Sweden-Finland survive?

  • Thread starter Deleted member 1487
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As for the differences between ATL and OTL Finnish culture, keep in mind that the percentage of Finns speaking Finnish in 1809 was about a third*, about the same as Welsh speaking Welsh at the same time. Sweden's total population was a little less than a third Finnish at the time. The Finnish language would very likely have to be kept artificially alive, if it even survives, and the Kalevala and other Finnish revival works may never be published.

I pulled these statistics from the best of my memory. Someone who actually knows about Scandinavia please correct me.

*The Finnish language of today was reconstructed in the late 19th century.
 

yourworstnightmare

Banned
Donor
Acctually not entirely true, there were a lot of people with Swedish names, and many Finnish speakers who moved to the cities started to speak Swedish (although Finnish sometimes remained as a home language), however most Finns were poor peasants, who spoke Finnish. Numbers from the 1700s lie, because many people proclaimed themselves as "Swedes", because it was better than being a "Finn". The national awakening in the 1800s changed this.
 
Alright, so I decided to start and TL arch and need a bit of help on the plausibility, so as I am writing this arch, I will need some feedback.

Here goes:
The riksdag manages to get Gustav in hand and compels him to make peace with France. Sweden then enters into the continental system, closing the Baltic to the British. However by 1812 Russia, Britain, and Sweden sign a secret accord and the continental system is breached.
Napoleon invades Russia, which proceeds like OTL. Sweden remains officially neutral, but is funneling supplies to the Russians in conjunction with Britain. Eventually the Grand Armee is broken at Moscow and the retreat begins. The sixth coalition began its war in Germany and Sweden, whose army never suffered during the Russia invasion and loss of Finland as a recruiting area, contributes a corps nearly double the OTL size. Gustav IV is not present due to the conflicts with the Riksdag. He has not been diposed, but is little more than a figurehead at this point. The Swedish monarchy will never regain its power within the government.

The war proceeds mostly according to OTL, with similar results at Vienna, except that Denmark keeps Norway (butterflies only go so far). However, to compensate Sweden for her involvment in the war, she gets to retain Guadeloupe, which in conjunction with the other Swedish colony of St. Barthelemy, continued to be a nice source of income, as during this period nearly 20% of US exports flowed through their harbors. Additionally the Swedish West Indies Company does not fold in 1813, rather, due to earlier increased illicit trade with Britain during the continental system, it stays in business and an active trading company in East Asia and the Americas.

Europe remains relatively peaceful for a time, as all nations try to reestablish trade and rebuild. Russia is somewhat distracted throughout the '20s and '30s, as border wars to the south and the desire for a warm water port drive imperial ambitions. Additionally the uprisings in Poland focus attention aware from her northern neighbor. The Russians maintain a benign interest in Scandinavia, but come to the conclusion that these minor powers are harmless.

In the meantime, Sweden is involved briefly as a interested power in the Opium wars in China, thanks to their West Indies trading company. This means that they also receive some trading concessions from the Chinese at the conclusion of hostilities. This further involves the Swedes in international trade and shipping. Sweden increasinly modernizes over this period, but also liberalizes, which gives Finns the extra minority rights, thus strengthening the bond between the two peoples. By the 1850's immigration to the US has become a large issue in Sweden, as land reforms do not address the imbalance in land ownership and nearly 1.5 million Swedes and Finns will immigrate in the next 50 years. The greatest policy for maintaining unity between Sweden and Finland, besides the liberalizing economy, education, freedom of press and speech, and taxation reform, is the introduction of universal military service. All 18 year olds are expected to serve 2-3 years in one branch of the military with men from their recruiting districts. This creates helps in the creation of a common identity for the two peoples, despite the rise of nationalism.

Throughout the rest of the 19th century, the Scandinavia powers managed to stay neutral and maintain trade with the rest of Europe despite a series of wars, including the Crimean war and the Franco-Prussian war. Denmark-Norway was not as lucky and was involved in conflicts with Prussia over Schleswig-Holstein, which caused her to cede the territory to the new German state. Despite this territorial loss, Denmark still includes Norway, Iceland, and Greenland, making it, territorially, one of the largest states in Europe. After the creation of the German empire, Denmark, who already had close relation with Sweden, sought even closer economic and political connections. A Scandinavian trade pact would create a de facto free trade zone between the nations that would help industrialization in both nations.

Sweden though maintained cordial relation with the new German state and quickly became a major trading partner. This bond was strengthened by a secret military defensive pact, as Russia increasingly became hostile to the foreign power so close to their capitol. Paranoia in the Tzar's court drove the tension in relations, but as Sweden was a large supplier of raw materials to the German economy, the Kaiser, Frederich III (doesn't experience throat cancer), strongly signaled his support for his northern cousins. It also helped that his son (this Wilhelm does not suffer from a withered arm and is much less...bombastic) was married to the daughter of the Swedish king, Karl Gustav V (all the work of the crafty Bismarck).

