The Anglo/American - Nazi War - The on-going mystery

Yeah the Allies had already broken out by then and were pushing for the inner German border itself. Its the same issue as Japan in OTL 1945, they can't catch up if they had ten years to do so, the Allies can roam at will and kill any attempt they do make, and both the industrial capacity and the brainpower long since either ceased to exist or fled.
I *think* that the 3R could have created Nuclear Weapons in WWII *if* they had been handed information on the entire tech of the Manhattan Project in 1939, they probably would have had to cancel the V Rockets for money. The US basically tried *all* of the possible ways (before coming around to the idea that the British and French were on the right track in 1939). OTOH, by the time that the Americans know that a Nuclear Weapon is possible (that the Manhattan Project had gotten things to barely supercritical) (1943?) It is *far* too late for the 3R to pick it up (and that would have been even with *perfect* spies.).

I'd be *very* surprised if the 3R iTTL had any successful spies in the US by 1958, much less in the Manhattan Project.
 
Second batch of wikibox on pre-Hot War and post-World War 2

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The flag of Chinese Nationalist Confederation is from this:
And the Korean one:
 

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What happens to Moscow in ITTL? The Red Army was able to repel the Germans in December 1941. So there is a Second Battle of Moscow in which the Germans succeed this time?

As for the Korean Revolution, does it serve as the Korean War ITTL with a mix of the OTL Vietnam War?

I'd see that's the official name of the Cabal: Chinese National Confederation. Where does KMT base on? Still in Taiwan?
 
What happens to Moscow in ITTL? The Red Army was able to repel the Germans in December 1941. So there is a Second Battle of Moscow in which the Germans succeed this time?

As for the Korean Revolution, does it serve as the Korean War ITTL with a mix of the OTL Vietnam War?

I'd see that's the official name of the Cabal: Chinese National Confederation. Where does KMT base on? Still in Taiwan?
The Moscow was completely fucked up during the 1941-43. Read on this:

As you can see, the Korean Revolution might look a lot like Malayan Emergency, Indochina War and Korean War.

Some threads mentioning Taiwan and KMT is here:
 
This might sound a bit eccentric but I wonder what the status of the Seven Dirty Words is in this reality!

 
If the Anglo-American – Nazi War (AANW) were to be adapted into a TV series, let's say in the style of HBO, the posthumous villains AANW Himmler would undoubtedly be classified as a Complete Monster, receiving automatic approval from the Villains Wiki community due to obvious reasons that elicit complete disdain. Not only would AANW Himmler already be included in the Pure Evil wiki, but he would also be added to the Hate Sink and Pathetic Pinhead wikis as well, reflecting the overwhelming contempt and strong sentiment of loathing towards him. In terms of the intensity of hatred from the community, AANW Himmler would surpass even fellow Hate Sink like Joffrey Baratheon and Shou Tucker. It goes without saying that most figures categorized as Pure Evil or Hate Sink (excluding Red Skull and other Nazis who were under Pure Evil or Hate Sink) would utterly despise AANW Himmler and the Nazis in general.

The depiction of the Nazis in the adaptation of the Anglo-American – Nazi War (AANW) would unquestionably be one of the most vile and reviled portrayals of Nazis in any form of media, even by the standards of the alternate history genre. Similar to how the Injustice Joker is responsible for Superman's descent into becoming a dictator in the Injustice timeline, the Nazis in the AANW would bear the brunt of the blame. Their almost successful execution of the Generalplan Ost, aimed at depopulating Eastern Europe and European Russia, the horrifying Holocaust they carried out, the destruction of cultural sites in Paris and across Europe, and their role in the infamous St. Patrick's Day Raids resulting in the deaths of numerous members of the British Royal Family, including the Queen Mother herself, are just some of the atrocities they are responsible for. Furthermore, their inadvertent role in the emergence of the Atomic 4 (A4) and the subsequent post-war philosophy would have severe consequences. Their actions would lead to disproportionate retribution, such as imposing sanctions on non-A4 nations for venturing into space beyond 65 miles above the Earth, considering it an act of war. The "Nazis" of the post-war world, colloquially known as the Germans, became the ultimate boogeyman, with the rest of the world harboring intense hostility towards them for generational and forbidding any future reunification of Germany to prevent a repeat of the A4's Rods of God devastating orbital strikes, akin to what occurred in Stettin. The AANW Nazis, including Himmler himself, have already surpassed even the Injustice Joker in terms of the "descent into villainy," albeit on a much larger organizational scale. Even the Injustice Joker himself would be horrified and filled with loathing for the actions perpetrated by the AANW Nazis in this timeline, despite his own unforgivable deeds.

