Well Tom B gave a POD of Russia attacking a Swedish naval base. Surely a military attack from a hostile power is enough to whip a country into war. Plus the way I am reading it is that the parliament did not want war but the rulers did, so the POD mentioned early makes that semm like what will tip the balance.
Sweden joins the Central Powers
- Thread starter EvolvedSaurian
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Well Tom B gave a POD of Russia attacking a Swedish naval base. Surely a military attack from a hostile power is enough to whip a country into war. Plus the way I am reading it is that the parliament did not want war but the rulers did, so the POD mentioned early makes that semm like what will tip the balance.
one more thing every body here is talking about 13 more divisions but those are only the amount of troops they have or can raise verry quickly afther that they will ofcourse be able to raise more.
as mentioned before it will also will make the central powers most probarly focus first of all focus against russia witch is good thing all in it self.
and it might as also mentioned before it might also keep america out of the war or atleast keep it out for some what longer.
as mentioned before it will also will make the central powers most probarly focus first of all focus against russia witch is good thing all in it self.
and it might as also mentioned before it might also keep america out of the war or atleast keep it out for some what longer.
True, if Russia attacks first. That´d be darn stupid of them... but, they are after all Russians.
(Is probably offending someone, I apologize, I´ve gone to Russia and spoken with intelligent Russians at several occasions, you´ll have to admit though, that militarily speaking, not to bright are they now?)
Another point of consideration is public opinion on the US front. What sort of reaction would you have in, say, Minneapolis or Seattle (both foci of the Swedish-American community), if Sweden were to get in a no-kidding-around war for the first time in--what?--a few centuries? It's possible that sentiment from the northern prairies could have combined with that from central Texas and various major industrial cities (Milwaukee, Chicago, Cincinnati, Buffalo, Baltimore) to have a highly vocal minority in favor of rigorous neutrality (if not outright intervention on the part of the Central Powers)--and the voices of that movement would have been Harvard professor Hugo Munsterberg, and Baltimore Sun columnist H. L. Mencken.
What would the swedes equipp the 13th inf divs to fight with? Spears and swords? Our armsindustry werent up to the task and most of our neutralitywatch otl used the same rifles that the confederates used at the first bull run.
And the socialists might raise kain. OTL there were foodriots in 1917 and one company of the Vastmanland regiment stationed only 2kms from were i presently live deserted and went into the city to get food
And the socialists might raise kain. OTL there were foodriots in 1917 and one company of the Vastmanland regiment stationed only 2kms from were i presently live deserted and went into the city to get food
Probably German weapons. How was their arms industry?
I always thought it was spelled Cain.
Centuries? The last war the Sweden fought took place in 1813-1814 (against Denmark and Napoleon), before that against Russia in 1809(they lost Finland then) and against Russia in 1789-1792, against Russia, Denmark and Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth 1700-1721...
WW1 is an interesting war since not launching an attack is almost always better than launching it knowing the concequence of OTL. For example had Russia been on the defencive in 1914, the massacres that occured in OTL are unlikely to occur. Frankly the Swedish army is almost certainly irrelevent. It is small and while capable of growth where is it going to go? A naval invasion of Finland is dangerous while an attack across the land border in the north limits logistics and subsequently numbers to a very small number easilly dealt with by the reserve in Finland kept to keep the Finns in line.
Some insanity with the British pushing the Baltic isn't out of the question which raises interesting possibilities. On the otherhand the same factors that ruled out a Baltic attack are likely to remain in play here. If Norway was to declare for the Entente however...
Some insanity with the British pushing the Baltic isn't out of the question which raises interesting possibilities. On the otherhand the same factors that ruled out a Baltic attack are likely to remain in play here. If Norway was to declare for the Entente however...
I think 1915 is the time Sweden would join, for one the CP would need more allies, and another Russia is more likely to try something stupid to secure a possible enemy, once again not the smartest thing to do (but this is WWI we are taking about).
While stopping Russia may become the primary concern, Sweden takes land in Finland big deal. In the long run it does not really mean a great lose for Russia, if Sweden was extremely lucky or talented they would still be forced to fight in the heavy forrested areas.
I think all that Sweden joining the war would mean more people dead, and possibly Sweden getting away with some land. It would be like Bulgaria losing the war, but keeping most of its nation and rulers intact. Perhaps a greater push for Socailism in the nation, or (and this is just a guest) an attempt at Facism.
