Romney was a natural-born citizen as he was the child of citizen parents, even though he was born abroad.
Thank you for clearing that up, Space Oddity :)

Something to be careful about copying, too, IMO. There can't have been many people IRL, in any era, capable of it.
I feel the need to remind you that she herself would always credit those around her for making her appear to be as good as she was.

phx1138 said:
Quite right. You might almost call it the Sherlock Holmes effect: the fictional better known than the real.
Would you believe... there's a trope for that! And looked at who they named it after...

phx1138 said:
Me, too.:cool: Somebody who lives in that character has to know it better than the casual user (so to speak). I've often thought a new writer on any series (TV or comics) should go back & watch/read the older stuff (not just the last bits) to get a real grip on the characters. (FYI, this IMO explains how Reed Richards became the smartest man in the Marvel Universe: later writers didn't do this...)
This can be a problem in all forms of media. Turnover of the creative types, leading to sub-par replacements...

phx1138 said:
No comment. Never been a fan of live performances, & have scarcely ever actually seen him.
Every polarizing artist seems to have at least one song that most people like. For Manilow, that would be "Copacabana". (Let me guess; you don't like that one ;))

phx1138 said:
:) I really liked one at first, & always hated the other. I'll leave you to guess which.:p
When it comes to ALF, the real debate is clear: first version or second version of his theme song? The first version has the slap bass, and the whimsical uptempo beat, and the sentimental string section... but the second version has the legendary family sitcom saxophone, and the nice slow-jam tempo... it's a tough call! :p

Thanks Brainbin.
You're very welcome! Glad I could clear that up for you :)

It's been a rough week, so presumably this is a reading comprehension fail on my part: do we know what Desilu's midseason pickup is? Or is this a deliberate tease?
Oh, I assure you, it is a tease, and a most deliberate one at that :D

You're in luck, though, because Desilu's midseason pickup will be the subject of our next update! I hope to have it ready sometime during the long weekend.
 
Brainbin said:
I feel the need to remind you that she herself would always credit those around her for making her appear to be as good as she was.
I don't mean to detract by any means. I only meant, it'd be a rare case in any era for someone to have the exact combination of talent & placement to do what Lucy did. That she did it reflects skill, smarts, & talent, for which I salute her, & so should anyone who's a fan of pop culture. (We need not ask what you think.:p)
Brainbin said:
Not quite what I had in mind. More Spenser being more famous than Parker, or Jed Bartlet than Aaron Sorkin. (Except on this thread, where the chances are real good the question, "Who added the West Wing to the White House?" would get as many Sorkin replies as Barlets.;))
Brainbin said:
This can be a problem in all forms of media. Turnover of the creative types, leading to sub-par replacements...
*sigh* A sad state of affairs indeed.:(:(
Brainbin said:
Every polarizing artist seems to have at least one song that most people like. For Manilow, that would be "Copacabana". (Let me guess; you don't like that one ;))
Bang on. I hate it. "Some Kind of Friend" or "Swing Street", depending on what style you prefer, for me; depends on what mood I'm in.
Brainbin said:
When it comes to ALF, the real debate is clear:
Regrettably, I'll have to reserve judgement, since the flash player's not working right...:( TBH, I don't recall either being exceptional.
 
Sorry I got to the update a tad late.

Anyway, great stuff! Newhart got an epic line in there, and good for Lucy for her triumphant return to the silver screen!

Very interested to see what the miniseries here is... :cool:
 
Hm, I just remembered something. Will there still be a Wonder Woman TV series starring Lynda Carter? Same for the short-lived live-action Spider-Man TV series starring Nicholas Hammond.
 
And now for another infobox! Two more to go after this...

TWR US Senate Election, 1976 Infobox.png

Note that Hugh Scott ran for re-election in 1976 (though he did not IOTL) to retain his position as Senate Majority Leader (as noted in the update), whereas James Allen became the de facto leader of the AIP/ADP in the Senate, given that both of his senior colleagues in the upper chamber were distracted by their joint presence on the Presidential ticket. Byrd has become leader of the Democratic Party in the Senate ITTL (as IOTL) largely because I see no reason why he would not do so.