By the 1880's the Swedish possessions in the Americas are no longer profitable and France buys them for a decent sum. The Swedish west indies company finally folds, but due to their history of trade in East Asia, other Swedish companies have taken up the business. The turn of the century sees the two Scandinavian powers industrializing rapidly. Swedish inventors were becoming increasing famous for their inventions, dynamite being one of the most widely used of these. The Noble institute would establish the Noble prizes based on the Will of the inventor. His company Bofors, would later go on to become of the largest arms manufacturers in Europe. By the 20th century Sweden would have a population of 7 million and growing. Denmark would have about 4.7 million, but both countries had a rise standard of living that would exceed the population growth.

Scandinavia would have a growing economy that would make it one of the wealthiest areas in the world, but increasing debt would mar the luster of the new prosperity. Large amounts of money were needed from Britain and Germany to finance the growth in industry, specifically Chemical and manufacturing. These debts would eventually be paid down by mid-century, but the experience structured national perceptions to focus on personal savings. This would help create the banking boom that would serve to unseat London and the finance capitol of the world (this was also helped by the fall of British economic dominance and the rise of German).

After the last major conflicts on the continent the resulted in modern Germany, peace had been the rule outside of the Balkans. Despite several wars involving southern European powers with the Ottomans, the 20th century in Europe was possibly the most peaceful in the history of the continent. Eventually, Ottoman resurgence, driven by oil revenues and a modernized government, settled the Balkans and stopped the slow bleeding of land that had plagued the middle eastern giant.

Eventually though, economics and the growth of peripheral powers created tensions within Europe that threated to bring the great powers to the brink of war. The fall of British power had left a bitter nation envious of the new giants. The increase calls for Indian independence had sapped much of the power of the Empire, as British units were required in increasing numbers to combat the rise number of riots and insurgency that followed these calls. France had seemed to accept its status as a second tier power in the European pecking order, but still was resolute to assert itself. But she too was caught up in colonial disturbances by the fifties. Germany had become the largest economy in Europe and had one of the most advanced in the world. Scandinavia was the banking giant and a large industrial power itself. This region also was able to boast about 22 million people by the 1950's. Russia was the one power that had unrealized potential. The bear had been plagued by unrest and violence, which resulted in either repression and more violence, or an uneasy liberalizing period that slowly gave the Duma more power. Eventually, a situation similar to Germany's in the 1910's had emerged. The government was still controlled by the Tzar, but required parliamentary approval for most actions. The economy had grown enormously, but remained in Germany's and America's shadows. Russia was in many ways a resource supplier to Europe, but also, increasingly a manufacturing giant (like OTL China). They also had an increasingly large military and a desire 'for their place in the sun'. Tensions mounted over Russia's desire for THE great power status, which left Europe on wars edge by mid century.

Am mostly giving feed-back on Scandinavian matters:
As already discussed the split of Denmark-Norway won't occur in this TL.
A possible outcome could be that the King of Denmark is stripped of his Duchy of Holstein - Napoleon had given it to him to incorporate in 1806 and an ATL 1815 could take that away. Without losing Norway the Brits might keep the West Indies, Charlotte Amalia being a major trading port in the Caribbean or it could be ceded to Sweden!

Trying to find ways of letting Denmark-Norway keep Slesvig! As already mentioned it could be able to do so because of no language question leading to a much less National State than OTL which would consist almost exclusively of Danes - at least in the Kingdom.
With the added resources of Norway the upcoming war with the German Confederation/Prussia would change a lot.

If Denmark-Norway and Sweden-Finland can work out a workable co-existence it would make those countries able to supply each other with much needed goods and I could see an influx of Danish/Slesvig agricultural changes in Sweden-Finland that might transform the agricultural structure of said nation. At least it could enable a lot less poor peoples in Sweden than OTL and lessen migration.

Would France be allowed to buy the Swedish possessions in accord with the Monroe doctrine? I would rather see a situation similar to Denmarks 1917 sell of the West Indies to the US.
 
As for the differences between ATL and OTL Finnish culture, keep in mind that the percentage of Finns speaking Finnish in 1809 was about a third*, about the same as Welsh speaking Welsh at the same time. Sweden's total population was a little less than a third Finnish at the time. The Finnish language would very likely have to be kept artificially alive, if it even survives, and the Kalevala and other Finnish revival works may never be published.

I pulled these statistics from the best of my memory. Someone who actually knows about Scandinavia please correct me.

*The Finnish language of today was reconstructed in the late 19th century.

yourworstnightmare is right, Finnish was always the predominant spoken language in the in the Finnish provinces and the Grand Duchy. What you are remembering is the formation of the modern form of written Finnish, which indeed took place in the late 19th century. Historically, Finnish comes in two major forms, the western (Häme) and eastern (Savo) dialects, which are mutually intelligible but have a lot of different words, spelling, etc. The issue in circa 1880 was, which one becomes the basis for the reformed Finnish planned as the official national idiom. Both dialects had their proponents, but in the end the western model won. Today's Finnish is thus based on the Häme dialects, even if it uses a lot of eastern words and forms.