"The world shall kneel before me!"
- A4 leadership Superman/George Newburn exclaims, as they viewed the entire world challenging their ideals of enforced peace and zero tolerance for war and genocide. The A4's perspective saw their actions as necessary for the sake of democracy, even though they resorted to disproportionate retribution, such as utilizing the Rods of God as a means of punishment.

The twisted irony lies in the fact that the Atomic 4 (A4) would make the One Earth Regime from Injustice appear sane and democratic in comparison, despite their trigger-happy approach and lack of remorse for committing war crimes. It didn't matter what the nations' intentions were, whether it involved the reunification of Germany or launching into space without the A4's permission – any action was deemed an act of war in the A4's eyes.
That war would be basically China vs. rest of the World. Most of these deaths would are Chinese. Yes, it would be really horrible (IIRC CalBear even said that it is so horrible that he doesn't even dare to write that) but most of nations would recover eventually. A4 would recover probably pretty soon. Worst situation with China would be in Africa and other poor regions/countries.
In moments when Calbear had "Strawman Has a Point" consider, one can imagine the potential outcome if he were to write a seasonal Mass Death Scenario. In this extreme scenario, if he was able to write, revolves around the A4's intense trigger-sadness and spite towards the Cabal's unleashing of a powerful plague on nations, with the objective of annihilating non-Chinese populations. As a result, the A4 activates their space bombardment Rods of God, targeting China. The world witnesses this horrifying event and immediately views the A4 as surpassing the level of the Nazis, making them a pariah and causing the collapse of the existing A4's world order. The magnitude of the A4's destruction of China would overshadow the atrocities committed by the Nazis, as the death toll of billions would render the post-war order seemingly irrelevant in comparison to the Nazi regime's actions that claimed around 100+ million lives.

Essentially, the A4 experiences the bitter taste of its own medicine in this catastrophic scenario.
 
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In moments when Calbear had "Strawman Has a Point" consider, one can imagine the potential outcome if he were to write a seasonal Mass Death Scenario. In this extreme scenario, if he was able to write, revolves around the A4's intense trigger-sadness and spite towards the Cabal's unleashing of a powerful plague on nations, with the objective of annihilating non-Chinese populations. As a result, the A4 activates their space bombardment Rods of God, targeting China. The world witnesses this horrifying event and immediately views the A4 as surpassing the level of the Nazis, making them a pariah and causing the collapse of the existing A4's world order. The magnitude of the A4's destruction of China would overshadow the atrocities committed by the Nazis, as the death toll of billions would render the post-war order seemingly irrelevant in comparison to the Nazi regime's actions that claimed around 100+ million lives.

Essentially, the A4 experiences the bitter taste of its own medicine in this catastrophic scenario.

Future of A4 is indeed intresting. Already that pandemic will cause lot of chaos and since A4 hardly is sharing vaccines for everyone/some antivax groups would cause hard opposition to A4. And there would be lot of riots around the world. I doubt that A4 is able to deal all with that. Furthermore there is going to be millions refugees from that what was China. And yes, even if people wouldn't love Chinese very much anymore they would are really horrified about acts of A4.

And don't forgot what kind of climate effects destrouction fo China with WMDs would has. That all of dust on athmosphere would cause as severe nuclear winter what was caused by K/T Impact which killed non-avian dinosaurs. Humanity would survive but there would be lot of crop failures and famines. A4 probably would survive but the world would be extremely divided.
 
The Moscow was completely fucked up during the 1941-43. Read on this:
I could imagine Moscow being turned into rubble. The Germans would want to destroy it for symbolic reasons: capital of the archnemesis and a symbol of communism/bolshevism. Leningrad (beairng the name sake of Leninsm) and Stalingrad (bearing the name sake of Hitler's archnemesis) would receive the same treatment.
As you can see, the Korean Revolution might look a lot like Malayan Emergency, Indochina War and Korean War.
It is like the OTL Korean War at all. Including the UN sending forces to the peninsula.

RE: KMT and Taiwan
Ok so Taiwan is independent. The Cabal (Chinese Nationalist Confederation) did defeat the KMT or at least push them into exile. One of the links you mentioned is that Chiang is forming a government-in-exile in the Philippines.

Anyhow, correct me if I am wrong.
If the Anglo-American – Nazi War (AANW) were to be adapted into a TV series, let's say in the style of HBO, the posthumous villains AANW Himmler would undoubtedly be classified as a Complete Monster, receiving automatic approval from the Villains Wiki community due to obvious reasons that elicit complete disdain. Not only would AANW Himmler already be included in the Pure Evil wiki, but he would also be added to the Hate Sink and Pathetic Pinhead wikis as well, reflecting the overwhelming contempt and strong sentiment of loathing towards him. In terms of the intensity of hatred from the community, AANW Himmler would surpass even fellow Hate Sink like Joffrey Baratheon and Shou Tucker. It goes without saying that most figures categorized as Pure Evil or Hate Sink (excluding Red Skull and other Nazis who were under Pure Evil or Hate Sink) would utterly despise AANW Himmler and the Nazis in general.
TV Tropes already lists him as such.