Also, now that the long weekend is here, I hope to make some major headway on actually posting an update! :D

TWR US Senate Election, 1976 Infobox.png
 
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One minor correction on the presidential wikibox, Brainbin: you have Muskie's home state as Michigan. :p
Argh! This is what happens when you try to rush out an infobox before its time :eek: Fixed. Third time's the charm, right?

Can't wait for the update. Think you'll be covering miniseries a bit more.
I will, though perhaps not as soon as you might think :)

---

Recorded for posterity, the original replies (because the attachment system allows for no recourse beyond post deletion, as far as I know):

I don't mean to detract by any means. I only meant, it'd be a rare case in any era for someone to have the exact combination of talent & placement to do what Lucy did. That she did it reflects skill, smarts, & talent, for which I salute her, & so should anyone who's a fan of pop culture. (We need not ask what you think.:p)
This is true. If this forum has taught us anything about history, it's that the most important thing is being in the right place at the right time.

phx1138 said:
Regrettably, I'll have to reserve judgement, since the flash player's not working right...:( TBH, I don't recall either being exceptional.
On the whole, I'm rather indecisive; depends on what mood I'm in ;)

Another bump for lolcats: "Who Trek"
So many anachronisms in that picture... I don't know where to begin :eek:

phx1138 said:
Now that one is clever!

Sorry I got to the update a tad late.
Better late than never!

Anyway, great stuff! Newhart got an epic line in there, and good for Lucy for her triumphant return to the silver screen!
And his line is per OTL, too! Not surprising that Newhart would be so good with words, considering his vocation... but as for That Wacky Redhead, it was avoiding a return to the big screen that was good for her - her OTL appearance in Mame was something that would suit neither her career trajectory nor her reputation ITTL.

Very interested to see what the miniseries here is... :cool:
Don't worry, we'll be finding out all about it :cool:

Hm, I just remembered something. Will there still be a Wonder Woman TV series starring Lynda Carter? Same for the short-lived live-action Spider-Man TV series starring Nicholas Hammond.
Excellent question. That, too, will be the focus of another update - though, without saying whether or not Spider-Man would receive a live-action television adaptation ITTL, I can confirm that Hammond would likely not be in the cast in the part without the springboard that was his OTL role on The Brady Bunch as Doug Simpson, Big Man on Campus :D

---

And now, hopefully for the last time, the Presidential Infobox:

TWR US Presidential Election, 1976 Infobox.png

TWR US Presidential Election, 1976 Infobox.png
 
Note that Hugh Scott ran for re-election in 1976 (though he did not IOTL) to retain his position as Senate Majority Leader (as noted in the update)

Oooh, no Senator John Heinz (at least for now); meaning that you've certainly butterflied away his 1991 death in a plane crash and John Kerry's future second wife.

Of course, a quick trip to Wikipedia shows that Kerry's 1972 Congressional loss was (implicitly) blamed on Richard Nixon (in a district so liberal that it voted for George McGovern!). With no Nixon, possibly Kerry won ITTL in '72? I searched the archives, and as far as I can tell, there's no mention of Kerry, Cronin, or the fate of Kerry's district ITTL. For whatever it's worth, Kerry seems to share the sentiment that Nixon was behind the drumbeat of negative coverage he faced from the district's largest paper, The Lowell Sun.

IOTL, after losing his Congressional race, Kerry went to Boston College law school and became a prosecutor. If Kerry wins in '72 (and presumably, re-election in '74 and '76), you will have butterflied away another major, if underreported, formative event in his career. He almost certainly will not be interested in the do-nothing job of Lieutenant Governor in 1982....

Oh, and one more bit of fun? Kerry's then-Congressional district was MA-5. Cronin served one term in the House before losing to Paul Tsongas (who also has no mention ITTL).