So, in one way we can say that only about a third of the people in Finland in 1809 spoke a language akin to modern Finnish, that is a western dialect, even though if the different dialects are figured in, numerically a great majority spoke Finnish.

That said, ITTL the development of language and, more broadly, the national culture in Finland would be pretty interesting. In 1808, all the prequisite seeds for the eventual development of nationalism are in place: there is a part of the Swedish speaking upper and middle classes that values their Finnic roots and history and is beginning to promote Finnish language and culture.

The obvious example of this group is of course the historian and linguist Henrik Gabriel Porthan, the Fennophile professor in the Turku Academy (Kungliga Akademien i Åbo), the most prestigious school in Finland [and ITTL to become one of the leading universities in the Swedish domain]. In his doctoral thesis De Poesi Fennica (1778) Porthan had collected a lot of Finnish oral tradition by travelling around the country much like Lönnrot later when researching for Kalevala.

Even though Porthan himself was pessimistic about the possibilities of the Finnish language surviving, his influence in Turku did much to promote a Romantic movement among the Academy that in the early 19th century started the advocation of Finnish nationalism among the academic elite and formed one basis for the Fennoman movement.

IOTL, the movement was born and developed within the framework of the Grand Duchy. The Russian authorities supported the idea at least indirectly to weaken the position of Swedish: ITTL the situation is going to be different, because against the influence of Stockholm and a more dominant Swedish culture, this will be a more uphill struggle. Even so, the movement existed, and the 1820s and 30s will see academic studies and new weekly or monthly papers advocating the strenghtening of Finnish culture and literature. Influential Fennoman activists such as J.L. Runeberg, J.V Snellman are bound to pop up before the middle parts of the century, and it is quite possible that around 1835-50 a Finnish Literature Society will be formed as a central focus for these endeavours (IOTL, 1831). Kalevala (OTL first edition 1835) might or might not come about, but expect to see at least some similar collections of old Finnic mythology, tradition and lore.

Like OTL, the Swedish-speaking press will claim that "raising Finnish as a language of civilization" will be impossible, and ITTL this view will gain much more support from the Swedish elite, both in Finland and in Sweden proper. Obstacles will be raised for promoting the language officially in schools and among the bureaucracy, but even so, the period 1840-70 will see a gradual improvement. OTL, forms of censorship were used to block the advance of Finnish: under Swedish rule this will not be so pronounced but is still possible. In terms of higher learning, the changes as regards to OTL will be a mixed bag: the absense of the strict sensorship of foreign materials that was in effect 1829-1865 will mean that the learned classes will have a better access to literature promoting nationalist, liberal and revolutionary ideas: this development has the chance to alleviate the the quite possible problems the obstacles placed by Swedish officialdom on will create for the development of Finnish nationalist groups and ideas.

Thus, ITTL the Fennoman activism will sooner or later begin to clash with what is perceived as the Swedish national interests in Stockholm. The government wants to maintain national cohesion and unity, and the development of Swedish nationalism on one side will contribute to calls to uphold the strong position of the national language of the realm and to put the upstart Fennomans into their place. Events like the Anjala Conspiracy of 1788 will be used by fearmongers to suggest that if Finnish language and culture gain a stronger position, Finland might drift towards Russia and start to yearn after independence. If the position of Sweden in the international stage weakens, which is a distinct possibility, at sometime after 1860 or so the Fennoman ideas will be seen as a potential threat to the Swedish state and so a crackdown on Finnish and Fennomans might be to be expected.
 
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Deleted member 1487

One of the major factors for Finnish development is that Old Finland is currently under Russia rule, a Russia that is currently "Russifing" old Finland. There is going to be a very real fear that the Russians would absorb Finland if they become independent.

Taken from Wikipedia:
Meanwhile, the Finnish areas belonging to Russia after the peace treaties in 1721 and 1743 (not including Ingria), called "Old Finland" were initially governed with the old Swedish laws (a not uncommon practice in the expanding Russian Empire in the 18th century). However, gradually the rulers of Russia granted large estates of land to their non-Finnish favorites, ignoring the traditional landownership and peasant freedom laws of Old Finland. There were even cases where the noblemen punished peasants corporally, for example by flogging. The overall situation caused decline in the economy and morale in Old Finland, worsened since 1797 when the area was forced to send men to the Imperial Army. The construction of military installations in the area brought thousands of non-Finnish people to the region. In 1812, after the Russian conquest of Finland, "Old Finland" was rejoined to the rest of the country but the landownership question remained a serious problem until the 1870s.

