Stilicho: The Savior Of The West: A Late Roman Empire TL

It also had impacts on Historiography as well. After the sack of Rome, there was some reaction against Christianity because the Pagans claimed that christianity becoming the official religion had meant that the Pagan's god's protections had left Rome (So much so that for a time Pope Innocent I allowed public pagan rituals as a temporary measure). While Augustine said that the Christian temples and sanctuaries were not sacked by the Goths. He argues that the City of God is more important to defend then the City of Rome, since in his time the Roman Empire was decaying very quickly.

I did find out that the Bishops of Illyricum were appointed the Pope of Rome not Constantinople, so that makes a lot of sense for Stillicho to be accepted when he invades. This was also the time period of the debate between Pelagian and Augustine, so depending on how the Emperor decides this could be the time to eliminate or reduce the Augustinian idea of Original Sin.
So the Pelagians essentially believed man had free will over whether he was evil or good?
 
So the Pelagians essentially believed man had free will over whether he was evil or good?

Yeah basically he believed that we were all born innocent. Furthermore that sexuality wasn't evil: “We say that the sexual impulse—that is, that the virility itself, without which there can be no intercourse—is ordained by God.” That sexual instinct was a sixth sense of the body and was morally neutral.
 
Yeah basically he believed that we were all born innocent. Furthermore that sexuality wasn't evil: “We say that the sexual impulse—that is, that the virility itself, without which there can be no intercourse—is ordained by God.” That sexual instinct was a sixth sense of the body and was morally neutral.

Hmm. This could be interesting....

Also, I'm pretty sure the answer will be no, but is it possible to have a different religion trump christianity by this point?
 
Hmm. This could be interesting....

Also, I'm pretty sure the answer will be no, but is it possible to have a different religion trump christianity by this point?

Maybe only in the East, I was thinking if Illyria is part of Rome that would deny many troops for the defense of the East. If the Sassanids or internal rebellion breaks out there than Roman backed christianity could take a hit and Zorastrianism or some other heresies could rise up.
 
Maybe only in the East, I was thinking if Illyria is part of Rome that would deny many troops for the defense of the East. If the Sassanids or internal rebellion breaks out there than Roman backed christianity could take a hit and Zorastrianism or some other heresies could rise up.

I was thinking of something different militarily wise for the east. I'll keep this in mind though as I am far from certain about what I have in mind.
 
One of the difficulties with Pelagius is that most of what (we think) we know comes from Augustine. And Augustine, like many polemicists was not averse to creating a few straw men to win an argument. As an earlier poster mentioned, as part of the debate Augustine framed the idea of Original sin as it is understood in Western Christianity.
That said, orthodox/mainstream Christianity has us all saved through Christ's life, death and resurrection. Note it is all three that are salvific. Christ was human, part of the human condition is death, so he had to die so as to be fully human. Some groups concentrate exclusively on the death, hence atonement theology.
Now if, as Pelagius is claimed to have said, we can save ourselves by our own efforts, we do not need God's grace. This means that there was no need for Christs life, death and resurrection, which makes the life of Christ pointless.
It is worth pointing out that Pelagius was a Western issue. The Eastern churches had a different concept of Original Sin which had nothing to do with sexuality.
 
Stilicho's Death And The Rise of Constantius

The western empire was relatively quiet from 414-420. The years of peace, only unbroken by intermittent raids across the Rhine and other incursions, was a welcome relief from the turbulent times experienced since the ascension of Theodosius. By contrast, the east had been having trouble on their Danubian borders, as the hunnic king Rugila had been repeatedly raiding into the Balkans, causing them much trouble. No doubt Stilicho's presence in the west kept the king out of Illyricum, and strictly in Thrace. Stilicho had offered on multiple occasions to come to the aid of the east, but they were still wary of his intentions, and continued to refuse the offer.

In 415, the King of The Goths, Alaric, died of an unknown illness. It seems there was much feuding between the various Gothic nobles, and they remained fractured and disunited, different Goths supporting different nobles. The one with arguably the largest support, was the staunchly pro-Roman Saurus, with his main opponent being the brother of Alaric, Athaulf. The feuding and disunity in the Goths was just what Stilicho had been hoping for, in order to be sure they would cease to be a threat, at least for the rest of his lifetime.

How close Stilicho and Constantius were was exemplified when in 417 (the same year Constantius won the consulship), Stilicho allowed Constantine to marry Galla Placidia, essentially tying him to the House of Theodosius. It is clear Stilicho did not see him as a threat to his power, and if anything, saw him as a strong ally.

It is not known how Stilicho died, but in 420, at the age of 61, the savior of the west took his final breath. There was much mourning in the empire, and even Theodosius in Constantinople expressed his sadness at his rival's death. Honorius, without a male heir and dying, appointed Constantius as co-emperor the following year.

Shockingly, Theodosius refused to recognize this in the east. Although highly surprising, this is likely due to Constantius' association with Stilicho. It is probable that Theodosius saw a powerful general like Constantius, who was also Stilicho's right hand man, as a threat to the east. No doubt Theodosius' future actions would lend this theory some merit.
 
Couldn't you have Honorius man up and have a son with Stilicho's daughter? So the line will "live on"...

Honorius is still married to Maria ITL. On the bright side, he doesn't start creeping on his sister, so Placidia never conveniently flees to Theodosius with Valentinian III...
 
Never too many Late Roman timelines! ;)

Keep it coming slydessertfox. I'm strongly rooting for the Romans.
 
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