So Brainbin, congratulations: you've managed to incidentally derail the trajectories of two major Democratic Presidential candidates, all on account of that Wacky Redhead!
 
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Oooh, no Senator John Heinz (at least for now); meaning that you've certainly butterflied away his 1991 death in a plane crash and John Kerry's future second wife.
Funnily enough, Heinz himself entered the House through a special election to replace his own deceased predecessor, Rep. Robert J. Corbett, in 1971. Since that's well after my POD, I could theoretically butterfly that, but there's no indication (in the admittedly thin material that I could find on him) that his death was sudden or accidental (beyond the fact that he did not choose to retire due to ill health). In any event, Heinz will remain in the House for the time being. As you imply, he could always run for Senate in 1982, as Sen. Scott will certainly not wish to seek another term at that point - assuming that some other Pennsylvania Republican doesn't get the nomination instead.

Andrew T said:
Of course, a quick trip to Wikipedia shows that Kerry's 1972 Congressional loss was (implicitly) blamed on Richard Nixon (in a district so liberal that it voted for George McGovern!). With no Nixon, possibly Kerry won ITTL in '72? I searched the archives, and as far as I can tell, there's no mention of Kerry, Cronin, or the fate of Kerry's district ITTL. For whatever it's worth, Kerry seems to share the sentiment that Nixon was behind the drumbeat of negative coverage he faced from the district's largest paper, The Lowell Sun.
A quick trip to Wikipedia also shows that many of the formative events of Kerry's experience following serving in the overseas quagmire have been completely butterflied away. His entire rise to fame happened after Humphrey called the armistice ITTL; he will very much remain a nobody who will not successful rise above the crowded field of candidates vying for the Democratic nomination in 1972. I'm sure he'll have a very long and successful career in the Commonwealth courts.

Andrew T said:
Oh, and one more bit of fun? Kerry's then-Congressional district was MA-5. Cronin served one term in the House before losing to Paul Tsongas (who also has no mention ITTL).
Rep. Cronin held on against Tsongas in 1974, and was also re-elected in 1976. This was actually explicitly decided behind-the-scenes, so thank you for asking :)

Andrew T said:
So Brainbin, congratulations: you've managed to incidentally derail the trajectories of two major Democratic Presidential candidates, all on account of that Wacky Redhead!
Thank you, Andrew! I do try - and it does look like a few more are on the way! :cool:

And now, for the last infobox of the 1976 cycle, the House of Representatives:

TWR US House Election, 1976 Infobox.png

Worth noting at this point is that someone else whose fame I've butterflied away is Betty Ford, often said to have made more of an impact on popular culture than her husband IOTL; but being the "Third Lady", so to speak, isn't nearly the platform that being the First Lady is. On the other hand, many of the areas in which her influence is most strongly felt remains outside the scope of this timeline, so I guess you can call that a relative "wash". But it is certainly something to think about.

TWR US House Election, 1976 Infobox.png
 
A quick trip to Wikipedia also shows that many of the formative events of Kerry's experience following serving in the overseas quagmire have been completely butterflied away. His entire rise to fame happened after Humphrey called the armistice ITTL; he will very much remain a nobody who will not successful rise above the crowded field of candidates vying for the Democratic nomination in 1972. I'm sure he'll have a very long and successful career in the Commonwealth courts.

Hence my use of the words 'another, if underreported' in my original reply. :)

My view is that Kerry's personal fortune and ambition make him a likely politician even ITTL, but I follow your logic.

Rep. Cronin held on against Tsongas in 1974, and was also re-elected in 1976. This was actually explicitly decided behind-the-scenes, so thank you for asking :)

Well, since you've eliminated one of the authentic good guys in politics, I should ask the fate of the other: how's Paul Simon doing?
 