There remains the status of the Old Finland in Russia that can serve as a boogy man to Finnish nationalists. Sweden may not seem like the bad guy when independence could result in a Russian boot on their neck and a whip at their back.

Now the relationship with Denmark and the beginnings of modernization in Sweden are going to become serious issues in TTL. I will need to do some research.

Additionally, Norway would not contribute that much by 1866 to Denmark's resources, as it was much more sparcely populated and was incredibly poor until the twentieth century and the discovery of oil.

For the issue of the Monroe doctrine, Sweden historically did sell their islands in the Americas to France with no problem. I am saying that selling one extra island at the same time won't be a problem.

As for the congress of Vienna, I will need to look over some things.
 

Deleted member 1487

I'm going to say that further ITTL that Holstein will be removed from Denmark as punishment and the Danish West indies will be given to Sweden as compensation for their efforts, which really have not been addressed ITTL's version of CoV. I am not sure what to do with southern schleswig, but think that, though it is primarily german, it should stay part of denmark for realism. What do you all think?
 
Now the relationship with Denmark and the beginnings of modernization in Sweden are going to become serious issues in TTL. I will need to do some research.



Additionally, Norway would not contribute that much by 1866 to Denmark's resources, as it was much more sparcely populated and was incredibly poor until the twentieth century and the discovery of oil.​

One of the important elements in OTL of the allying of Denmark-Norway, besides Denmark losing Norway was the cutting off of cereals shipments from Denmark to Norway.
TTL the cutting off could be delayed until 1812 thus giving an extra 4-5 years of Denmark being able to ship off cereals which would counter the effects of OTL somewhat. Instead of nine years of famine you get 3. The Norwegian population would recover much faster than OTL.

This effect along the available resources - especially metals would make for Denmark much better prepared in the upcoming conflicts with Germany, if they happens.
Not only in numbers but a Danish army much better equipped with artillery!
The Danish army officers had learned the lesson of massed artillery - OTL they weren't able to bring this about in the post-war army but in TTL they have some of the means to do so!
And be able to avert a go at Slesvig.

The better Denmark-Norway vs Sweden-Finland relationship could make for the Danes fieldtesting the Aaker breachloading guns! ;)
 
I'm going to say that further ITTL that Holstein will be removed from Denmark as punishment and the Danish West indies will be given to Sweden as compensation for their efforts, which really have not been addressed ITTL's version of CoV. I am not sure what to do with southern schleswig, but think that, though it is primarily german, it should stay part of denmark for realism. What do you all think?

Well - you know my answer!
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Additionally, Norway would not contribute that much by 1866 to Denmark's resources, as it was much more sparcely populated and was incredibly poor until the twentieth century and the discovery of oil.

The union with Sweden resulted in the destruction of much of Norvays industry, which were focused on the Danish marked, the Swedish protectionism lay much of Norways mercantile traditions in ruins. If it continue in union with Denmark will be richer and more developed, beside Denmark is unlikely to enter the economical downspiral they only left in the 1830ties, with markeds to their cereals and access to Norvegian products. So in this TTL both Denmark and Norway will be richer

Denmark will without Swedish ultimative demands of receiving Norway leave Napoleon behind and enter the anti-Napoleonic alliance, and will keep Holstein, the loss of the Westindian, Indian and African colonies to UK is quite likely, but Denmark will likely receive some small borderchanges in Europe instead (like the Bichopric of Lübeck).

Without the post-war economical crisis Holstein industrial boom will focus on Copenhagen instead of Hamburg, which will lessen Holsteinian seperatism, so likely we will avoid the 1st Schleswig War.
 

Deleted member 1487

The plot does indeed thicken. It appears that without the Swedish demands for Norway, the situation changes for the Danish. But it looks like they will remain neutral rather than fight the French. So, this means that Holstein will remain Danish, as will Norway. The Danish West Indies will remain Danish too. The colonies were returned OTL and will be here too. So, Sweden doesn't really gain anything, nor does Denmark lose anything. The Danish will experience a postwar economic boom, much as Sweden will. Also, the lack of fighting between the two powers will indeed make their relationship more cordial. Things are going to get interesting later in the century with Denmark, Prussia and Austria.

Stay tuned, the TL will change considerably.
 

Deleted member 1487

Beginning of TL?

POD: Gustav IV is killed by a disgruntled soldier after the disasterous campaign against Napoleon. Rumors suggest that there was a conspiracy of officers and nobles that hated his incompetent leadership. The Riksdag managed to reconvene in the chaos surrounding his death and began seeking peace with the French. Sweden drops out of the war and is rewarded with peace ;). Soon Russia drops out too leaving only Portugal with Britain.

In Sweden, the dissatisfaction with Gustav's rule has soured the nobility to the prospect of his son as king. The Riksdag conspires against the young man and presents him with a choice, either abdicate the throne or submit to their demands. Frightened at the prospect of losing his 'rightful' claim, he acquieces. The resulting demands essentially leave him powerless, just the head of state while all the power rest with the Riksdag.

