The Russians used the 6x4 version until it was replaced by the K6.
See, old trucks vs hot Asian girls take two.
Damn! What's happened to the picture...let's try again.
Superpower Empire: China
- Thread starter Hendryk
- Start date
- Status
Damn! What's happened to the picture...let's try again.
Hendryk
Banned
The Chinese did use a licence-produced version of the K6, the WAW Model 9, but by early 1942 when the Lend-Lease program kicked in, the Studebaker 2.5 ton truck became the all-purpose vehicle of choice with the Chinese military. And from that date the Baobao would mostly be found mounted on the WAW Model 10 "Xitude'er", the name of the Studebaker's local version.Damn! What's happened to the picture...let's try again.
A convoy of US Army Studebaker trucks in Yunnan circa 1943:
Hendryk
Banned
Well, conventional artillery wasn't replaced altogether by rocket launchers, it's just that with this cheaper weapon at hand, the Chinese could focus their limited cannon manufacturing capabilities on the essential models, such as the infantry support 37 mm and the various anti-aircraft guns (anti-tank guns weren't as much of a priority until late in the war, as most of the fighting took place in regions unsuitable for heavy armored vehicles to be deployed in large numbers, and Japanese tanks weren't very efficiently armored to begin with). But all those jobs that could be done by rockets rather than regular shells, were.
There was a psychological aspect to the Baobao as well. The weapon proved a morale-booster to the Chinese troops, and the phrase "We've sent them a hailstorm" was soldiers' slang for "We've blown them to bits". Conversely, the Baobao was greatly feared on the receiving end, and the Japanese learned to duck for cover whenever they heard the telltale high-pitched screaming sounds of the rockets; many a Japanese veteran would have aural flashbacks for years afterwards, to the point of necessitating a ban on fireworks in many Japanese cities after the end of the war.
Hendryk
Banned
German veterans of the Russian front would make the same comments about the Soviet BM-13 "Katyusha" rockets.
To go with my previous post, a Bofors 40 mm anti-aircraft gun used to defend Hong Kong during WW2. (I took that photo at the Hong Kong Museum of Coastal Defense).
Hendryk
Banned
The Bofors 40 mm AA gun? Yes, it was, along with a number of others. Weapon systems-wise, China during the SSJW didn't yet have enough R&D capabilities to design its own equipment from scratch, with some exceptions like the Baobao. By the end of the war, however, certain sectors did have nascent R&D departments, such as aeronautics. (There'll be more about that last bit in the foreseeable future).
Here's a photo of a truck-mounted HL-14 multiple rocket launcher from the early 1950s. The HL-14 is a later version of the original Baobao (officially the HL-12) but looks identical for all intents and purposes; the main improvement, which doesn't show on the picture, is that the rockets have angled fins, giving them a spin for increased range and accuracy. As for the truck, it's a WAW Model 11, essentially a reverse-engineered and marginally improved domestic version of the Studebaker US6 released in the post-war years. The 10-by-4 configuration of the launch tubes is clearly visible.
Hendryk
Banned
Just placing a link to the thread about an earlier Japanese surrender for later reference. There's been quite a bit of useful input that I'll keep in mind when I finally get around to writing that elusive Version 3.0 of the TL.
While I'm at it, I'm also linking to other threads I've started about various issues pertaining to my TL that I wanted to discuss outside of the main thread as I consider it messy enough as it is:
Link to a thread about a question I had about the political career of Henry Courtney, a prominent American presidential also-ran in my TL.
Link to a thread about Jean Moulin and Marshall Leclerc living longer than in OTL.
Link to a thread about Bali acceding to independence separately from the rest of the Dutch East Indies.
While I'm at it, I'm also linking to other threads I've started about various issues pertaining to my TL that I wanted to discuss outside of the main thread as I consider it messy enough as it is:
Link to a thread about a question I had about the political career of Henry Courtney, a prominent American presidential also-ran in my TL.
Link to a thread about Jean Moulin and Marshall Leclerc living longer than in OTL.
Link to a thread about Bali acceding to independence separately from the rest of the Dutch East Indies.
general_tiu
Banned
Damn, I nearly forgot to ask about Korea. What is Korea officially called? Kingdom or Empire?
Hendryk
Banned
This semantic issue, innocuous as it may seem, caused a bit of controversy in 1945 when Korea regained independence from Japan. The Chinese initially insisted that Korea become a kingdom once more, since it had declared itself an empire in 1897 precisely to emphasize the end of its vassal status vis-à-vis China, but the Koreans predictably balked at such a symbolic concession. China eventually decided not to press the matter, considering that it made little difference to its geopolitical tutelage over the peninsula anyway (and after all, did not Laozi say: "When a large country seeks the vassalage of a small one, it is the former that must bow down"?). So Korea became an empire again, and Empress Sunjeong (1895-1966), who had briefly reigned between 1907 and 1910, was reinstated as its legitimate ruler. Being childless, she was succeeded by Prince Wu (1912-1997)*, the son of Yi Gang a.k.a. Prince Imperial Ui (1877-1955).
* I haven't got around to giving him a dynastic name, so any input by experts on Korean culture would be appreciated. In OTL he had the misfortune of being in Hiroshima on a certain day in August 1945, but in TTL he gets to die of old age.
Hendryk
Banned
I don't speak Korean and know little of Korean naming conventions for rulers, so I may have got the name wrong. However, the sources I've looked up say that her dynastic name was indeed Sunjeong (her birth name being Lady Yun of Haepyeong), and her husband's Sunjong (whom I've also seen referred to as the Yungheui Emperor). Sunjong died in 1926 and I assume his titular widow would be the most likely claimant to be reinstated as Dowager Empress in 1945. This being said, if it turns out I'm mistaken on that, I'll correct it.
