Sports WI: Magic not a Laker, Bird not a Celtic

A lot of people say that the NBA's turnaround began when Bird and Magic entered the league in 1979-80. When Bird and Magic were rookies, the NBA was considered too black, there was a big cocaine problem, NBA playoffs and final games were on tape-delay, and the league was considered to be dying. Bird and Magic's rivalry was a big catalyst in making the league popular(and MJ's arrival really re-inforced that). But, a lot of that attribute that to the fact that Magic was a Laker and Bird was a Celtic.

In 78, Bird said he was going back to school, and the NBA sent out a memo that said not to draft him since he was going back. Auerbach decided to draft him anyway. People were shocked, but Red said that "you know how short of a time a year is". What if he didn't do that? What if nobody picked him, and he entered the 79 Draft? Speaking of the 79 Draft, the Bulls and Jazz had the coin flip for the #1 pick, and the Jazz won. However, they had to give the pick to the Lakers for an earlier trade for Gail Goodrich. What if the Bulls won? Or, what if the Jazz didn't make that trade? Would the NBA's popularity have grown in the 80's if Bird and Magic were on different teams?
 
Well, they met in the 1980 finals, if memory serves, though I'm not a huge fan of basketball, so I can't say for sure. that matchup was a classic that really helped.

If Bird is with the Bulls, I think they culd do it, but the problem is, the Bulls wouldn't be in a positin to draft Jordan then. Chicago is a huge market, though, at least.

Without Bird, the Celtics might get better in '79, but not that much better. I think having one of the leage's premiere teams floundering also hurts a lot; it wasn't as bad in the '90s and early 2000s, but even then, there was a decline in popularity after Michael Jordan retired the 2nd time, IIRC.

What's really going to hurt is if Michael Jordan sees the NBA in such bad shape that he opts for a baseball career to begin with; which is possible, if the NBA is in really dire straits. After all, he wasn't even the consensus #1 when he came out, Clyde Drexler (okay, a HOF'er, so Portland didn't get it totally wrong, but maybe the only time in history a HOF'er can be called a miss) and Sam Bowie (or is it David? No..I think David was the frontiersman...) went before him.

the Bird/Magic rivalry was only 2 times a year during the regular season, and with Magic not with the Showtime Lakers, it wouldn't be as big of a draw. And, with one more year without them, the NBA probably still survives. However, I can see more teams in trouble, and maybe the contraction of a couple teams like the Cavaliers (which at that piont were making all the dumb trades they could, anyway - the owner was routinely called "Ted Stupid").

I thik Jordan probably comes into the NBA anyway, unless it's so bad that it looks like he won't be able to make much money. If he would decide to try for baseball, he probably spends 5-6 years in the minors and winds up making the majors as a good utility outfielder who can't hit the curve but has great skills otherwise. (With 10 or so more years to hone his skills, I thikn he had the athletic talent to do that, and maybe play a decade or so in the bigs.) And, the NBA probably does die down to a level like...oh, I don't know, the NHL's popularity.

But, I think it still survives, even with Bird and Magic with bad teams and Jordan in baseball; basketball is still quite popular, at least the college variety.
 
Bird and Magic

Well, they met in the 1980 finals, if memory serves, though I'm not a huge fan of basketball, so I can't say for sure. that matchup was a classic that really helped.

Actually, they met in the 79 NCAA Finals. They didn't meet for the championship again until the 84 NBA Finals.

If Bird is with the Bulls, I think they culd do it, but the problem is, the Bulls wouldn't be in a positin to draft Jordan then. Chicago is a huge market, though, at least.

That could have happened. If Bird doesn't get drafted in 78, he would have been one of the top 2 picks in 79 along with Magic. You could have had a Bulls-Lakers rivalry instead of Celts-Lakers.

What's really going to hurt is if Michael Jordan sees the NBA in such bad shape that he opts for a baseball career to begin with; which is possible, if the NBA is in really dire straits. After all, he wasn't even the consensus #1 when he came out, Clyde Drexler (okay, a HOF'er, so Portland didn't get it totally wrong, but maybe the only time in history a HOF'er can be called a miss) and Sam Bowie (or is it David? No..I think David was the frontiersman...) went before him.

I still think that Michael would have been in the NBA. I don't see him as a baseball player. He would have stuck with that more in High School if that were going to be the case. I think he only went to baseball that short time in the 90's because of his father's death. If the Bulls take Bird in 79, they did have a team that got to the second round in 81(but lost to Boston). In this alternate reality, however, they get to the Finals and beat Houston. Then, by 84, they struggle somewhat, but are in the position to draft John Stockton. Then, Jordan gets taken third overall by the Mavericks(who had the next pick in 84 after the Bulls), and, with a nucleus of Mark Aguirre, Rolando Blackman, Derek Harper, James Donaldson, and Karl Malone(they draft him #1 in 85 instead of Schrempf in this ATL) win it all in 87 and 88.
 
the big problem is you have to make Red Aurebach not Red Aurebach. You honestly think red after discovering the Bird is eligible to be draft and could go to school play his entire senior year without losing the rights to him, that he wouldn't do it. The Celtics had 2 first rounders that year so Red thought nothing of taking a big gamble. You have to make Aurebach not Aurebach. Also Red wanted Bird, if he doesn't get him in the 78 draft he would tank the season in order to get him in the 79 draft. Once Red wanted a player he got the player.
 