The aftermath of the war gives Sweden the chance to reform its military with the lessons learned from the drubing they received from the Corsican. Additionally, the Riksdag struggles to straighten the finances of the badly indebted nation. For the next several years, the Swedes focus of remaining neutral while enterprising captains trade with the British.

Eventually the invasion of Russia kicks off (1812) which results in the defeat of Napoleon and the destruction of his Grand Armee. The Riksdag agrees to reenter the coalition and fight France yet again (1813). The war plays out much the same as OTL except that Denmark stays neutral despite the rebuffed demands of Sweden for Norway. Napoleon is driven into exile. The Congress of Vienna and the subsequent return of the Corsican and hundred days play out the same, expect that Sweden is allowed to keep the island of Guadeloupe instead of having to selling it back to France.

The postwar period proves to be quite profitable to Denmark and Sweden, both of whom have not suffered terribly during the war (the short invasion of Britain aside). Denmark is able to continue to export grain and import raw materials to and from Norway and has managed to avoid large dislocations to its economy that happened OTL with the exodus of merchants. Sweden retains the lands of Finland, which prove to be a rich source of materials and an additional source of revenue.

However, in the latter case, a resurgent nationalism begins to brew, as interest in the Finnish language and culture among intellectuals helps create a sense of identity among the people. This movement is muted during the aftermath of the war, as industrialization had begun and would create many jobs in the otherwise rural country. Trade with Denmark and the increasingly powerful Prussia also helped fuel the economy. The primary development in the decades immediately after the war was the liberalizing of the agriculture industry and the rules of trade. Soon a population boom in addition to exports, helped to dramatically change the face of Swedish and Finnish societies. Primarily agricultural in nature, the economy began to diversify as export markets expanded.

Fears of Russian designs on Finland were assuaged as Russian foreign policy was directed towards the south, with wars in Persia and troubles with the Ottomans. It appeared that the barbaric policies being practiced in Old Finland would not be expanded into Swedish Finland. For the moment, prosperity, or rather the hint of prosperity, united the divergent desires of the Swedish empire.
 

Deleted member 1487

1840's on:
Sweden continued on the path of industrialization and Finland on the path of nationalism. Within the sparsely populated nation tensions mounted over the growing Finnish demands for autonomy. Finland had become an important part of the economy and increasing numbers of Swedes had settled in the eastern portion of the nation seeking lucrative work in the milling industry. This increase in Swedish speaking people in the traditionally Finnish speaking regions of the nation had inflamed passions within the nationalist movement. Right-wing publication in Sweden opposed raising the Finnish to a national language or even giving Finns say in the government. As it stood, the majority of the representatives from Finnish parts of the nation were Swedish nobles or wealth 'carpet baggers' (to borrow a term). The situation left many feeling underrepresented.

The Finnish educated elite had to walk a fine line. They recognized that Sweden was a good thing for Finland and that Russia waited on the wings, ready to Russify the nation, much like they had in Old Finland (or so the popular perceptions went). However, the increasing Swedish settlement of Finland was worrisome, as was the vocal groups in Stockholm that demanded 'Swedification' of the eastern province. These alternating impulses resulted in the Great Compromise of 1857. Finnish cultural leaders had been in negotiations with the Riksdag for years over these issues and after the great unrest in the largest cities of Finland in 1856, reforms were fast tracked. The franchise was extended in the Finnish provinces as part of a wider reform of voting rights, as well as the requirements for holding office lowered. This resulted in greater Finnish participation in the Riksdag and Finnish control over most of their local political offices. This caused an uproar in Swedish right wing groups, which was only further embittered as Finnish was made the language of Universities, some government, and basic education in the the Finnish speaking provinces. Swedish settlers were still allowed to have Swedish speaking schools, but they were required to learn Finnish too. Though the nation remained officially Swedish speaking, Finnish was widely taught in schools. Tensions remained for decades, but by the twentieth century the issue was largely moot.

Further economic progress was made and began to grow much more quickly after the 1850's. Major rail lines were built leading to Stockholm and ports from major areas of economic activity. The situation continued in Finland, as larger cities soon had rail lines leading to them from lumber mills and other nascient factories. By the 1860's industrialization was in full swing and Sweden was becoming increasingly wealthy as demand for lumber and steel grew enormously. Immigration to the US was starting to increase dramatically too, but the rapid job growth managed to slow this trend. By the 1890's about 800,000 Swedes and Finns would travel over the Atlantic to start new lives.