Man, I go on one little business trip to Maryland and one little not-business trip to Montreal and I feel like I am ages behind. And during such an interesting political update, too! Reagan in 76 just blows the doors off of any semblance this timeline can have to our own in the 1980s. I mean like him or hate him Reagan largely defined the 80s in the US, and the populous vs. media reaction to him. 100 years from now watching reruns of SNL future historians will determine he was the most vilified and hated president of the 20th century, and wonder how he could have rigged the elections to have gotten the votes that he did. So much of the media of the 80s is either playing off of the idea of a new optimism or a scathing critique of that new optimism.

I guess with Vietnam and the national attitude being so changed, there's no Morning in America anyway. But it is still amusing to think of Reagan at the height of the Studio 54 drugs and debauchery time period... (Which begs the question of the club scene, I guess, and how it has changed with the lack of a national malaise and escapist attitude.) Still, it means the 1980s are surely not the 1980s that we all know and (possibly) love. (Well, I love them for all their flaws at least! Back to the Future a and the A-Team are enough for that, an Eastern block so we can still have good spy movies, Neuromancer and the cyberpunk genre, still some hope for the space program...) Indeed, Reagan is probably somewhat more progressive than he would have been given the progressive portion of the Republican party still exists not having sold its soul to get the South, defining the middle as closer to the left than it is these days in the US.

I know, I know, it is not like Reagan doesn't exist, but he won't be an 80s phenomenon. And it is going to be interesting to see how that plays out. Once again, interesting update!
 
I gather that Spain's history is largely unchanged and that Generalissimo Franco is still dead:p

Without Chevy Chase to keep us continually updated on this front, how will we know that Franco remains dead and has not returned from death in some capacity?

In fact... With SNL's Weekend Update butterflied away, and likely the many imitators that would come later down the line, how do millions of Americans get their news? Until the Internet, there will be a gaping hole in fake news that people take as real.
 
And now... we interrupt this timeline for a very special announcement!

Some of you may be familiar with Eyes Turned Skywards (wiki link here), a timeline which is focused on an alternate space program; longstanding readers of either that thread or this one will be aware that, some months ago, I was invited to write a guest post, which can be read right here. The two co-authors, e of pi and truth is life, both of whom are good friends of this timeline, felt that my writing style was just what they needed to complement their diligently researched and dazzlingly presented cold, hard facts with the certain je ne sais quoi that only popular culture can provide. That resulted in the beginning of what has become a very fruitful relationship, which culminates today in my providing a second update to Eyes Turned Skywards, which you can find right here! For those of you who are missing my Star Trek coverage and are impatiently awaiting my promised return thereto, then I most strongly urge you to check it out, because guess what so happens to be the main attraction? :cool:

We now return to our regularly scheduled responses...

---

And yes, no update on this thread until the weekend, sadly. The long weekend gave me some spare time, true, but it was all funneled directly into RL. So it goes...

My view is that Kerry's personal fortune and ambition make him a likely politician even ITTL, but I follow your logic.
Perhaps. But the Democratic bench is very crowded in Massachusetts, and Kerry has been deprived of a unique platform on which he can stand out.

Andrew T said:
Well, since you've eliminated one of the authentic good guys in politics, I should ask the fate of the other: how's Paul Simon doing?
Not well. I've now butterflied "Graceland" (because Elvis Lives) and "You Can Call Me Al", ("I can call you Betty" is widely believed to be a reference to Betty Ford, with the eponymous "Al" being short for "alcoholic") were the two best songs on that album :p (In all seriousness, I see no reason why he would not be serving in the House as IOTL, assuming that his margins were solid enough to withstand Republican challengers in the mid-1970s. I obviously won't divulge whether or not he makes it to the Senate ITTL.)

