Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Sorairo, Feb 20, 2019.
Wouldn't be the first time such a full circle has happened in history... ;D
Considering the current mood of nations worldwide, I do feel many countries will cut off South Africa once the National Party is elected to power and enforces Apartheid.
The West might make noises but the RA would probably will be willing to deal with them.
Supporting apartheid state might be bad for RA since segregationist is being hit pretty hard in the US. I doubt Mussolini want to piss off Patton.
Though I wonder if there is any local black fascist movement in Africa? Those might be more preferable.
Could Patton new Crusade actually stop apartheid happening?
If the National Party don’t get elected- say South Africans are worried about their new policy and trade/relations with the West because of it what happens to South Africa?
I just got through this timeline, and boy I have to find it dark (but in a good way, not in Darkness-Induced-Audience-Apathy dark).
There's also a TV Tropes page for this one, apparently, and I added some tropes to it: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WebOriginal/TheFootprintOfMussolini
I have a feeling that a lot of people are going to be disappointed, both amongst this ATLs' Progressives and amongst this thread.
There certainly will be far stricter enforcement of existing Civil Rights legislation, something which has been lackadaisical for many a moon in terms of willpower and funding, and what remains of the KKK will be gutted. The problem therein lies that the political will amongst those in Washington to do much more than that will be more or less nonexistent if it means threatening gains the Party has made over the last several years. Certainly there is a Progressive Republican faction present, but it is liable to be the smaller then the Conservative or Moderate factions that exist, the former making inroads into the South, the latter worried they may alienate core constituencies if they even agree with it. Patton certainly is a force to be reckoned with, but I don't see him as the kind of man who understands or even cares to understand the intricacies of moving legislation on the Hill.
Lots of frustration and hand-wringing.
I've been easing myself back into AH lately and when I found this one I couldn't stop reading. Of course I find it right when you're going on a mini-hiatus, right? But I must compliment you on the regular, high-quality updates you've been putting out thus far. I'm especially impressed by the globe-trotting, we're really being shown a whole world here. I will say what caught my attention is (initially) Neutral Fascist Italy, a POD I've always thought was woefully underutilized for proper TLs as opposed to just speculative discussion (and one of the very best and most detailed TLs on the subject, @Geekhis Khan's Viva Balbo, sadly went on indefinite hiatus just as it was barely getting started).
I was noticing this too, I normally prefer lighter TLs and this is by no means light, but I guess given the glut of post-apocalyptic and nuclear WWIII TLs we've had over the years - or even straight-up dystopias just for the sake of being dystopias - this one doesn't seem as bleak even though lots of horrible things have happened.
You also have a talent for turning a phrase, the dialogue and quotes throughout are excellent and also help to make the TL feel "lived-in". When you do return from your well-deserved break, please keep up the good work!
I think a big reason why this timeline never really feels grimdark despite being more tragic and bloodier than OTL (and that's saying a lot) is because it never descends into grimderp: even with the American slide into insanity it hasn't gone full on totalitarian dystopia yet, democracies like Britain and France are still around, people like Hitler and most of the Nazis still get their comeuppance, Judaism and the Jewish people as a whole is much better off ITTL (though sadly at the price of the Middle East being far worse than OTL).
As long as the world doesn't charge headlong into the darkness wholesale and there are points of light remaining, this timeline continues to work.
I find this to be only about as dark as reality. It's just a bit more bloody is all. I may just lack proper perspective.
I think it is overall a little bit darker than OTL, but on the flipside the really monstrous regimes tend to collapse very quickly indeed and totally discredit themselves in the process, whereas many lasted a long time OTL and still have their share of supporters.
There's more bloodshed, but seemingly also more hope for the future than in OTL.
This is indeed bit darker than OTL at lest by mid-1950's. But there is some hope left. And some countries and peoples are even in better situation than in OTL. But some had worse fate as in OTL. This is dark TL but not dystopia.
There are several hope spots. China may finally recover and bloom, as seen in Twilight of the Red Tsar.
So I just made this map of the world in October 1952
Wait, when did Tunisia go independent though?
Lovely map, although I notice Newfoundland isn't part of Canada yet, when IOTL it joined Confederation in 1949. It very well may not have happened ITTL, though it's hard to say - Canada is one of the very few parts of the world not covered in much detail as of yet in this TL.
"Grimderp". That is a thing of beauty right there, and I'm adding it to my vocabulary from now on
Some fiixng to map:
- Mongolia is Soviet puppet.
- I think that Crimea has lost its autonomy. I don't see why Stalin would act differently there.
- Indochina is still French colony I think.
- Shouldn't Burma be dominion?
Be nice if the stronger Commonwealth means Newfoundland is still its own country.
Perhaps even attempting to join the UK itself like some in Jamaica wanted to.
Separate names with a comma.