Teddy Roosevelt and the Lafayette Division

From my forum, what would have happen when a month after the sinking of the Cunard ocean liner RMS Lusitania occurred on May 7th 1915 by a German submarine, former United states president Teddy Roosevelt decides to create a military volunteer formation sponsor by fellow Americans of influence who like Teddy Roosevelt believe the United States should enter the war on the Allied side. The division which is raised with out the backing of the United states government or the approval of President Wilson is called the Lafayette Division and is placed under the command of the French Army and becomes fully active just before the end of 1915.

So what will the reaction of the United States government be with a military volunteer formation now active on the Western Front, what is the reaction of the american public, are they supportive of thes division and most important what will the reaction of the German Empire be.
 
They'll be right and ready for the horrors of 1916. The Lafayette Escadrille had a romance to them because of the air war. There is no romance to trench warfare.

Given TR's involvement, there is bound to be lots of publicity. If any real facts about the war make it back to the US, then it may turn the US completely against entering the war.

At the same time, if Americans are fighting on the Western Front, the US Army may send may observers and learn alongside the British and French the proper way of fighting the war. This may mean less American casualties in 1918 if the US enters the war like IOTL.

Germans won't be happy about American volunteers, but it's not like they can do very much. A single division isn't going to have much impact, especially as reinforcements will be an issue. One big battle, and there won't be much left of the division.
 
From my forum, what would have happen when a month after the sinking of the Cunard ocean liner RMS Lusitania occurred on May 7th 1915 by a German submarine, former United states president Teddy Roosevelt decides to create a military volunteer formation sponsor by fellow Americans of influence who like Teddy Roosevelt believe the United States should enter the war on the Allied side. The division which is raised with out the backing of the United states government or the approval of President Wilson is called the Lafayette Division and is placed under the command of the French Army and becomes fully active just before the end of 1915.

So what will the reaction of the United States government be with a military volunteer formation now active on the Western Front, what is the reaction of the american public, are they supportive of thes division and most important what will the reaction of the German Empire be.

Some old Rough Riders might be willing willing to join , too.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
The thing is, foreign nationals who wanted to fight for

From my forum, what would have happen when a month after the sinking of the Cunard ocean liner RMS Lusitania occurred on May 7th 1915 by a German submarine, former United states president Teddy Roosevelt decides to create a military volunteer formation sponsor by fellow Americans of influence who like Teddy Roosevelt believe the United States should enter the war on the Allied side. The division which is raised with out the backing of the United states government or the approval of President Wilson is called the Lafayette Division and is placed under the command of the French Army and becomes fully active just before the end of 1915.

So what will the reaction of the United States government be with a military volunteer formation now active on the Western Front, what is the reaction of the american public, are they supportive of thes division and most important what will the reaction of the German Empire be.

The thing is, foreign nationals who wanted to fight for France before the US entered the war had organizations created specifically for them; the Lafayette Escadrille, of course, and the multiple RMVE of the Legion.

TR's "Volunteer Division" idea in 1917 was for a US Army formation, not a French army one - not unlike the 1st-3rd USVCs of the S-A War.

If Americans wanted to fight for France in 1914-17, they were not turned away.

Alan Seeger, for example...

I HAVE A RENDEZVOUS WITH DEATH . .

I HAVE a rendezvous with Death
At some disputed barricade,
When Spring comes back with rustling shade
And apple-blossoms fill the air—
I have a rendezvous with Death
When Springs brings back blue days and fair.


It may be he shall take my hand
And lead me into his dark land
And close my eyes and quench my breath—
It may be I shall pass him still.
I have a rendezvous with Death
On some scarred slope of battered hill,
When Spring comes round again this year
And the first meadow-flowers appear.


God knows 'twere better to be deep
Pillowed in silk and scented down,
Where Love throbs out in blissful sleep
Pulse nigh to pulse, and breath to breath,
Where hushed awakenings are dear . . .
But I've a rendezvous with Death
At midnight in some flaming town,
When Spring trips north again this year,
And I to my pledged word am true.
I shall not fail that rendezvous.



