The Crusade of 1101 Successful

[Hermanubis]

Between the 1st and 2nd Crusades there was another great movement of Catholic Christian armies into the near east in defense of Jerusalem. This uncounted Crusade, the Crusade of 1101, most likely went uncounted due to its disastrous outcome. Around 1100, many nobles and knights of who had sworn Crusader vows but who had failed to join the successful first Crusade, as well as many who admired the success of Bohemond, Godfrey and the other knights of the First Crusade assembled armies and set out for the Lavant. There were four main armies, a French-Burgundian army lead by Stephen of Blois, a Lombard army lead by Albert of Biandrate, a French army lead by William II of Nevers and a French-German army lead by William IX Duke of Aquitanie and Welf IV Duke of Bavaria. These four armies together were much larger then that of the First Crusade, however instead of marching together these armies set out separately. Only the Burgundian army lead by Stephen of Blois and the Lombard army lead by Albert of Biandrate joined together. These two armies met together at Constnatinople in April 1101, were Byzantine Emperor Alexius Comnenus appointed Raymond of Toulouse, successful veteran of the first Crusade, as their leader. Instead of marching to Jerusalem as was their original intent, the combined Burgundian-Lombard army marched into Seljuk territory in the direction of Neocaesarea with the intent of freeing Bohemond of Antioch who was at this time held prisoner by Ghazi Gumushtekin Ibn of Danishmend. The Crusader army took the Seljuk Turkish city of Ankara June 23 1101; Alarmed by the actions of this large Crusader army, Seljuk Turkish Sultan Kilij Arslan allied with traditional rivals Ghazi Gumushtekin Ibn of Danishmend and Ridwan of Aleppo. The combined Turkish army destroyed the Burgundian-Lombard army under Raymond of Toulouse at the battle of Mersivan. Only a few knights, including Raymond of Toulouse, escaped the massacre. The other three armies would march through Anatolia, and one by one would be destroyed by Turkish forces in turn. This completely disastrous campaign would discourage Crusader Knights and settlers for years and encourage the Muslims.

So what if the Crusade of 1101 was more successful?

 

[JamesFox]

Here's a scenario

Well, the 4 armies were involved were supposed to meet up in Constantinople in the summer of 1101, but thanks to impatience and the fact that they arrived over a period of a few weeks meant that only the first two armies (the ones involed in the big battle) actually did so. However, the forces did not arrive *that* far apart, so really, it would hardly have been implausible for the forces involved to display some patience.

So, in a rehash/reprint of something I posted earlier is soc.history.what-if:
Our POD: Raymond, in Nicomedia with the first 2 armies (now one), hears that other Crusader forces are soon to arrive in Constantinople. He decides to incorporate them into his army. This delays his departure for possibly as much as two months.

A possible sequence of events:

-The Crusader army heads east in early August, and they take Ancyra in late August.

-Because of the late departure of the Crusader army, the Turks have had more time to marshall their forces. Thus, they meet the Crusader army not far east of Ancyra. A battle results. Thanks to the large size of Raymond's army (as large as the armies of the first Crusade), the Turks are badly defeated.

-However, the Lombards performed poorly in the battle (as per OTL). Combined with the recent victory, and Raymond's dislike of Bohemund, Raymond decides he doesn't really need the Lombards, and heads south to Konya. The Lombards vow to rescue Bohemund themselves.

-Raymond attacks Konya near the end of September. Unlike OTL, the combination of a large army and Raymond's determination allows the Crusaders to capture Konya, which is handed over to the Emperor.

-Meanwhile, the Lombards are making a nuisance of themselves in Danishmendid territory. The emir Malik, deciding that the Muslim alliance has failed, decides to make peace with the Crusaders, releasing Bohemund to the Lombards, and gathering what forces he has to grab as much Seljuk territory as he can before the Emperor Alexius takes all of it. He carefully avoids heading south.

-Raymond heads east from Konya, capturing Heraclea for the Empire, and clearing the overland routes to Cilician Armenia.

-Bohemund now has a smallish, but enthusiastic, army of Lombards. He heads south, worried that Raymond is going to use his Crusader army to take 
Antioch away from him in the name of the Emperor.

So now we have two Crusader armies descending upon the Levant. Raymond will want to carve out some estates for himself, ald Aleppo and Damascus now seem more vulnerable.

I would appreciate any comments.

 

[Hermanubis]

Well, the 4 armies were involved were supposed to meet up in Constantinople in the summer of 1101, but thanks to impatience and the fact that they arrived over a period of a few weeks meant that only the first two armies (the ones involed in the big battle) actually did so. However, the forces did not arrive *that* far apart, so really, it would hardly have been implausible for the forces involved to display some patience.

So, in a rehash/reprint of something I posted earlier is soc.history.what-if:
Our POD: Raymond, in Nicomedia with the first 2 armies (now one), hears that other Crusader forces are soon to arrive in Constantinople. He decides to incorporate them into his army. This delays his departure for possibly as much as two months.

A possible sequence of events:

-The Crusader army heads east in early August, and they take Ancyra in late August.

-Because of the late departure of the Crusader army, the Turks have had more time to marshall their forces. Thus, they meet the Crusader army not far east of Ancyra. A battle results. Thanks to the large size of Raymond's army (as large as the armies of the first Crusade), the Turks are badly defeated.

-However, the Lombards performed poorly in the battle (as per OTL). Combined with the recent victory, and Raymond's dislike of Bohemund, Raymond decides he doesn't really need the Lombards, and heads south to Konya. The Lombards vow to rescue Bohemund themselves.

-Raymond attacks Konya near the end of September. Unlike OTL, the combination of a large army and Raymond's determination allows the Crusaders to capture Konya, which is handed over to the Emperor.

-Meanwhile, the Lombards are making a nuisance of themselves in Danishmendid territory. The emir Malik, deciding that the Muslim alliance has failed, decides to make peace with the Crusaders, releasing Bohemund to the Lombards, and gathering what forces he has to grab as much Seljuk territory as he can before the Emperor Alexius takes all of it. He carefully avoids heading south.

-Raymond heads east from Konya, capturing Heraclea for the Empire, and clearing the overland routes to Cilician Armenia.

-Bohemund now has a smallish, but enthusiastic, army of Lombards. He heads south, worried that Raymond is going to use his Crusader army to take 
Antioch away from him in the name of the Emperor.

So now we have two Crusader armies descending upon the Levant. Raymond will want to carve out some estates for himself, ald Aleppo and Damascus now seem more vulnerable.

I would appreciate any comments.

Pretty good, thank you

My sources seem to think that if the Crusade of 1101 was more successful, or at least not a complete disaster as it was OTL, that it would encourage more settlement from Western Europe and that proceeding Crusades would be more successful due to the overland rout continuing to be available.

(might be too optimistic, but on the other hand the importance of continuing the successful momentum of the 1st Crusade probably shouldn't be underestimated)

 

[Hermanubis]

This seems to have been a pretty critical moment in the development of the Crusader states, and I think the Crusade of 1101 has a lot of Alternate History potential.

 

[Epimethius]

Having read this im pretty curious, i would love to see what a stronger crusader states looks like.

 

[Hermanubis]

There are a lot of possibilities here, and I think it might be possible for the Crusader states to ultimately survive if the fallowing conditions are met:

1) permanent European colonization in large numbers

2) Secure boarder and friendly relations with Byzantium

3) capture of Aleppo and Damascus, thus securing all of Syria

If the Crusade of 1101 is successful all three of these things might be accomplished