home. While V.E. Day rejuvenated the public, it certainly didn’t put joy into High Command – when the news that the bubonic plague had been used on GIs, morale fell even lower. They still had another enemy to deal with, one that certainly wasn’t going to stop using their accursed chemical weapon inventory. The pre-chemical weapon calculations of how many people would die in the invasion of Japan were already astronomical – indeed, the American military in all its subsequent wars still uses the Purple Hearts made for the invasion of Japan. The notion of having to fight for every street in such a gigantic country, with tens of millions ready to fight to the death, old women and children using spears, not a friendly face to be found, now with the added nightmares of gas and plagues was terrifying.
On November 20th, as the bloody battle of Iwo Jima went on, a strategy meeting was held at the White House. Wallace, Bradley, Eisenhower, Patton and others discussed how Japan could be brought to heel. When Wallace was informed of the human cost of the Japanese invasion, from both the American and Japanese perspective, he said there had to be a better way. No man wanted a repeat of the nightmare Americans had seen in Berlin. Ultimately, it was agreed that after taking several more islands to enable the American Air Force to get close to the Japanese mainland, the plan would simply be to blockade and bomb Japan into submission with various weapons, chemical included. The final ace they had, the Manhattan Project, would be used as soon as possible, with more resources allocated to the already nearly completed program as a Hail Mary attempt to save GIs from the utter bloodbath that awaited a full invasion. Owing to a senior member of the American government having gone there for Honeymoon, Kyoto was lucky enough to find itself off the list of targets. Now, with the chemical weapon Pandora opened by none other than the Japanese military themselves, Kyoto was finally put on the target list again. It would exclusively be for chemical weapons, so as to preserve the architecture of the city.
By the time Iwo Jima was declared secure, just before Christmas, nearly 10,000 Americans had died. The already terrible relationship between Japanese soldiers and Americans got worse still – it was exceedingly rare to hear a call for surrender from the Japanese side met with anything other than more rifle-shots. Many feared the Japanese had deliberately infected themselves and didn’t want them anywhere near. The poison gas had poisoned hearts as much as bodies. With American leaders already preparing themselves for the slaughter expected at Okinawa, Wallace went to Potsdam with the firm determination to make Japan lose as quickly as possible, with as little casualties as possible. Of course, there was only one man he knew that had the resources to stick a new, firm blow to the Japanese. Wallace hoped that a decisive Soviet advance into Asia would be enough of a blow to the militarists that they would see sense and surrender. It would lead to ‘Potsdam’ being just as infamous a word as ‘Munich’ in the common vocabulary of the Western world.
[1] – The Japanese never advanced as far into Burma as they did, and further resources and aid being available helps alleviate the Bengal Famine significantly.
[2] – Singapore holds out until June due to a tougher slog for the Japanese owing to the British not having to waste resources in the Mediterranean. Their dogged determination to fight to the end impresses the locals so much so they were called the ‘Lions of Lion City (Singapore)’, and the Japanese treatment of the ethnic Chinese in the city led to a much more pro-British line being developed.
Pandora
The Still Sun: The British Empire after WW2 by Cecil Moore
The Still Sun: The British Empire after WW2 by Cecil Moore
The Italian entry into the War made little immediate difference to British fortunes in the Pacific. Indeed, the initial consequence was the loss of Italy’s concession in Tientsin. Military aid was initially low, though grain was shipped to help relieve a famine that had begun in Bengal and it provided much needed relief for British resources in the region [1]. It did provide a much-needed boost in morale for the British in the fighting in Burma – the fading ‘Singapore Spirit’ being rejuvenated [2]. By early 1944, the first offensives back into Burma began, with Meiktila being taken that summer.