I'd imagine the equivalent of Downfall "Hitler rant" scene would be made. Instead of Hitler losing it, Himmler will lose it as he orders everything in Europe to be destroyed out of spite.
 
I'd imagine the equivalent of Downfall "Hitler rant" scene would be made. Instead of Hitler losing it, Himmler will lose it as he orders everything in Europe to be destroyed out of spite.
It would probably not be turned into a meme or at least nowhere as popular since this time that rant would be attached to a lot of historical trauma and baggage even if it was just as pathetic
 
TV Tropes already lists him as such.
I understand that you're referring to the AH.com site where AANW Himmler labeled as a Complete Monster. However, in the context of a hypothetical HBO adaptation of AANW, Himmler's portrayal would instantly establish him as a pure evil villain within the series. The Villains Wiki community wouldn't require a separate proposal for AANW Himmler, as his extreme atrocities would already be widely despised and automatically approved by the community. In fact, both the Hate Sink and Pathetic Pinhead communities would strongly dislike AANW Himmler to the extent that he would already be listed on those wikis for similar reasons as on the Villains Wiki.
I'd imagine the equivalent of Downfall "Hitler rant" scene would be made. Instead of Hitler losing it, Himmler will lose it as he orders everything in Europe to be destroyed out of spite.
AANW Himmler's rant would be deeply unsettling, evoking obscenity and crossing a serious moral threshold. The horrific orders by AANW Himmler could give, such as the destruction of Paris before the Allies could liberate it. This act alone, broadcast live to the world where Paris in ruins, would be seen as a grave Moral Event Horizon, even without considering the content of the rant itself. To put it into perspective, think of Joffrey Baratheon from A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones conquering Westeros, only for a rebellion to swiftly rise up against him. Within a week, Joffrey would descend into complete madness, unleashing his fury on anyone who dared oppose his rule, ordering the destruction of everything in his path. This would make Robert's Rebellion pale in comparison. In essence, AANW Himmler would resemble a hypothetical scenario where Joffrey's tyranny reaches its peak. In fact, AANW Himmler would become one of the most detestable villains in the history of HBO adaptations, even considering the portrayal of historical characters within the alternate history genre. His obsession for death and destruction in his quest to glorify Nazi ideologies would ensure his place among the most despised characters of all time in any media.
It would probably not be turned into a meme or at least nowhere as popular since this time that rant would be attached to a lot of historical trauma and baggage even if it was just as pathetic
If we were to imagine an AANW Himmler's rant, it would be reminiscent of a dark, mature version of Sonic SatAM where the portrayal of Dr. Robotnik takes a much darker turn. Instead of his usual objective of enslaving Mobius, this version of Dr. Robotnik would exhibit the same level of depravity and obsession with death and destruction as AANW Himmler. Let's say Dr. Robotnik orders Snively and his robotic forces to raze every city of Mobius before Sonic and the Freedom Fighters have a chance to liberate them, resulting in a tragic outcome. This incarnation of Dr. Robotnik in the SatAM series would be equivalent to AANW Himmler in terms of being detestable and irredeemable. Given the disturbing nature of such a scene, I can agree that AANW Himmler's rant would make anyone watching it feel extremely uncomfortable, to the point where even Germany from our timeline would likely ban the AANW HBO adaptation.
 
How do you think that Himmler would compare with the version in the "The Man in the High Castle" series?
TMITHC Himmler went from pragmatic to megalomaniac once he had an idea the Germans could conquer alt worlds by simply marching troops and tanks through the portal. Thankfully, his pragmatic side went back after the failed assassination that wounded him so he sent spies to siphon alt world information which the Germans could use to their advantage. TMITHC Himmler was more a "likable" villain.

ANNW Himmler would have terrified anybody.
 
How do you think that Himmler would compare with the version in the "The Man in the High Castle" series?

It would probably not be turned into a meme or at least nowhere as popular since this time that rant would be attached to a lot of historical trauma and baggage even if it was just as pathetic
Older people would shock and heartbreak because their beautiful city like Paris and Orleans was razed because of him. And the same thing applies to the Germans citizens.
 
I could imagine Moscow being turned into rubble. The Germans would want to destroy it for symbolic reasons: capital of the archnemesis and a symbol of communism/bolshevism. Leningrad (beairng the name sake of Leninsm) and Stalingrad (bearing the name sake of Hitler's archnemesis) would receive the same treatment.

It is like the OTL Korean War at all. Including the UN sending forces to the peninsula.

