Suggestions for "La Triplice"

Hello.
Maybe you could know that I'm posting about Italy in the Central Powers
I wish to open a thread to ask advice and suggestions.

Here my first question?
In this world, would Gallipoli happened the same?
Or would England knock out Italy first?
Would we have some British adventure in Sicily or Campania?
 
When does Italy join the war? I understand it would have been hard-pressed to start immediately, in light of the 1911 war and its costs.
 
As i have written in the introduction of my main thread I'm unwilling to go in many details.
However the point is that Italy follows the suggestion of General Pollio and enter in the conflict by 1915, or just in 1914
 
Hello.
Maybe you could know that I'm posting about Italy in the Central Powers
I wish to open a thread to ask advice and suggestions.

Here my first question?
In this world, would Gallipoli happened the same?
Or would England knock out Italy first?
Would we have some British adventure in Sicily or Campania?

Logistically a successful Italian war effort in the CP (as your intro thread seems to imply) makes Gallipoli a near-impossible nightmare. The Italian Navy is going to be commanding the Centeral Med. (Britaiin needs to keep a large porition of her navy up to bottle up the HSF just as IOTL), plus the freeing up the the A-H navy means the Entente is going to be in a rather poor position to conduct operations east of Corsica-Sardinia of any real size, given they don't have a secure line of supply. Given that, Gallipoli is going to be delayed indefinately unless they can crack the R-M (And if they do, than expect French surface raiders attacking coastal commerce to drive Italy out of the war and North Africa)

Those forces are likely set to seizing Italy's Africa colonies instead, and the OE is likely the ultimate benefitary.
 
Ok, i think I'll go for some kind of landing in south Italy, to try to open a searute for ottoman empire and Russia
 
Ok, i think I'll go for some kind of landing in south Italy, to try to open a searute for ottoman empire and Russia

Why a landing first? That's tandimount to suicide for the forces involved if you haven't contained the Regia Marina first. And if you have Italy's already in BIG trouble.

Fundimentally, I don't see how the OE can be hit as hard by the war as your initial post claims while Italy still does well enough to get those results that you're suggesting. I'd find the prospect of the resulting theature being a CP success far more beievable if it included a successful, neutral, or Entente OE rather than a CP-but-still-failed. Say, for example, successful Ottoman offensive against the Suez. That would be a good motivation to try to seize Sicily and clear out a route to the Eastern Med. , since logistically staging a recapture of Egypt or attack on the Turks would require it in that case.
 
Say, for example, successful Ottoman offensive against the Suez. That would be a good motivation to try to seize Sicily and clear out a route to the Eastern Med.

I'm not against the rule of cool, but do you think that without having Gallipoli,Could OE invade Egypt?
This could be very fun to show.
 

BigBlueBox

Banned
Would the Ottomans honestly want to join the Central Powers if Italy joined? If the Bulgarians are in as well that would mean allying with two countries it had fought in the previous five years, and both of those countries could go for a second round after the war. The best decision would be neutrality, and maybe joining the winning side at the very end.
 
Would the Ottomans honestly want to join the Central Powers if Italy joined? If the Bulgarians are in as well that would mean allying with two countries it had fought in the previous five years, and both of those countries could go for a second round after the war. The best decision would be neutrality, and maybe joining the winning side at the very end.

If the POD is the Declaration of War by the GO it's already pretty far down the Germanophile rabbit hole for Turkey in terms of the government. Enver is pretty much dominant, the German mission already is firmly entrenched in the military establishment, and the CP is the only ones willing to extend them loans and equipment to rebuild. Now, with Italian ports open the Goben/Breslau affair is butterflied away due to having safe ports to base out of, but that likely just delays Ottoman entry into the conflict unless the Brits get creative with offering incentives.

Knock on effects though: now that I think about it, Italy in the CP means they'd be obliged to evacuate the Dodecannese as they promised post-Italo Turkish war and youd have a good chance of getting Pro-Ottoman and Pro-Italian factions in Albania to form a cohalition government that could stabilize and organize the country. That would make for a more effective resistance to Serbian armies attempt to fight through if they want to stage an evacuation (though would they? Without an Entente dominance in the Med. would there be a safe place to run too?)
 
Ok, i know about the raid(they try twice) . But could OE have the force to invade and to take Egypt?
Wwi ottoman army seems pretty shabby.