Over time, a more practical form of aid would arrive. Mussolini had little opportunity to use his navy in the war and was tempted to test out his latest developments, not the least of which was the Aquila, Italy’s first Aircraft Carrier. The Littorio battleships were likewise ready to be used. Though initially used mostly in the Indian Ocean to support the British, necessity forced them to back up the Americans in the far off waters of the Pacific, their first major mission being to support the American navy at the Battle of the Philippine Sea that April. It even managed to score a crippling blow on the Taihō, Japan’s premier Aircraft Carrier, which allowed American submarines to finish her off. The Italian navy distinguished themselves admirably, much to the surprise of American naval commanders. Mussolini, never one to miss a chance, lauded his genius in ‘discovering’ the power of the Aircraft Carrier (which was Balbo’s idea).
Ultimately, the losses of Japan were crippling by mid-1944. The military leaders knew that Germany was soon to fall, but there had been one event that quite interested them. The initial advance of Operation Ragnarok had astonished them, even though it was quickly beaten back by chemical retaliation. The militarists were inspired. They were sure the only reason the Germans had failed was their internal dissent and lateness in using them. If the Japanese used chemical weapons, they would use them before the Americans ever reached Honshū. The thought was beautiful – imagining the slaughter of American soldiers in the millions as they fought for every street under chemical bombardment. There was no way the Americans could endure – they would have to make peace. And thus, Japan embarked on yet another disastrous path.
Silent and Deadly: A History of Chemical Weapons by Stephen Prince
Unit 731 had mostly been quiet during the war, working primarily on undercover human experimentation with all the cruelty their infamy would indicate. They had already experimented on three thousand unwilling volunteers by September 1944, but their most infamous days remained ahead of them. On August 1st, General Shirō Ishii met the Cabinet in Tokyo, and was asked about his program. After affirming their effectiveness in both the lab and the field, he was told that Japan needed a final ace up the sleeve to pull them through the ‘present discomfort’ as Tojo called it. To that end, the strategy was approved – one that would make Pearl Harbour look good in retrospective. They would deploy chemical weapons on every island the Americans tried to invade. They would bleed them out and thus get a great peace deal, or that was the plan anyway.
While a suggested attack on the American mainland was proposed, it was rejected because it would likely stir up the American public. What the militarists wanted was a campaign to make any invasion of Japan so costly that the Americans would be forced to come to terms. For that reason, the first use of chemical weapons occurred during the invasion of the Philippines that September. Though it was simply mustard gas and hardly of the more developed, terrifying nature of later weapons, American leaders knew that the Pacific War had entered a dark phase. With the use of gas, casualties began to rise exponentially on both sides. Perhaps the best summary of the reaction of American leaders was found in Admiral Nimitz when he told his subordinates, “We’ve entered a level of Hell I didn’t even think could exist”.
But Unit 731 would not simply be content with mere mustard gas. They had something special planned. On October 26th, the same day that Himmler and Goebbels fell into Allied hands, the US Marines landed in Iwo Jima, to what seemed to be initially promising results. The sight of small, smashed canisters along the landing zone was ignored. However, by October 30th, strange events started to occur behind the lines. Soldiers started to vomit uncontrollably, showed up in the hospital with appalling lymph node swelling and collapsed. When the doctors investigated what had happened, they gave the answer – the bubonic plague. There was only one way this Medieval disease had somehow come back from the dead – the Japanese had prepared a cruel arrival party for the Americans. It should be noted that Japanese civilians – even many Japanese soldiers - were just as clueless to the disease as the American soldiers and died just as pointlessly.
The news hit the Western Press on November 2nd, one day after V.E. Day, and was a quick, sobering reminder of the reality of the conflict. ‘Plague Craze’ swept the yellow press of America, Australia and Canada as people saw evidence of a Japanese chemical weapon attack on their homeland from all sides. None of it was true, but hysteria had reached such a peak that it would leave a permanent mark on the healthcare question of the United States in particular. As expected, enthusiasm (though not support) for the War faded.
At the subsequent Tokyo Tribunals, Ishii stated that both his reaction and his superior’s reaction to the news of American casualties in such numbers was joyous, as they expected any American invasion to be too costly for Wallace. They were right, though not in the way they had intended. One wonders whether they would have just signed the surrender right there if they knew what was soon to come.