By the 1860's the nationalism crisis was growing in other countries, but had come to a head in Germany. The Chancellor of Prussia, Otto von Bismarck, had managed to organized a crisis with Sweden's neighbor, Denmark. The second Schleswig war proved to be especially bloody, despite Prussia's victory. German troops advancing into Denmark found that the Danish army was relatively well equipped for such a small nation and learned an important lesson of modern warfare: firepower beats flesh.
Danish artillery took a brutal toll on massed infantry formations. But the Danish army had not prepared for the tempo of battle and quickly ran out of ammuntion, despite begging to buy more from Sweden and Britain. Prussia was still an important ally of both nations, who refused to aid either side. The collapse of the front led to a new line being formed in southern Schleswig, which required brutal rushes and massed Krupp artillery to break. Finally a peace was made that ceded Prussia southern Schleswig and Holstein, while northern schleswig remained Danish. The Prussians learned valuable lessons from the war and would demonstrate this a few years later in the war with Austria.

Ultimately the war would strain the Scandinavia brotherhood that had reigned since the end of the Napoleonic era. The relationship would eventually be repaired, but this would take time. Otherwise, Germany continued to consolidate in the wake of repeated wars until the founding of the empire in 1871. This economic powerhouse would soon become the largest trading partner of both Scandinavian nations and an important ally of Sweden.
 
Very interesting - keep up the good work. :)
Without the loss of Norway the Danish politicians should be more sane and not dream up things like "never cede anything" or "Denmark to the Eider"!
That should make for willingness to discuss a partition of Slesvig which would be in the interest of the Nation.

Of course wounds will mend - its just a matter of time. And not that bad with a more realistic perception of the political situation. Anyway the Kingdom have only lost lands in personal union because of its head of State.

Sweden:
OTL the Riksdag were reformed in 1866 making for more equal distribution of power. This looks like part of the 1856 reforms!?
 

Deleted member 1487

Indeed, Finnish nationalism forced the issue roughly a decade earlier.
 
wiking, this is interesting and I see you have gone to a lot of trouble to research for the TL. Still, though, I am a bit sceptical about some parts of your depiction of the developments in Finland. For example, while I more or less agree with your setup for the "Great Compromise of 1856" in the previous paragraphs, the compromise itself strikes me somewhat too optimistic.

wiking said:
Finnish cultural leaders had been in negotiations with the Riksdag for years over these issues and after the great unrest in the largest cities of Finland in 1856, reforms were fast tracked. The franchise was extended in the Finnish provinces as part of a wider reform of voting rights, as well as the requirements for holding office lowered. This resulted in greater Finnish participation in the Riksdag and Finnish control over most of their local political offices. This caused an uproar in Swedish right wing groups, which was only further embittered as Finnish was made the language of Universities, some government, and basic education in the the Finnish speaking provinces. Swedish settlers were still allowed to have Swedish speaking schools, but they were required to learn Finnish too. Though the nation remained officially Swedish speaking, Finnish was widely taught in schools. Tensions remained for decades, but by the twentieth century the issue was largely moot.

Like you wrote, ITTL the arena for the call for the strenghtening of Finnish language and culture will be the Riksdag in Stockholm instead of the Finnish Finnish senate and later the Landtag in Helsinki. This is goint to be a problem, because in the Riksdag the *Fennomans and their supporters will be a much smaller group than among the Finnish OTL government. The extension of franchise and thus a greater number of Finländare in the Riksdag is possible, but it would be safe to say that only a part of these would have a Finnish-speaking background or subcribe to Finnish nationalist ideas. In comparison to OTL, a greater part of the elite in Finland would see their interests rather in the terms of the general Swedish elite and would not be so likely to support the *Fennoman movement.

I also am sceptical that the Finnish nationalist movement would be strong enough to cause "unrest in the larger cities": Finns had a history of being loyal subjects of the Swedish Crown, not prone to riots or disturbances, and Finland would have only one larger city, and that one possibly predominately Swedish-speaking. Even though a better access to foreign nationalist and revolutionary ideas would likely increase the instances of militant nationalism in comparison to OTL, Finnish nationalism would still be largely restricted to the upper and middle classes. The first real Finnish language newspaper, Suometar, was established 1847 IOTL, and ITTL could have a few more in existence by mid-century. Still it would likely take decades more time to be able to use the power of the people in this way for pushing through a nationalist agenda.

Because of these reasons, the dominance, both practical and ideological, of the Swedish language, as well as tradition and inertia, the reforms you suggest for 1856 would quite be ahead of their time. IOTL, the official language at the Imperial Alexander University (in Helsinki after being relocated from Turku 1828, the only university in Finland until 1919) before being changed to Swedish was Latin until 1852, the first professorship in the Finnish language was created in 1850 and the first doctoral dissertation in Finnish was accepted in 1858. Even assuming much stronger growth of Finnish nationalism ITTL, Finnish will not become the official language at mid-century. I could see several more tenured positions for Finnish language and culture created, but not much more than that by this time. IOTL, the first secondary school in Finnish was founded in Jyväskylä 1858: ITTL could see a few more by this time, but the overall numbers would still favour the Swedish-language schools by a wide margin.

