The Esch Cummins Act: US Railroad Consolidation program

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Andrew Boyd, Feb 28, 2018.

  1. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Perhaps, but my current official TL does have the SP build their own line from LA via Long Beach and Anaheim in the 1930s.
     
  2. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Any ideas for a new passenger train I can introduce in my TL's 1948?
     
  3. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    @TheMann

    I was thinking my TL's 1940s oil crisis could lead to the discovery of new oil locations.

    How does Mexico sound as an excellent place to start?
     
  4. isayyo2 Low Key

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    How about the ATSF upgrading the San Diegian by electrifying their route to compete with the new SP route?

    As for new passenger trains... A route from Los Angeles to Mexico City seems logical, especially with the Mexican oil boom you plan on writing.
     
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  5. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    When do you think that should happen? and where could I start?

    Perhaps we could see the NdeM split up earlier than OTL?
     
  6. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Any thought on how I can prevent a coal miner's strike in 1948 using my TL's Oil Crisis?
     
  7. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Possible Locations for my TL's Steamtown, anyone?

    I would prefer it

    So far I have:
    - Ex-DL&W yards in Scranton
    - Ex-CNJ yards in Ashley
    - Ex-NYO&W branch yard in Scranton.

    Any other ideas? Ideally, it would be in NE Pennsylvania, but other ideas for in the Northeast are welcome.
     
  8. Kevin C. Smith Pangean Seperatist

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    Around here, someplace...let me look...
    Sorry about a late reply but life has kept me away from the interwebs for a while...but, fwiw at this point in time, I would say:

    -B&O almost HAS to have RDG/CNJ. Without their access to the port of New York/New Jersey, an independent B&O is a really sick man, indeed. Even as a merger partner, it wouldn't be worth near as much to either the NYC or the C&O. They are going to get it for a song, either just before or from the bankruptcy court.

    -If anyone else gets the RDG/CNJ I can't see any regulated environment letting the Pennsy get ahold of it. The monopoly of coal lines and NY/NJ access would be too overwhelming. Expect a chorus of singed cats no matter what.

    -WAB/LV makes perfect sense with the PRR, and there was a sufficient otl relationship that you can pull it off easily enough imo. But...with the CP? Now that is intriguing! I have to admit that I haven't caught up on all the missed posts in this thread so let me ask, does CP still have otl Soo Line (WC, DSS&A, MStP&SSteM)? If so, acquiring the WAB will provide CP with not only access to Chicago from the east, but St. Louis and Omaha. That leaves a tantalizing gap between Omaha and the Twin Cities. Two candidates to close that "iron circle" that spring to my mind: the Chicago Great Western (which iirc, you have had part of the AT&SF?), or...the Minneapolis & Saint Louis. The Louie becomes a trunk line! I think this intrigues me the most on this list.

    The B&M has a chance at independence with an all-northern New England (MEC and B&A) merger...but where have you put the Delaware & Hudson? A combination with that (or with whoever has that, if not the NYC) would make for a nice New England regional, or access to New England for someone. (Fwiw, I always thought that would combine well with the ERIE.)
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
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  9. isayyo2 Low Key

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    Probably in the 30s starting off either by SP or ATSF, depending on the season they could be Pullman sleepers or tourist coaches. After the Oil rush, the train could be upgraded as a diesel streamliner and ideally cut the travel time under a day with improved equipment and track conditions within Mexico.
     
  10. Kevin C. Smith Pangean Seperatist

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    It was a long, hard (and international) route to get to a place that the AT&SF got to with water level ease. Another problem is that it was only of value for longer haul, eastbound traffic (AT&SF just had to take traffic to Los Angeles, and add it to traffic to/from there.

    It would be possible to upgrade, rebuild, and improve it into an reliable route (in a geographically terrible area), but I cannot imagine that game as being worth the candle. Unless San Diego becomes the container port LA has, there isn't enough traffic going in the right direction.
     
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  11. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Yes. So I may have TTL be WC, DSS&A, MStP&SSteM, and WAB going to the CP.

    While the CN can o with SP to get the MILW stake instead. As CP already has too big control in the Midwest.
     
  12. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    I'm also unsure of what to do with the Missouri Pacific now that BN is no longer butterflied ITTL.

    So far, I saw it getting the CGW then joining with C&NW.

    I was thinking I could have it be absorbed into the Union Pacific. Whereas the MKT instead goes to BN with ATSf getting the SLSF.

    Or the MoPac could be semi-independent by going elsewhere other than CNW as it becomes part of the UP.
     
  13. Lucas Well-Known Member

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    @Andrew Boyd, what railroads exist in ITTL 2019 and lines that would be incorporated. I think in made a map of them to give a better vision. And what yould be electric routes and HSR lines?

    And did you take the drawings o send to you? What are you planning make?

    And what you think about the Boston & Western railroad?
     
  14. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    I'll get to that tomorrow.

    I'll think about that tomorrow. But I'll know many electrics may come in use.
     
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  15. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Ok, first of I was thinking Santa Fe gets the Frisco. Then the M&StL and a Wabash line from La Plata, MO to Aida, IA to connect it all.

    Southern Pacific absorbs the Cotton Belt. Then uses the Trona shortline to make the Las Vegas lines. Whereas further east, they'll likely get the Rock Island, and sell of that railroad's line to Illinois Central.
     
  16. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    Do you guys think I should have Truman de-regulate the railroads? If so, maybe in 1948, and then what de-regulations should I allow?
     
  17. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    This is something I've been pondering for a while.

    An airport serving as the base for a vast intermodal facility. Including a new Union Station, train-truck-plane transfer, the works.

    So far, I've thought of Midway Airport as an ideal example for Chicago. With JFK International being the counterpart for New York. Whereas @isayyo2 has proposed Oakland International as one for the San Fransisco area with BARTs, streetcars, and in my TL four railroads: Santa Fe, Southern Pacific, Rio Grande, and Union Pacific (through owning 50% of the Central Pacific).

    Other ideas are welcome on this front.
     
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  18. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    So far, here are the airports I can imagine being the base for major intermodal transit in both freight and passenger. Complete with a Union Station in the same building as the airport. If anyone has an idea for which airport would work best for such a thing, go ahead and comment.

    - New York, NY
    - Chicago, IL
    - St. Louis, MO
    - Atlanta, GA
    - Denver, CO
    - Ft. Worth/Dallas, TX
    - Los Angeles, CA
    - San Fransisco, CA
    - Portland, OR
    - Seattle, WA
    - Miami, FL
     
  19. Bureaucromancer Well-Known Member

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    I've usually contemplated Eisenhower doing something alongside the interstate highway program, but Truman works as well. What is your focus though? If you're looking for it to meaningfully prevent the decline deregulation is going to have to let railroads negotiate freight rates much earlier. Loosening anti-trust in terms of intermodal operations and involvement with utilities might help in some places, but the big issues with regulation really was freight rates being so inflexible as to make abandonment more palatable than the investment needed to compete successfully with trucking.

    It's a bit of a trope at this point, but what I always picture as making a real difference would be the interstate program being accompanied with something to subsidize loans to railroads, deregulation of freight rates and increased scrutiny of both abandonment and mergers.
     
  20. Andrew Boyd Autistic, but Artistic

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    That's mostly what I had in mind. But I have also considered letting the railroads set their own passenger fares.