Best
 
A quick question - if Teddy Roosevelt is in command of this division, no matter where it is deployed, what would his generic rank be? President Roosevelt, General Roosevelt, or some odd combination of the two depending on the social/military venue?
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Americans who wanted to fight for Britain in 1914-17

How about middle east theatre of war?
Serving under British command.

American citizens who wanted to fight for Britain in 1914-17 generally joined the Canadian Army. There were a significant number in the CEF, for example.

The liklihood an "American" unit per se would be created - and that enough manpower would show up before US entry into the war - is pretty much impossible, however. The interest and will just was not there before the US entry into the war, and US policy in doing so was to do so for American interests (as they were perceived) in the period.

Best,
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Divisional commanders in WW I were (generally)

A quick question - if Teddy Roosevelt is in command of this division, no matter where it is deployed, what would his generic rank be? President Roosevelt, General Roosevelt, or some odd combination of the two depending on the social/military venue?

Divisional commanders in WW I were (generally) major generals, i.e. 0-8, although their titles varied from army to army.

Best,
 
How about middle east theatre of war?
Serving under British command.


The Rough Riders fighting alongside Lawrence of Arabia. Love the idea!!

Roosevelt could be inspired by Lawrence's methods and pitch the expedition as a gallant crusade to liberate the Middle East from the pagan Turks.
 
Teddy was not in good health by this point in his life due an infection he received during an expedition in the Amazon. I realize he offered his services when he called for military intervention in the war but he never fully recovered from the Amazon expedition and I wonder he really could have done.
 
I like the idea of getting the Americans to fight in Arabia and the Middle East. You could recruit those that might want to help free Jerusalem from the Turks as well as fighting the Huns. It may well grow beyond just a division. I would wonder if TR might be the Figure Head. Then a subordinate officer could be the field commander.

It may even be a unit that might grow to a Corp with its own attached air force. Might they try to utilize tanks in the desert or is that too far fetched?
 
I like the idea of getting the Americans to fight in Arabia and the Middle East. You could recruit those that might want to help free Jerusalem from the Turks as well as fighting the Huns. It may well grow beyond just a division. I would wonder if TR might be the Figure Head. Then a subordinate officer could be the field commander.

It may even be a unit that might grow to a Corp with its own attached air force. Might they try to utilize tanks in the desert or is that too far fetched?

How would the relations with the Ottoman Empire be, if a recognizable number of American volunteers serves in the Middle East ? OTL they never declared war on each other and maintained diplomatic relations.
 
How would the relations with the Ottoman Empire be, if a recognizable number of American volunteers serves in the Middle East ? OTL they never declared war on each other and maintained diplomatic relations.

The United states can claim that the volunteers do not act on behave of the United states.
 
Kermit Roosevelt actually volunteered into the British army and served in Iraq.
What if he goes earlier, gets involved in the Arab revolt, and convinces his brothers Teddy III and Quentin to join him?
TR could be the spokesman in the US. He drums up a couple thousand volunteers and convinces some army officer to resign his commission and lead the unit.
 
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Kermit Roosevelt actually volunteered into the British army and served in Iraq.
What if he goes earlier, get involved in the Arab revolt, and convinces his brothers Teddy III and Quentin to join him.
TR could be the spokesman in the US. He drums up a couple thousand volunteers and convinces some army officer to resign his commission and lead the unit.


Well that is a tidbit I had not heard of before. Might help to get TR worked up and on a roll. Just how many might get drawn into his scheme is the puzzle.
 
Well that is a tidbit I had not heard of before. Might help to get TR worked up and on a roll. Just how many might get drawn into his scheme is the puzzle.

According to Wiki Kermit joined the British Army only after the US had entered the war, later transferring to the US Army. Why he didn't join the US Army in the first place is not explained.
 
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