The use of Finnish would be likely extended in government, but this would likely mean merely adding the language as prerequisite for holding administrative positions in predominately Finnish-speaking areas. To get the same in the Swedish-speaking coast would take for long, because very few, even among the *Fennomans, would see the point in this. Finnish could become a language of basic education for Finns, but would hold a second position to Swedish in any upper education for some time. There is no way in 1856 that compulsory Finnish would or could be imposed on native Swedish-speakers in Finland, much less on settlers; on the contrary I believe an increase in Swedes moving to Finland would create many more Swedish schools also in inland areas.

There is a certain danger in emphasing "Swedish liberalism" as compared to the OTL Russian policies to explain a stronger growth of Finnish rights ITTL. Contrary to possible expectations, the Swedish policy towards Finnish cultural life would not be so "hands-off" the Russian was until the very end of the century: the centralization of the Swedish state was at much higher level to the Russian Empire in the 19th century and this would be seen in cultural policies as compared to OTL. I would contend that as long as the Finnish provinces are ruled directly from Stockholm, the status of Finnish language and culture will remain in a legal limbo because of dominant interests of the rikssvenska elites (and due to prejudices towards the viability of the native culture of the eastern areas). Thus, the cultural rights of Finns could be seen tied to the political rights of Finland as a distinct entity. But when would TTL see a politically autonomous Finnish state?

In the political theory dominant at the time, Finland did not have a history (and thus, a right) of political nationhood (even if it had one ethnically), and so to make a needed amount of leading groups to accept the concept of Finland not being a part of an administratively unitary Swedish state will take a lot of time and effort ITTL. Due to the great efficiency of the Swedish state apparatus and the long-standing trends for centralization, I fear the 19th century would still prove too early for achieving the same degree of autonomy the OTL GD had by 1870 or so.
 
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Deleted member 1487

@DrakonFin: I completely agree with your analysis and plan to revise my TL based on some of what you have said. I actually was not sure as I was writing if my piece was realistic. It is generally a very broad outline of what was happening that left out much of the nuance of the struggle.

Now as far as I am concerned, the Liberal tendencies of the Swedish state was a later development that occurred once the 'colonies' were removed by force. Here the imperialistic attitude will still be in force and Finnish nationalism may be strangled in the cradle. What is going to happen in rewrites is that this nationalism, much weaker, will be used as a power tool by Finnish elites to leverage the Empire in their favor. This will be what will fuel the Compromise. However, it will be much more muted.

To an extent, the removal of the King as the lead power in the Empire by the Riksdag reorients the political landscape in favor of liberal political ideals. As OTL the French king came about, this did not happen so early, but here without royal influence, the "Empire" is going to be different politically and socially. The desire for power for the nation will be important to the mindset of the government, as Sweden's place as one of the great powers at Vienna will boost the impression of grandeur. This may backfire, but will result in a more assertive foreign policy and willingness to fight. Expect to see Sweden in the alliance system in the twentieth century.
 

Deleted member 1487

Revisions

Grand Compromise:
After the end of the Napoleonic wars, Sweden was a vastly different nation politically. The King was now essentially a figurehead and the Riksdag as the source of power. This drastic change proved to be a powerful influence on society, as now the 'people' had more say in how the government ran the country. However, the Riksdag was primarily made up of the nobility and wealthiest Swedes. The People had little actual influence on the government. In the decades following the 'change', liberal ideals began to emerge in the population. Education was expanded and literacy was expanded rapidly. New Universities were founded throughout the nation and funding was made available for innovation in the economy. The expansion of literacy created wider interest in weekly journals and daily newspapers. The People became more politically aware. And they demanded more. As prosperity spread, so did the interest in and knowledge of politics. By the 1830's the desire for representation in the Riksdag was fast becoming a dangerous issue.

Parallel with this expansion of education and political awakening was the renewed interest of Finnish culture and language among the new students in the eastern Universities. Conception of Finland as a seperate people and culture began to influence a number of intellectuals and wealthy individuals. While this awareness of 'otherness' began to spread in educational institutions, the average working man was not interested in or aware of this movement. Sweden had always included 'Finland' and the Finnish middle and lower classes felt Swedish. The effort to create a seperate identity would be an academic pursuit.

The immigration of Swedish speaking workers in the expanding industry in eastern, Finnish speaking provinces began to change the nature of the People there. New people created a new fusion culture that further bound the East to the rest of Sweden. Much of the impetuous of the later Finnish movements would be the result of the perception of the Swedification of the Finnish lands. Ultimately, the struggle for the souls of the Eastern population would be won by the Swedes. The intellectual drive behind the Fennomans would be too seperate from the concerns of the average Finn and supressed by concerned government officials from Stockholm and Turku (the captiol of the Eastern province-it is never moved to Helsinki). Part of the Great Compromise in the east was the freedom of language, which allowed children to be educated in the language they spoke, so long as they learned the language of the nation, Swedish. Additionally, much of the backing for the Fennoman movement were local elites that saw it as a tool to leverage more political rights and freedoms from Stockholm. These sponsors would abandon it after they had what they wanted. Over time, Swedish would become the dominate language in Finland and a seperate identity would not develop among the average Finn. By 1870, the Great Compromise had relegated the Fennoman movement to the halls of Universities and among wistful intellectuals that kept the language alive.