While stopping Russia may become the primary concern, Sweden takes land in Finland big deal. In the long run it does not really mean a great lose for Russia, if Sweden was extremely lucky or talented they would still be forced to fight in the heavy forrested areas.
I think all that Sweden joining the war would mean more people dead, and possibly Sweden getting away with some land. It would be like Bulgaria losing the war, but keeping most of its nation and rulers intact. Perhaps a greater push for Socailism in the nation, or (and this is just a guest) an attempt at Facism.
Thande
Donor
A fascist Sweden aligned with the Axis (presuming that Hitler still takes power in Germany and Mussolini in Italy) would radically change the dynamics of WW2. German interventions in Denmark and Norway would probably be unnecessary, and if they were launched, they would be accomplished with Swedish assistance.
The deal with the Central powers which was discussed was with small support by volunteers at least Åland would be turned over to Sweden.
With major Swedish support and Swedish invasion in Finland/Murmansk I can highly believe Finland and probably Estonia to be given over to Sweden (As both those areas were still considered Swedish and the national historybooks from 1910 still expressed their view clearly how the people there wished to be liberated by the Swedish army).
Sweden had then and still have close connections with Norway. In 1905 and long afterwards the Norwegians themselves pictured the situation as them being a newly freed people of the Danish yoke who finaly had grown up and had to leave the family's house (Sweden) and start a life on their own.
So even if the union was broken the relations between our nations were close.
Norway even offered to share all income from the oilfields (Sweden denied this as we didn't want to be dependent on another nation, dumb socialist gouvernment.
) with Sweden.Sweden wanted to go to war then and also for the Central powers in 1914, just not the majority who were socialists/communists and considered war to be a way for the capitalists to exploit the workers.
There are still articles in newspapers that can be read of aristocrats who rampage about the Swedish sillyness of not going to war in 1905 and 1914-1915.
We still had a more advanced equipped army (Even if most was imported) by 1914 then most nations. What Swedes though think would make the difference would be the Swedish submarines who would be on the German side.
With major Swedish support and Swedish invasion in Finland/Murmansk I can highly believe Finland and probably Estonia to be given over to Sweden (As both those areas were still considered Swedish and the national historybooks from 1910 still expressed their view clearly how the people there wished to be liberated by the Swedish army).
Sweden had then and still have close connections with Norway. In 1905 and long afterwards the Norwegians themselves pictured the situation as them being a newly freed people of the Danish yoke who finaly had grown up and had to leave the family's house (Sweden) and start a life on their own.
So even if the union was broken the relations between our nations were close.
Norway even offered to share all income from the oilfields (Sweden denied this as we didn't want to be dependent on another nation, dumb socialist gouvernment.
Sweden wanted to go to war then and also for the Central powers in 1914, just not the majority who were socialists/communists and considered war to be a way for the capitalists to exploit the workers.
There are still articles in newspapers that can be read of aristocrats who rampage about the Swedish sillyness of not going to war in 1905 and 1914-1915.
We still had a more advanced equipped army (Even if most was imported) by 1914 then most nations. What Swedes though think would make the difference would be the Swedish submarines who would be on the German side.
Very interesting stuff you´re saying. So they said thanks but no thanks to the oil fields
HarharAlthough this might probably create some conflicts later on down the century when Norwegians would be annoyed about the sharing.
Well, I suppose Swedes can be thankful the aristocrats weren´t in charge... Unless it´d have meant CP victory.
In that case according to most AH.Commers the world would be a better place.
(Which I doubt though
)It must be noted that Norway was not likely to join the allied powers. In fact german children were sent to Norway in World War I and before the war a Norweigian city was destroyed by a far and the Kaiser used his personal wealth to poy for its reconstruction,evening sending experts to help.
Borys
Banned
Ahoj!
Could I have that in English, please?
And what is the connection between the far, evening experts and Norway joining the CP?
Borys
Could I have that in English, please?
And what is the connection between the far, evening experts and Norway joining the CP?
Borys
I meant to say fire. The discussion was that if Sweden joined the Central powers that Norway would join the allied powers. I think that that is unlikly to have happen. If Sweden had joined the central powers it is likely that the war in the east may have ended earlier perhaps either with peace talks or the collapse of Russia in 1915 instead of 1917.