Memo

the big problem is you have to make Red Aurebach not Red Aurebach. You honestly think red after discovering the Bird is eligible to be draft and could go to school play his entire senior year without losing the rights to him, that he wouldn't do it. The Celtics had 2 first rounders that year so Red thought nothing of taking a big gamble. You have to make Aurebach not Aurebach. Also Red wanted Bird, if he doesn't get him in the 78 draft he would tank the season in order to get him in the 79 draft. Once Red wanted a player he got the player.

One thing that could have been done was maybe penalizing the Celtics by forfeitting the Bird pick since the league sent out a memo telling teams not to draft him since he was going back to school, but that probably wouldn't have worked since Bird was draftable since his original class graduated from college(Bird graduated HS in 74, not 75). Another possibility would have been a team like the Pacers, since he was a local product, taking him. They picked ahead of Boston in 78. They were one of five teams, along with Portland, the Kings, Knicks, and Warriors, that had a shot at him before Auerbach made the selection. If nobody takes Bird in 78, the Celts had the third overall selection in 79. In OTL, he did trade that pick for Bob McAdoo, but, he might have kept that pick if Bird was there and tried to use it to move up to get him. I don't see either the Bulls or the Lakers giving up one of the top two picks, however. They know that Bird and Magic are clearly the best players. The Lakers, who got that pick in 79 in an earlier trade with Utah, who had the worst record in the West, won the coin flip and got Johnson. I think the Bulls would have taken Bird, and then the Celtics, needing a big man to eventually replace Cowens, and remembering the luck he had with a former USF center, would have taken Bill Cartwright at #3. I think that Red still would have rebuilt the Celts into a contender in the 80's without Bird. As for MJ, who knows where he ends up in 84 if Bird is a Bull and they have a good team.
 
The Lakers and Celtics met three times during the 80's. In 1984, 1985 and in 1987. The Celtics won the first meeting, while the Lakers won the last two.

Without Magic, the Lakers still would have been a very good team with Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Jamaal Wilkes, Norm Nixon, Michael Cooper, along with whoever they chose in 79. They likely would have made the playoffs every year in the 80's, though I doubt without Magic they would have won as many, or any championships. The only reason that the Lakers were fortunate to get the first pick in the 79 draft was because in 76, they had traded away a very good player in Gail Goodrich to the New Orleans Jazz for their 1st round draft pick in 1979, and the Jazz had sucked in the 78-79 season.

For the Celtics, they had Dave Cowens and Nate Archibald, but they were both veterans. The Celtics had been a horrible team prior to Bird, and if they had not drafted him there would have seemed to be no reason why the Celtics would not have remained around .500 for the next few years. You have to remember that Bird was actually picked by the Celtics in 78, back when you could draft players whose class had not graduated yet, and the other possibilities of that draft included Mychal Thompson or Michael Ray Richardson. But yeah, before too long the Celtics would have rebuilt into a playoff contending team.

For the more immediate POD, with the Lakers and Celtics not as good as they were, I would expect that the 76ers with Dr. J would win more championships in the early 80s. In OTL, they won in 83, and all the other years they were knocked out by either the Lakers or Celtics in the Finals or Conference finals.

After that, the POD really starts to kick in and there would be no way to predict who would be after the 76ers.

If Magic had gone to the BUlls, as he certainly would have had they won the coin flip, they would immediately have been a playoff contender, as Magic would have had a supporting cast of Reggie Theus and Artis Gilmore, but probably not enough to win a championship. Because they get Magic, they certainly don't get Michael Jordan in 84.

The POD is still recent enough in 1984 that Jordan, Barkley, Olajuwon, and others to come into the league. But for those players who were to grow up idolizing Magic and Bird and watching all their videotapes (Kobe, Lebron, etc), are likely not to make it to the NBA because of the POD.

As for the NBA as a whole, its likely they would survive as a professional league, and remain a fairly popular one at that. Magic and Bird would still be in the NBA, and their rivalry will still draw attention, but not what it had than in OTL when they joined the Lakers and Celtics. They would still be Hall of Famers, but they wouldn't be the trancendant players that they ended up being.

As an NBA fan, and especially as a LA Laker fan, I'm glad history turned out the way it did.
 