The Rise, Fall and Rise of Japan by Mariya Takeuchi
After the liberation of Berlin, American military leaders were stung hard by the experience. Bradley described it as ‘trying to claw yourself out of the dirt while buried alive’. The number of casualties, on top of the horrifying pictures coming out of Berlin of gas-clouded streets patrolled by gas-mask wearing GIs had dampened enthusiasm at home. While V.E. Day rejuvenated the public, it certainly didn’t put joy into High Command – when the news that the bubonic plague had been used on GIs, morale fell even lower. They still had another enemy to deal with, one that certainly wasn’t going to stop using their accursed chemical weapon inventory. The pre-chemical weapon calculations of how many people would die in the invasion of Japan were already astronomical – indeed, the American military in all its subsequent wars still uses the Purple Hearts made for the invasion of Japan. The notion of having to fight for every street in such a gigantic country, with tens of millions ready to fight to the death, old women and children using spears, not a friendly face to be found, now with the added nightmares of gas and plagues was terrifying.
On November 20th, as the bloody battle of Iwo Jima went on, a strategy meeting was held at the White House. Wallace, Bradley, Eisenhower, Patton and others discussed how Japan could be brought to heel. When Wallace was informed of the human cost of the Japanese invasion, from both the American and Japanese perspective, he said there had to be a better way. No man wanted a repeat of the nightmare Americans had seen in Berlin. Ultimately, it was agreed that after taking several more islands to enable the American Air Force to get close to the Japanese mainland, the plan would simply be to blockade and bomb Japan into submission with various weapons, chemical included. The final ace they had, the Manhattan Project, would be used as soon as possible, with more resources allocated to the already nearly completed program as a Hail Mary attempt to save GIs from the utter bloodbath that awaited a full invasion. Owing to a senior member of the American government having gone there for Honeymoon, Kyoto was lucky enough to find itself off the list of targets. Now, with the chemical weapon Pandora opened by none other than the Japanese military themselves, Kyoto was finally put on the target list again. It would exclusively be for chemical weapons, so as to preserve the architecture of the city.
By the time Iwo Jima was declared secure, just before Christmas, nearly 10,000 Americans had died. The already terrible relationship between Japanese soldiers and Americans got worse still – it was exceedingly rare to hear a call for surrender from the Japanese side met with anything other than more rifle-shots. Many feared the Japanese had deliberately infected themselves and didn’t want them anywhere near. The poison gas had poisoned hearts as much as bodies. With American leaders already preparing themselves for the slaughter expected at Okinawa, Wallace went to Potsdam with the firm determination to make Japan lose as quickly as possible, with as little casualties as possible. Of course, there was only one man he knew that had the resources to stick a new, firm blow to the Japanese. Wallace hoped that a decisive Soviet advance into Asia would be enough of a blow to the militarists that they would see sense and surrender. It would lead to ‘Potsdam’ being just as infamous a word as ‘Munich’ in the common vocabulary of the Western world.
[1] – The Japanese never advanced as far into Burma as they did, and further resources and aid being available helps alleviate the Bengal Famine significantly.
[2] – Singapore holds out until June due to a tougher slog for the Japanese owing to the British not having to waste resources in the Mediterranean. Their dogged determination to fight to the end impresses the locals so much so they were called the ‘Lions of Lion City (Singapore)’, and the Japanese treatment of the ethnic Chinese in the city led to a much more pro-British line being developed.
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Ah damn. Well was totally expected the Japanese won't use restrain over biochemical weapons but arriving to use the bubonic plague...
The "only positive" thing would seem the Americans will go into universal healthcare TTL. For the rest this is really a very dark chapter. I honestly enjoyed it.
The "only positive" thing would seem the Americans will go into universal healthcare TTL. For the rest this is really a very dark chapter. I honestly enjoyed it.