The Anglo/American - Nazi War

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by CalBear, Nov 8, 2009.

  1. RanulfC Well-Known Member

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    (Yes I know
    but bear with me a bit I think this is a good point :) )

    Actually in regards to the idea that somehow the Nazi's had developed some serious advanced technology was quite obviously OTL from the fact they in fact had. After all we'd seen jet aircraft, advanced tanks and weapons so the general consensus was they had a lot to offer or why would the Allies, (and specifically the US) go to such great lengths to horde that skill and knowledge? I recall a 1950-ish story in an old sci-fi magazine where Nazi's kidnap a US Congressman to warn him the Russians have developed flying saucer technology they stole from the Germans. (Did I mention they kidnap him IN a flying saucer and are taking him to meet Hitler who faked his death and is now living in a secret base in Antarctica? Oh and they have a Moonbase too but in the end they come to find out the other saucers are NOT the Russians... Sorry for starting an interstellar was there Earth)

    And it carried on even though for the most part Operation Paperclip was aimed more at denying the Russians German knowledge and skills than keeping it for ourselves. (Sticking Von Braun out in the desert for a couple of years actually makes sense in that context) But the 'myth' was born of wartime paranoia and fear and it stuck so much into popular culture that you have throwaway line in Star Trek for example of "Nazi efficiency" and advance Eugenics work that is completed by the 1990s based on the idea the Nazi's were actually doing real research...

    It's fascinating to look into but it's just plain implausible and really the rest of the world wasn't that far behind if they were at all anyway. (And ya, barring literally ASBs giving the Nazi's a leg up they simply weren't as advanced as they tried to say they were) And here in this TL there's simply no defense that they COULD have been that advanced. The evidence is right there up front and obvious. No flying saucers, no laser weapons, no free-energy or zero-point physics and no nuclear weapons so no point to base the speculation on. (Thanks CalBear, stuff like that was of great amusement to me growing up and now TTL's "I" is probably bored out of his mind... That's on you ;) )

    TTL neither the Nazi's nor the Japanese have the same luster as OTL and that's another thing I'd like to see explored someday.

    Randy
     
  2. sloreck Grunt Bear

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    The problem with "eugenics" as it was at the time, is that absent the discovery of DNA and the "genetic code" the whole bit was based on phenotypes and moonshine. OTL we can isolate a large number of specific genes that cause specific problems, of course we can't yet map things like intelligence, longevity (as opposed to causes of decreased lifespan), athletic ability and so forth which are more complex than point mutations. All that is before the "racial" elements of eugenics were tossed in.
     
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  3. Tales Weaver Just An Ordinary CItizen

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    Or just the opposite happens: the A4 space mining is successful, but result in economic crash as it drove the prices of raw materials down to the level the economy can't handle.
     
  4. steamboy Well-Known Member

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    If I recall, there was some little bit written about Hitler's real tomb, somewhere deep in some mountains that had been sealed off and then was found again. But I can't find it anywhere. Am I mis-remembering or am I looking in the wrong place?
     
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  5. nbcman Donor

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    Hitler's tomb was in Berlin but was destroyed per this post from the Author which was in response to two other posts:


     
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  6. Rorke Generic Beer

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    What were the military casualties suffered by the United States?
     
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  7. steamboy Well-Known Member

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    No its not that, I'm sure I remember reading about some tomb hidden somewhere in the alps, the guards killed themselves when it was sealed up and buried, full of plundered treasure etc and I think it was someone important's resting place, hidden in the alps or something.
     
  8. xxmagex Well-Known Member

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  9. Geon Well-Known Member

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    The U.S. lost 800,000 which is more then any of its other wars. Combined with the casualties to the UK, Canada, and Australia I can understand the reasoning behind the A4's actions in the post war timeline i.e. never again!

    Also, I am guessing that Memorial Day and the day for the end of World War II probably take on a somber significance in TTL.
     
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  10. kio Well-Known Member

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    What does nazi military technology look like at the end of the war? Obviously we saw SLBMs and mach 2 cruise missiles, so is it more advanced than 1960s technology OTL?
    Also, I feel like morale and wartime protests would eventually seek one side to attempt to develop a peace agreement, no matter how much anger is in the air. Is there a specific reason that didn't happen?
     
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  11. nbcman Donor

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    In AANW Nazi Germany? Not likely. There were a series of defections / peace treaties that were signed after the US and UK nuke attacks (see post 3383) but the Nazis weren't giving up and didn't give up after they were turned into a radioactive, chemically soaked, virulent hell hole in places (Nuremberg & Berlin). The Allies kept up the fight because they couldn't trust the Germans not to strike again.
     
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  12. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    Also, the German people apparently lived so well during the 1950s ceasefire, that many Germans were convinced the war against Nazism would be a brief disruption, after which they could return to their bread and circuses.
     
  13. kio Well-Known Member

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    what about the allies? 800k+ casualties from the US, and untold destruction and casualties from the British over the course of 20ish years of continued war must have started to convince some people.
     
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  14. Geon Well-Known Member

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    Any attempts to protest the war on the Nazi side would have been quickly doomed to failure with the protestors disappearing in the night and never being heard again.

    On the allied side between the St. Patrick's Day raid, the attacks with nerve agents on London that resulted in the deaths of the royal family, the discovery of the massive genocide and slave labor plantations going on behind the German lines, and the fanatical resistance of the Nazis every step of the way I don't see any room for negotiation here except complete and unconditional surrender.
     
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  15. englerp Well-Known Member

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  16. Historyman 14 Well-Known Member

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  17. sloreck Grunt Bear

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    Nacht und Nebel was the fate of anyone who was too open in opposing the Nazi regime. Here, with a "victory" in WWII and the subsequent lifestyle for Aryans, support for antiregime thought or action was much less.
     
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  18. Bookmark1995 Bookmark95 Reborn!

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    It was only when American troops were knocking on German doors that many Germans actually considered mass surrender.
     
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  19. RanulfC Well-Known Member

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  20. Hal Jordan Alternatehistory95

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    How are atheists and agnostics treated ITTL in the A4?
     
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