The POD is still recent enough in 1984 that Jordan, Barkley, Olajuwon, and others to come into the league. But for those players who were to grow up idolizing Magic and Bird and watching all their videotapes (Kobe, Lebron, etc), are likely not to make it to the NBA because of the POD.

Isn't Kobe the son of a basketball player? He might still go to the NBA.
 
Lakers

As an NBA fan, and especially as a LA Laker fan, I'm glad history turned out the way it did.

Even though I can't stand the Lakers, they had a great team in the 80's(although their 00-02 run was a fluke). However, they were really lucky to get the players that they did:

1. In 1969, Phoenix and Milwaukee had a toss for the #1 pick and Jabbar. What if Phoenix wins instead? I don't think Kareem ever puts on a Laker uni until the tail end of his career, if ever.
2. The Magic situation. That could have gone a few different ways:
a. I was watching something on the Big Ten Network about the 78 Spartans and their tough loss to Kentucky in the 78 Mideast Final. The show said that, if they would have won it all in 78, he might have came out, although he thought the Kings had the #1 pick, and he didn't want to play for them. Portland, though, actually would be drafting #1. What if they win the NCAA in 78, he comes out, and Portland takes him? I don't know why he would reject them. They were the 77 World Champs. That was a good situation to go to.
b. The Coin flip: In 79, the Bulls could have got Magic instead.
c. 1980. The Spartans barely got into the tourney in 79 because they had stiff competition within their league, and they only took the top two teams in each conference then. What if they didn't make the Big Dance? He could have went back to school, and then came out in 1980, where the Pistons could have got him #1. That would have been the latest, in my mind, that he would have came out.
3. Worthy: That was a stupid trade by an idiot owner. Talk about your all-time luck.

That is why I hate LA.

Isn't Kobe the son of a basketball player? He might still go to the NBA.

Yes, his dad was "Jellybean" Bryant, a role player for the Sixers in the 70's and 80's, so, he probably still would have been an NBA player.
 
Kobe was born right before the POD (August 1978), meaning that he'll still exist and with his god given talent still probably make it to the NBA. Anyone who was a great player that was born before the POD probably still makes it to the NBA (MJ, Hakeem, David Robinson, Shaq, etc), but many role players are left out, while some other people would make it for whatever reason.

Anyone born after the POD is subject to the butterflies. (No Lebron, no CP3, no Dwayne Wade, etc).

I admit that in the grand scheme of NBA history, the Lakers have been quite fortunate. They have been the most consistently good team in the NBA, starting with the George Mikan Lakers of the 40s and 50s, though the Jerry West and Elgin Baylor years in the 60s. Then we added Wilt Chamberlain in 68 and played there until he retired in 73. Then two years later we had Kareem, then Magic, Worthy, Byron Scott, Rambis, Cooper and the gang. There was a down period in the mid 90s after showtime broke up, but then we got Shaq and Kobe, and right now Kobe's Lakers are competing for the title.

Though I am a big Laker fan, I admit the Celtics have had two unfortunate PODS.

In 1986, their top pick, Len Bias, dies from a drug overdose. Bias had been projected to be a superstar player, almost on the same level as Jordan. Had he spent his entire career with the Celtics, they certainly would have been a championship contending team for the rest of the 80s and throughout the 90s.

The impact Bias' death had on the Celtics was as bad as if that had happened to Kobe back in 1996, or if something had happened to Magic in 79.

Also, in 1993, one of Boston's most talented young players, Reggie Lewis, dies.

It might explain one reason why Boston did not win a championship from 1986 to 2008 (It was called the Len Bias curse because Bias was 22 when he died).
 
Celtics

With the Garnett trade in 07, it seems like they got their old magic back. That is the type of trade that Red used to make all the time before the Bias tragedy. The 1980 trade of the #1 overall pick(obtained before from Detroit) to the Warriors for the #3 pick(McHale) and Robert Parish was one example, the 84 trade of Gerald Henderson to the Sonics for their 1986 #1 was another(that was how they got in the position to draft Bias), and the trade in 83 when they traded Rick Robey to Phoenix for All-Star G Dennis Johnson were the three prime examples of Red's magic. Bias would have kept that going, obviously. Then, because they would have had the league's best record and won more rings, what if he would have drafted some good players at the end of the first round, like Vlade Divac or Cliff Robinson(he was a good player with Portland) in 89, or Kukoc in 90, and then still take Rick Fox in 91 at the end of the first, and get Latrell Sprewell or P.J. Brown at the end of the 92 first round? Bird and McHale play at least 2-3 years longer, and they would have been alright if something still happened to Reggie Lewis. Then, Pitino might not have came in to coach and be the GM. I heard, however, that they got a bad owner around the mid-90's, and maybe they slide to the bottom of the league by 00 anyway.
 
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