Hendryk
Banned
Today is the anniversary of my favorite figure in TTL, namely Kang Youwei's daughter, Kang Tongbi. She was born on February 5, 1888 (the sources I'd looked up earlier put her birth date a little before that, but I now consider this date to be the authoritative one), so exactly 120 years ago today.
She appears in my story "The Thousand Iron Phoenixes", but will have a story just for herself in the foreseeable future. Oh, and I wrote her Wikipedia entry too
Here is her picture in 1907, when she enlisted at Barnard College:
She appears in my story "The Thousand Iron Phoenixes", but will have a story just for herself in the foreseeable future. Oh, and I wrote her Wikipedia entry too
Here is her picture in 1907, when she enlisted at Barnard College:
Nice, military rocket fuel is usually Ballistite, a pretty simple compound that is well within the capability of developing countries of that era. Alternatively you can use Salt Peter and sugar. It's a wonder that blackpowder remained the bottleneck of military rockets until the 1930s when so many other alternative fuels existed.
I'll bet they could make a simple nitrous-oxide/paraffin wax hybrid fuel tactical rocket at that time to out range the artillery of the day - if only Robert Goddard was allowed to continue his rocket research.
So many simple technologies were theoritically doable before their time. For example Dennistoun Burney's HESH anti-armour warhead was nothing more than a piece of Nobel 808 plastic explosive fired by a recoilless gun (another simple to make device). Such a weapon would use technology available since the 1930s and take out any tank made until the 1970s.
And another thing, you can use ethanol to fuel your trucks. Ethanol cars used to be as common as gasoline ones in the 1920s. It's ideal for countries that are oil-poor but land and manpower rich. You can mix it with gas to stretch it. What's really cool is a 80:20 ethanol:gas mix makes 100 octane fuel. That's something even the Germans couldn't make because they did have sources for enough alkylates. Only the US and Britain had 100 octane fuel which gave 10-15% more power to fighter aircraft. You lose some range but that's not that big of a deal in intercept missions.
BTW when did the Austin K3 truck enter production?
1941 article on the wartime significance of 100 octane gas:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,772768,00.html
I'll bet they could make a simple nitrous-oxide/paraffin wax hybrid fuel tactical rocket at that time to out range the artillery of the day - if only Robert Goddard was allowed to continue his rocket research.
So many simple technologies were theoritically doable before their time. For example Dennistoun Burney's HESH anti-armour warhead was nothing more than a piece of Nobel 808 plastic explosive fired by a recoilless gun (another simple to make device). Such a weapon would use technology available since the 1930s and take out any tank made until the 1970s.
And another thing, you can use ethanol to fuel your trucks. Ethanol cars used to be as common as gasoline ones in the 1920s. It's ideal for countries that are oil-poor but land and manpower rich. You can mix it with gas to stretch it. What's really cool is a 80:20 ethanol:gas mix makes 100 octane fuel. That's something even the Germans couldn't make because they did have sources for enough alkylates. Only the US and Britain had 100 octane fuel which gave 10-15% more power to fighter aircraft. You lose some range but that's not that big of a deal in intercept missions.
BTW when did the Austin K3 truck enter production?
1941 article on the wartime significance of 100 octane gas:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,772768,00.html
Last edited:
Hendryk
Banned
Thank you
You've noticed, though, how messy this thread has become, with all the corrections and improvements to the TL. I hope to eventually post something that is both reader-friendly and detailed.
I'm not familiar with that. However, one problem is that I'm hopelessly lazy. I much prefer to use hired talent to write on my behalf, as with the TSE series
This being said, I'd like to have a look, if you can give me the link.Thanks for that input. The man who came up with the idea in TTL, Liang Shuquan, existed in OTL as well, but specialized in a different field of chemistry and got his postgraduate degree from a German university rather than an American one. I figured that if I had him go to MIT and meet with Qian Xuesen, the Chinese Von Braun (who did get to meet Von Braun later on in both TTL and OTL), with the SSJW raging in China, he'd get the idea of rocket artillery. So, about a year to make the weapon operational does sound plausible?
In Britain, it started rolling off the assembly lines in 1939. Its production under licence in Chinese factories began at the end of that year, and by 1940 it was ubiquitous in Chinese arsenals (though, as I wrote, it tended to be superseded by the Studebaker US 6 after 1942).
To be honest, not really. There's a lot of work to be done, not just fuel but nozzle design, stabilization (fin vs vectored nozzle spin), launch projector, fuze, warhead, a lot of experimentation. As simple as rockets sound, there just wasn't much research on the subject at the time.
Unless you make your guys students of Robert Goddard, who was THE rocket pioneer in the 1930s. But then he gave up his research because so many prominent collegues rediculed his work. As a consequence the US was a backwater for rocket research leading up to the war. The real experts were in Russia and Germany. And even they took several years to gradually get the Nebelwerfer-41 and Katyusha rockets operational.
You should check out Youtube for a Mythbuster video on nitrous oxide/wax hybride fuel rocket they made. Very cool. Another simple fuel they developed after the war was asphalt and ammonium perchlorate solid fuel. Fairly simple, very cheap, yet very powerful. Of course for the short range rockets you're talking about Ballistite is still the simplest way to go. The sugar/Salt Peter is even simpler. It's the prefered stuff of model rocket makers.
So IMO your guys would be better off in Germany or Russia. Unless you do something with Goddard.
Last edited:
- Status