The Footprint of Mussolini - TL

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Sorairo, Feb 20, 2019.

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  1. DumbersTC The Sage of Time and Space

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    So what would happen to the British Raj ITTL?
     
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  2. Vornado Well-Known Member

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    Huh. Maybe I was wrong. I didn't think he'd be the kind to share the stage.
     
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  3. Lalli Well-Known Member

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    The Raj is probably still divided to Muslim and Hindu nations. It was already quiet inevitable since 1930's. India and Pakistan are probably dominions longer than in OTL when Churchill is till prime minister. Future bit too depends is Gandhi still assassinated or not.
     
  4. Noblesse Oblige Reaper Squad Member

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    I think he probably did think about it, but went against it.
     
  5. Sorairo Well-Known Member

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    At the moment, India is a Dominion, though it overwhelmingly wants full independence. Churchill is against it but Gaitskell is 100% for it.
     
  6. RyuDrago Italian? Yes, but also Roman

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    The India/Pakistan division happened as OTL or not? So in short there is a single Dominion or two?
     
  7. yeetboy Active Member

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    I wonder how economically powerful this new German kingdom could get. Considering that otl West Germany competed with France and the UK in GDP, under an enlightened monarch and now with territory encompassing all major population centres (save Berlin and territory annexed by the allies) this Germany could reestablish itself as the continental European leader against communism.
     
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  8. Sorairo Well-Known Member

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    Just the one, not that separatism is gone.
     
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  9. Drizzt Well-Known Member

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    That IMHO opinion depends mostly on how German internal political culture develops in TTL. In OTL after the end of the Cold War and reunification, Germany could also have taken a much more assertive role than it did. What held them back, was that no other country is more afraid of a resurgent Germany, than Germany itself.
    I'm not saying that things wont be different this time, but then again they might not. This is a matter of just how the different dice roll in TTL and I'd not consider the author going either way to be unrealistic.
     
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  10. estevech Active Member

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    I’m surprised in all these coronations Turkey didn’t crown a Sultan.
     
  11. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    I think it is because Turkey's military leaders have always been strong secularists, going back to Ataturk.

    They would strongly reject any attempt to bring back the Ottomans.
     
  12. President Earl Warren Well-Known Member

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    Well at least formally, Im sure their happy to use Ottomon imagery for their Greater Turkey ideas
     
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  13. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    Maybe, but modern Turkey's political traditions would reject an unabashed acceptance of a sultanate.
     
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  14. President Earl Warren Well-Known Member

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    oh im sure, its sort of like how the Nazis and co. used Imagery of Tuetonic Knights and called back to the Holy Roman Empire, They want to use their legacy without acutally adopting any of their rules or governance.
     
  15. traveller76 Member

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    Turkey would keep a authoritarian type Republic that praised 'Turkishness' with the military basically dismissing the Parliament if they believe it to be a threat. The Alliance would let them do this in return for military bases, commercial access and since they have a border with the Russians. As for India and Pakistan, well if we go by OTL then Pakistan will eventually become like the Turks and other countries were the military and intelligence services are the largest powerbrokers. India would still be friendly towards the Russians and view the Alliance and ETO as 'imperialists' but may be more economically liberal. The Indian National Congress will still be a majority party but you may see more National Socialist/Authoritarian parties and movements like the RSS with an earlier start.
     
  16. thanix01 Well-Known Member

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    Would modern Turkey be more secular in this timeline? Authoritarian secular but secular non the less.
     
  17. Falecius Well-Known Member

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    In Islamicate political tradition, there's little idea that (hereditary) secular* monarchy has any inherent legitimacy as such. So, crowning someone is unlikely to bring symbolic unity of the nation and institutional stability in the way they'd be supposed to work in Constitutional Monarchies emerged from the Western tradition, nor would the newly chosen monarch be able to appeal to a "sacral" role of royalty or heavenly mandate like you could find in India or East Asia. Of course, this does not stop constitutional monarchies to exist in Muslim countries, and some dynasties have great prestige because of their lineage (in Morocco and Jordan for instance) sometimes tied to descent from the Prophet. However, all these monarchs do reign partly because they rule, as in, they are not purely ceremonial.

    *The Caliphate is not entirely secular.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
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  18. Herr Frage Jesus Christ Is In Heaven

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    Hard to say, I suppose it would depend on how the populace receive the policies handed down. As it is I could see a number of Turks on the Left and Right disliking the Imperialism Turkey is partaking in and supporting against their neighbors.

    Well given what we saw of the FGA during the war they seem like a faction that would support a return of German power. The Clean Wehrmacht myth has also been referenced alot. And of course Rommel has lead Israeli forces to victory in an immensely prominent campaign. Also with Wallace's actions there would be less confidence the Allies are capable of defending Germany from the Communists.

    So, how much will attitudes change in the general populace? No idea, but there are a lot of factors at work that were not present OTL.
     
  19. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    The fact that Rommel is fighting alongside the Israelis makes the "Clean Wehrmacht" myth a lot more palatable, or at least makes it seem like the army was just as cowed by the Nazi Party as the average German.
     
  20. gurgu proud genoese

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    Since there is no hate over the british in TTL, there can be a better course for Genoa CFC ( the oldest italian football team, 1893, founded from english people) which in OTL suffered what has been declared from the guardian the biggest fraud in football history in 1925 when they disputed the final of the italian league against Bologna 5 times until it was clear that bologna was helped from fascist arpinati, friend of Benny.
    https://gentlemanultra.com/2018/07/30/red-and-blue-rivals-bologna-genoa-and-the-great-theft-of-1925/
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2019
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