Man, I go on one little business trip to Maryland and one little not-business trip to Montreal and I feel like I am ages behind.
Glad you're still reading, e_wraith! Funny you went to Maryland and Montreal - I'll have cause to mention both locales later on ITTL, and for non-political reasons, too! :D

e_wraith said:
And during such an interesting political update, too! Reagan in 76 just blows the doors off of any semblance this timeline can have to our own in the 1980s. I mean like him or hate him Reagan largely defined the 80s in the US, and the populous vs. media reaction to him. 100 years from now watching reruns of SNL future historians will determine he was the most vilified and hated president of the 20th century, and wonder how he could have rigged the elections to have gotten the votes that he did. So much of the media of the 80s is either playing off of the idea of a new optimism or a scathing critique of that new optimism.
It's funny, because I've had something resembling this discussion privately, with at least three other people, and came to many of the same conclusions (though I don't think that future observers will decide that people "hated" Reagan, because of course they have the accurate example of Nixon to measure him against). But you're right that, in short, Ronald Reagan defined the 1980s IOTL, as no President has really defined his respective decade before or since. I decided long ago who would become President after Reagan (and when he would take office), so we'll have to see if that gentleman (yes, it's a man) could possibly replicate Reagan's OTL achievement.

e_wraith said:
I guess with [verboten] and the national attitude being so changed, there's no Morning in America anyway. But it is still amusing to think of Reagan at the height of the Studio 54 drugs and debauchery time period... (Which begs the question of the club scene, I guess, and how it has changed with the lack of a national malaise and escapist attitude.) Still, it means the 1980s are surely not the 1980s that we all know and (possibly) love. (Well, I love them for all their flaws at least! Back to the Future a and the A-Team are enough for that, an Eastern block so we can still have good spy movies, Neuromancer and the cyberpunk genre, still some hope for the space program...) Indeed, Reagan is probably somewhat more progressive than he would have been given the progressive portion of the Republican party still exists not having sold its soul to get the South, defining the middle as closer to the left than it is these days in the US.
Having been born in the 1980s, I'm obviously biased, but even so, there's a full-throatedness, a warts-and-all sincerity about the attitude of the 1980s which I find utterly irresistible. You'll note that I've imported some of that attitude into the 1970s in this timeline, and I think that Reagan will do his best to take advantage of that; remember, his ascension marks the end of four terms of Democratic control of the White House, and comes on the heels of the Republicans ending twenty years of Democratic Congresses - he can pass all that off as a different kind of Morning in America (with leftist wags calling it "mourning in America" instead).

e_wraith said:
I know, I know, it is not like Reagan doesn't exist, but he won't be an 80s phenomenon. And it is going to be interesting to see how that plays out. Once again, interesting update!
Thank you! I'm glad you liked it :)

I gather that Spain's history is largely unchanged and that Generalissimo Franco is still dead:p
This just in: Generalissimo Francisco Franco is still valiantly holding on in his fight to remain dead, having passed more-or-less on schedule ITTL. And we will be hearing more about post-Francoist Spain in the future, though not exclusively (it will be as part of a thematic update covering a number of countries, actually).

Without Chevy Chase to keep us continually updated on this front, how will we know that Franco remains dead and has not returned from death in some capacity?
Well, I kept Elvis alive, right? Somebody has to take his place as the man everybody believes to still be living. Why not Franco? :D

e_wraith said:
In fact... With SNL's Weekend Update butterflied away, and likely the many imitators that would come later down the line, how do millions of Americans get their news? Until the Internet, there will be a gaping hole in fake news that people take as real.
An intriguing question. I may have an answer for you in the near future. It will take some careful planning...
 

Thande

Donor
An intriguing question. I may have an answer for you in the near future. It will take some careful planning...

I wonder if America will perhaps import a British-format satire as they attempted unsuccessfully with "DC Follies" from Spitting Image in OTL...not that Spitting Image probably exists in TTL due to butterflies but you know what I mean. Something is going to fill the gap left by SNL.
 
Without Chevy Chase to keep us continually updated on this front, how will we know that Franco remains dead and has not returned from death in some capacity?

In fact... With SNL's Weekend Update butterflied away, and likely the many imitators that would come later down the line, how do millions of Americans get their news? Until the Internet, there will be a gaping hole in fake news that people take as real.

Not Necessarily The News?
 
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