Throughout the nation, the Compromise would give the 'average' person a chance to particpate in government, both locally and nationally. The expanding middle class would grab many seats in the Riksdag and in local parliaments throughout the nation. This was especially important to the eastern provinces, as the local power brokers were tied into the Swedish system, rather than agitating for independence. In the age of revolution, Sweden would remain stable, but unrest in the 1840's would convince the nation's elites of the wisdom of the Compromise. While this would create a solid nation fabric, this union would be sorely tested during the liberalization of the economy and the progressive agenda of socialist agitators later in the century.
 

Deleted member 1487

Military:
Since the end of the Napoleonic wars, the greatest fear of Sweden was the Russian Empire. Finland was a desire of the Romanovs for centuries and the Swedes were not willing to give up their eastern province. Forts were built near the Russian border to give the militias time for the regular army to arrive. But it was realized that Sweden by itself could never hope to compete with the world's largest nation, so a great power was needed to support the country. Prussia, the largest trade partner of Sweden, was quite friendly with Sweden and open to a defensive alliance. This deal was sealed with a marriage pact, as Princess Louise was married to the older King of Sweden in 1826. This helped secure the safety of the nation and would form a significant source of military knowledge for Sweden. The exchange between nations would help modernize the Swedish military and provide its officers with direct experience in the subsequent wars that Bismarck embroiled the nation in.

Ultimately the alliance would be tested as Sweden managed to stay neutral in the Danish-Prussian wars during the 1860's, but strained relations with both nations. However, Swedish officers would notice the great lesson of the wars: firepower trumped manpower. Krupp guns would be a major factor in the modern military. In fact, later advancements in Krupp artillery technology were adopted by Sweden before Germany! National service brought the young men of the nation into contact with the stern discipline that the Prussians had taught their allies, as well as the famous Auftragstaktik that taught independent action and thought. This concept would fit well into the mentality of the woodsmen that made up much of the Swedish countryside. It would also serve the militias well in conflicts with Russia....
 

Deleted member 1487

Russia

Sweden's relationship with Russia had been strained for some time. Russia desired Finland and Sweden wanted to be left in peace. The immediate decades after the Napoleonic wars saw Russia turn south in the Tzar's desire for a warm water port. This gave Sweden a respite and during this period the border regions were fortified. It was hoped that given the devastation inflicted on Russia during the war, she would have limited ability to counter this move while focused on central asia and the ottomans. The gamble worked, but the Russian court became increasingly paranoid about the nation so close to St. Petersburg. The debate raged over whether to move the capitol to Moscow, the spiritual hub of the nation, or to invade Sweden to seize Finland.

By 1834 the Tzar had grown sick of the debate and reached a decision: the capitol would remain in St. Petersburg, to move it would a sign of weakness. However, Sweden was now allied with Prussia, so an invasion was out of the question for the moment, so long as the issues to the south remained unresolved. In the coming years, the troubles with the Ottomans that culminated with the Crimean war would leave the Swedish question off the table. An especially large contingent of soldiers were stations in the capitol just in case, but, asided from a few border skirmishes, peace reigned.

Over the course of decades that the tension flared and ebbed along the border, militias would occasionally clash as one side strayed too close for comfort, or simply had gotten lost in the dark. Eventually, hunters and other woodsmen would take it upon themselves to go raiding Russia farms over the border, as Finnish refugees from the serf system would flee to Sweden. This would result in counter raids and the border conflicts raged until a diplomat from one side or the other would negotiate a truce. Both sides realized how little actual control they had over the porous border between old and new Finland and wanted simply to keep the peace. Over the years this would become more difficult as militia members got involved, seemingly out of sport or boredom. The eventual stationing of regular soldiers in the forts and the expansion of the line to part of the border of old Finland would help control this tendency, but not fully eliminate it. Many would later wonder if these actions caused the great war, but really it was a myriad of factors, few of which had to do with the ongoing struggle in the forests.
 
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Deleted member 1487

Major military trends:
Increasing Prussianization of the training and leadership
Emphasis on Firepower after German experiences in the Danish-German and Franco-German wars
Increased artillery arm with emphasis on indirect fire (result of previous focus)
Fortification of border with Russia, specifically in front of Vyborg with a focus on defending against attacks from St. Petersburg
Emphasis on automatic weapons-machine guns and the Madsen light machine gun
Large emphasis on militia system (national guard) with a medium sized professional force
 
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