SS United States

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Been lurking, finally joined up.
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[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Several random thoughts, I was wondering how US Flagged ships could of stayed competitive with 3rd world flagged ships.I have always thought that the American merchant marine basically imploded. Anyways here I go...[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Military puts Newport news on notice that they are thinking of using the SS United states for duty in Korea, but never proceeds with the plan. SS United States enters service per in our time line. Butterflies start[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Sister ship approved(I'll call her the SS Columbia and it's assigned to Matson line for duty in the Pacific), Congress again gets smart and realizes that troops sent overseas via ship got there more rested and had most of the paperwork and immunizations completed when the troops arrived in Germany or England. Plus the troops could carry more of their personal gear, saving on shipping costs as well. That helps reduce the Subsidy by maritime commission.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]In the mid 60's the SSUS is updated with improvements based on the design William F. Gibbs wanted to do, but maritime commission blocked it, adding bathrooms to some 3rd class(tourist)cabins converting them into Cabin compatible. Tourist class was used for Students, and enlisted troops. Senior enlisted and officers would go Tourist(2nd Class) . Tourist was upgraded so they could be used as one class ships like the, SS Queen Elizabeth 2, SS, France, As well as other " Part time liners and part time cruise ships"[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Unions get smart and realize that with fewer ships they loose jobs they don't strike as often. The United States line made a unheard of offer to allow the unions ownership in the line. Unions then were more involved and the more money the line made, the more unions made. At the time ownership was capped at 49%. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]While the SSUS and Columbia were still holding high average passenger loads. they lobbied the maritime commission to do more cruising, as at times they had more crew than passengers on board. Between Cruising and with congress allowing US flagged ships to have casinos, thus bringing in more income, Increasing cruising during the year(like the QE2 and Rotterdam). At times both ships were doing world tours, one eastbound, the other west bound. The Columbia starts Cruising part of the year and transpacific crossings to Japan and other US territories in the Pacific. More and more Troops going to Viet Nam now going by ship, Again troops arrive better prepared on arrival. Besides the liners, the defense dept brought several troopships out of mothballs to make up for increased numbers of troops,[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]During the oil crisis in the early 70's SSUS And Columbia, are overhauled for several months while the forward engine room is mothballed and 2 screws removed and capped to reduce drag. They then return to service with reduced crew and lower speed to save on fuel costs. They then returned to cruise duty . The mothballed engine room could be returned to use within a short dry dock period if needed. The United States and Columbia are modified so that the forward cargo holds are converted to container usage. This helps stay off the end for a few more years. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]In the late 70's and the early 80's the Mothballed ships Constitution and Independence are refurbished and brought back to service as full time cruise ships, One in the Caribbean and other in Hawaiian waters. after having their steam plant converted to Diesel. One engine room is also removed. As with the older ships the cargo holds are converted to container shipping. Plans are also brought up to replace the SSUS and Columbia as the ships now are 30+ years old. With the end of the cold war, fewer troops are being sent overseas, and the military had enough troopships that the older ships no longer were needed to carry troops. Plans were made upgrade the troop quarters to cabin class but in the end It just wasn't feasible. In the end the twins were removed from service and laid up. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]What would the other butterflies of this be? Would other cruise lines like Carnival Which is American owned would they have American flaged ships? Would they still of gone with flags of convenience. What does everyone think.
docfl
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I'm sure you are aware of the current situation with SSUS. While it would be great to remodel her for cruising it will take a vast amount of money. I don't remember if the documentary about mentioned that she still had yet to be stripped of tons of asbestos. The hull is still in fine condition.

There are a host of problems with the SSUS, you should also have mentioned her predecessor SS America which was a virtual miniature of SSUS. The jet really signalled the doom ocean liners. The newer cruise ships being built will just introduce new amenities and things that the hulls of the SSUS and SSC can't provide. An important selling point for cruise ships is the cabins with balconies.

I believe that the old France, later known as the SS Norway has been withdrawn from service. They can not compete with newer ships. Also the US cruising market is a fairly recent occurance, probably really gained notice in the 1980s.
 
I'm sure you are aware of the current situation with SSUS. While it would be great to remodel her for cruising it will take a vast amount of money. I don't remember if the documentary about mentioned that she still had yet to be stripped of tons of asbestos. The hull is still in fine condition.

There are a host of problems with the SSUS, you should also have mentioned her predecessor SS America which was a virtual miniature of SSUS. The jet really signalled the doom ocean liners. The newer cruise ships being built will just introduce new amenities and things that the hulls of the SSUS and SSC can't provide. An important selling point for cruise ships is the cabins with balconies.

I believe that the old France, later known as the SS Norway has been withdrawn from service. They can not compete with newer ships. Also the US cruising market is a fairly recent occurance, probably really gained notice in the 1980s.

I understand there are plans to put the SS United States back into service. She just won't have anything like the speed she had when she was new, but yes the hull is still seaworthy. As for the Norway, she was scrapped in October of last year.
 
Yes the Norway(France) is no more, The point I was trying to make is the Like the France with some remodeling(Which the United States Lines and William Gibbs wanted to do) Was to do basically the same thing. The France was not a success as a ocean liner but was successful as a cruise ship.
Yes the airlines did make a major cut of transatlantic travel. Still even before the SSUS was withdrawn she was still making crossing full. What really caused the end was 1 labor trouble, the unions were striking all the time causing the line to cancel may trips, Also in order to make up the losses from increased labor the mairtime commission was subsidising the line. Just as Britian did for the QE2, France for the France, and Italy for the Raffello and Michalangelo. Supprisingly there were other ships without goverment subsidys, such as the Rotterdam and Neuw Amsterdam were successfull because they were converted to mostly full time cruising. The US Maritaime commission and the unions would not let the United States line do more than a handfull of cruises a year. The America which was built just before WW2, was sold to Chandris line where she spent 30 years as a very successfull cruise ship.
With the butterflies I mentioned, the unions cooperationg and the Maritime commission allowing changes, there was a very good chance the SSUS could of made money.
As to the SSUS Today in Philly, NCL bought her and the Independance to prevent other lines from buying american built hulls, to keep compititon from their Hawawian operation(which is doing poorly). The SSUS is again for sale, While it is an empty Hull, It possibly could be rebuilt cheaper than a newbuild, but It would not have the features of a modern cruise ship, Multi story atriams, balcony state rooms and so forth.
Thanks for your comments.
docfl
 
I think one of your basic problems in the concept of unions cooperating with management which doesn't happen a lot of the time until its too late.
 
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