Enver is pretty much dominant, the German mission already is firmly entrenched in the military establishment, and the CP is the only ones willing to extend them loans and equipment to rebuild.
This

Italy in the CP means they'd be obliged to evacuate the Dodecannese as they promised post-Italo Turkish war and youd have a good chance of getting Pro-Ottoman and Pro-Italian factions in Albania to form a cohalition government that could stabilize and organize the country.
Because i refuse to go for a detailed TL i didn't explain why Italy continue to stay in Dodecanese except saying that Ottoman Empire, as Austria-Hungary collapses..
Albania, here, is a puppet of Italy, dangerous near to annexation.
 
Ok, i know about the raid(they try twice) . But could OE have the force to invade and to take Egypt?
Wwi ottoman army seems pretty shabby.


This


Because i refuse to go for a detailed TL i didn't explain why Italy continue to stay in Dodecanese except saying that Ottoman Empire, as Austria-Hungary collapses..
Albania, here, is a puppet of Italy, dangerous near to annexation.

I suggest reading into actual Ottoman performance in the war a little more. The success of and Egyptian expedition does depend on what the British put in their way to resist them, which in turn is dependent on exactly when, how, and in what broader military context the Ottomans enter the conflict, but if they can get control of the Suez and the Brits dont have a route through the Med. than I'll readily argue the Brits would have to evacuate Egypt down the Nile to a point that can be effectively supplied from Port Sudan.

The Turks had the issue of effectively having to fight a 5 front war IOTL despite being the lowest punching of the powers. Given that context, i'd argue that performed rather well with what limited capacity they had. ITTL, the Naval and Straits front are gone, and Sinia-Palestine is advantageous so long as Britain can't regain the eastern Med. (Which requires taking the centeral Med., which would knock Italy in the teeth hard). They'll do better than TOO at least.

Which is my point: I can't see why the Ottomans would collapse remotely the same way they did IOTL given all the other context. Are you married to that particular cliche? Because I think it would be more realistic to look at potential alternate outcomes.
 
I'm a student of Ottoman history..
And I have read some books about OE exploits in war.

Onestly i don't think that Ottomans can push in Egypt.
They weren't able to defend Asia Minor from Russians, another not so good army.
And without Gallipoli, i can immagine an harder British push in Mesopotamia.

Then i can immagine a Kemal Pasha, or also an Enver, putting aside the Arabs for a stronger, compact Turkish nation. (including Azeri and Kurds), and extending it to Caucasus

I used the term collapse, but maybe i could use the term reform.
 
With Italy in the CP the Ottomans are going to be seriously tempted to join up... sure Italy's not on the best of terms, but Egypt is (seemingly) right there for the taking.
At the very least the Germans are going to be strongly encouraging this line of thinking and honestly it's hard for me not seeing the Ottomans being swayed by it. Whether or not an invasion happens basically comes down to "does Mediterranean Jutland see the Entente or the CP fleet victorious" which is probably also the point where the Ottomans declare war if the CP give the French a bloody nose in the Tyrhennian. If that happens then the Ottos land in Alexandria within a month and (given the Brits are tied down in the North Sea, and Italy has lovely bases in East Africa from which to menace reinforcements from India) it's basically GG No Re for the Entente in the Mediterranean.

This is also assuming that 1.2 million Italians don't tip the Battle of the Frontiers to the point where the Germans take Paris....
 
I'm unable to see ottomans gaining against the Brits.
An Ottoman offensive against the Russian...maybe, but they lost against Russians in Asia Minor.(Yes, they took Baku, but pratically there was no more enemies; and Armenian fighters were able to slow the advance ...)
Ottos fought not so bad defending, but lost pratically any battles when attacking.

For what i have read, i truly cannot convince myself about an Ottos invasion of Egypt.
Attacking Caucasus maybe another kettle of fishes.
 
Im telling about the decadence of the Habsburg Double MOnarchy and the end of Austrian empire.
What you wish to see in the next number of "La Triplice"?
 
If Italy is allied to Austria, a major butterfly is that the Brusilov offensive won’t be as successful due to the fact that Germany and Austria’s elite divisions are not diverted to the Alpine Front. So this timeline would make A-H more secure, its fate dependent on the outcome of the war which I assume would go to the Central Powers.
 
I have not detailed the war, so that I'm free to write what i wish for the after war.

However, as you see, Hungary survived the war, but imho Double Monarchy was to fragile to survive a world War
 
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