RE: KMT and Taiwan
Ok so Taiwan is independent. The Cabal (Chinese Nationalist Confederation) did defeat the KMT or at least push them into exile. One of the links you mentioned is that Chiang is forming a government-in-exile in the Philippines.

Anyhow, correct me if I am wrong.

TV Tropes already lists him as such.

I'd imagine the equivalent of Downfall "Hitler rant" scene would be made. Instead of Hitler losing it, Himmler will lose it as he orders everything in Europe to be destroyed out of spite.
That's mean Taiwan is independent all the whole time. Is it the country still like OTL Taiwan?
 
You don't come OUT of the Quarantine Zone. The guard force tries to stop anyone from getting in, and generally succeeds, but they won't chase someone past the inner wall perimeter. You get in, you're in. You won't get out. Too hazardous for everyone outside the walls.

There are all sorts of valuable things in the ruins, gold bullion, jewelry, lots of items that collectors would pay through the nose to acquire. Not going to be coming out, not for a few thousand years.

I imagine gazing at Nuremberg and Berlin from the equivalent of Google Earth is quite a hobby in this reality.

When satellite images are made available, does this help researchers better understand the final times of the Reich?

When the equivalent of the Discovery/History channels come along, I imagine programs along the lines of "What really lurks at the dark heart of the Reich?" will be more popular than Ancient Aliens!
 
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Actor Robert Duvall won an Academy Award for his portrayal of LTC. Hal Moore in director Francis Ford Coppola's 1979 WWII classic "We Were Soldiers". The film, based on Moore's autobiography "We Were Soldiers Once...And Young" also starred Martin Sheen as AP Photographer Joe Galloway, who was attached to Moore's 1st Battalion of the 7th Cavalry during for most of the war. The film became well-known for the famous sequence of the Air Cav's assault on the medieval fortress of Bergues during the opening hours of Operation Gravel.
Without the need for greater escapism in the late 1970s, does the "New Hollywood" period ever go out of style?

 

CalBear

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I imagine gazing at Nuremberg and Berlin from the equivalent of Google Earth is quite a hobby in this reality.

When satellite images are made available, does this help researchers better understand the final times of the Reich?

When the equivalent of the Discovery/History channels come along, I imagine programs along the lines of "What really lurks at the dark heart of the Reich?" will be more popular than Ancient Aliens!
Very much so.

As was discussed several times, there are persistent rumors that their are vast stores of Gold, diamonds, and other wealth that was squirreled away by the Nazi and stored in both areas. These are backed up by plenty of second hand, and occasional first hand reporting, making the containment zones very tempting for a certain sort of fortune hunter. There are also the same sort of half baked conspiracy theories as exist today (including Aliens, a deal between the A4 and Aliens is one of the favored "alternate" explanation for why no one else is allowed to launch rockets into orbit).

The Guard Force does everything possible to intercept individuals or even the rare small group trying to breach the Wall. Mostly they succeed. Some really unlucky fools manage to get past all the containment measures and get into the ruins.

To date, no one is know to have ever managed to get back out. Once in, there you remain. The guard force has been know to drop in food, if the individual(s) show themselves, but no one gets out. Ever.

Most of them die fairly quicklyy from one or more of the various lethal threats inside. The ones who try to climb or dig? The "Lethal Force Authorized" signs, in about 25 languages, that are on every road, every path, and broadcast/announced on a regular basis are not for show. It is one of relatively few policies that just about everyone in Europe, including the Statelets, supports without hesitation.
 
Very much so.

As was discussed several times, there are persistent rumors that their are vast stores of Gold, diamonds, and other wealth that was squirreled away by the Nazi and stored in both areas. These are backed up by plenty of second hand, and occasional first hand reporting, making the containment zones very tempting for a certain sort of fortune hunter. There are also the same sort of half baked conspiracy theories as exist today (including Aliens, a deal between the A4 and Aliens is one of the favored "alternate" explanation for why no one else is allowed to launch rockets into orbit).

The Guard Force does everything possible to intercept individuals or even the rare small group trying to breach the Wall. Mostly they succeed. Some really unlucky fools manage to get past all the containment measures and get into the ruins.

To date, no one is know to have ever managed to get back out. Once in, there you remain. The guard force has been know to drop in food, if the individual(s) show themselves, but no one gets out. Ever.

Most of them die fairly quicklyy from one or more of the various lethal threats inside. The ones who try to climb or dig? The "Lethal Force Authorized" signs, in about 25 languages, that are on every road, every path, and broadcast/announced on a regular basis are not for show. It is one of relatively few policies that just about everyone in Europe, including the Statelets, supports without hesitation.

In other words, Berlin and Nuremberg make our Area 51 look like Hyde Park corner in terms of accessibility!

Have satellites ever noticed anything interesting over the decades?
 
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