Sparta Reborn

NapoleonXIV

Banned
Create, within modern Europe, a contemporary Sparta. A little country, preferably a city-state, disproportionately militarily powerful because EVERYBODY is in the military. POD can be anything or time you like, which is why I'm putting this here instead of after 1900.

Extra credit if it's a fairly democratic state and/or nice place to live.
 

Blackwood

Banned
Esto...es...Esparta! :D

Seriously, though. Everybody in the military? And a nice place to live?

...difficult.
 

Blackwood

Banned
Don't think so, wouldn't "Ésta" technically be "This one is Sparta"?

At any rate, I'll support Esto with the actual line from the Spanish soundtrack in 300.
 

Solomaxwell6

Banned
A city state couldn't be that powerful militarily, even if that's its big focus. Think about it. Focusing entirely on the militarily means the economy wouldn't be that great, nor would the technology, so you'd have a relatively large, but poorly equipped military. On the other hand, if you focus on the other things, then the military wouldn't be so large, which would avoid the point of the question. If you mean everyone's in the army reserve, rather than active troops, than you've just got one of several actual countries that have similar programs (Israel and Korea, I think, are somewhat like that).

Really, to be honest, a country like that can't begin to function, even if it's small. Even if you look at Sparta, the ancient city state only managed to exist because there were only a few hundred or thousand citizens, with large numbers of slaves.
 

Kaptin Kurk

Banned
Well, if it's a Sparta analouge:

Only 1 out of 10 citizens really need to be in the military, or citizens at all. The rest could be slaves. Alright, they probably wouldn't be slaves in the modern since of the word, so...

Have it be a monarchy, or oligarchy, where about 1/10 people can trace noble heritage, and all those with royal heritage have to serve in the military.

The rest of the people don't have much say in the affairs of the state, but are diversified. And it'd have to be more than a simple city state, but Sparta could be it's capitol city and hold about 1/2 to a 1/3rd of the population...

It'd work out better for them if they found oodles of oil under sparta, or something, so the ruling elite don't have to depend on a tax base for their money, but instead just pump it out of the ground. That way they can ignore and oppress their people better.

With oil money, and good relations with other states, they could afford to buy top notch military equipment and punch above their weight....but if they're like the spartans, they'd be more concerned with keeping their people down than fighting other nations. But maybe they've whalloped the Turks once or twice, or something, so have earned a rep...

All supported by the finest oil and diamond and gold mines...which the ancient greeks never discovered...but modern tech and a druken sheppard did around 1920
 
Glen

Glen

Moderator
NapoleonXIV said:
Create, within modern Europe, a contemporary Sparta. A little country, preferably a city-state, disproportionately militarily powerful because EVERYBODY is in the military. POD can be anything or time you like, which is why I'm putting this here instead of after 1900.

Extra credit if it's a fairly democratic state and/or nice place to live.
Click to expand...

Pick any one of the smaller Swiss Cantons. Done.:D
 

Constantius

The Third Reich, rather than setting up concentration camps, turns all of the "undesirables" into helot style serfs. The Aryan race project continues on, creating in time a race of soldiers not unlike the ancient Spartans (as far as discipline and raw physical strength go).

Something like that maybe?
 
FrolicsomeQuipster

FrolicsomeQuipster

Constantius said:
The Third Reich, rather than setting up concentration camps, turns all of the "undesirables" into helot style serfs. The Aryan race project continues on, creating in time a race of soldiers not unlike the ancient Spartans (as far as discipline and raw physical strength go).

Something like that maybe?
Click to expand...

Now find a way to incorporate mainstream spartanish Aryan man love and you get a cookie.
 

Rockingham

Banned
NapoleonXIV said:
Create, within modern Europe, a contemporary Sparta. A little country, preferably a city-state, disproportionately militarily powerful because EVERYBODY is in the military. POD can be anything or time you like, which is why I'm putting this here instead of after 1900.

Extra credit if it's a fairly democratic state and/or nice place to live.
Click to expand...
Paraguay was a bit like that for a while.....
 
Sanderford

Sanderford

Mars said:
Democratic and nice place to live?
thats is not sparta
Click to expand...

Not really, but, when you think about it, in the United States every able bodied man is considered in the military by virtue of being in the Militia, and let's face it, problems aside, America is a nice place to be. Also, time and again, the USA has been able to produce a massive, highly effective military force seemingly from nowhere.

Notice how NapoleonXIV did not specify full time military service, just that everybody is in the military.
 

rcduggan

maybe at some point an Orthodox knightly order forms in Greece (during Ottoman occupation?) and occupies the area where the city of Sparta was, they found a Spartan Monastic State, and it functions somewhat like Mount Athos: an autonomous monastic state, but this one founded by a still-militant Order where every member is also a soldier.


or were you aiming for a SURVIVING Sparta, from the ancient times up until now?
 

Flocculencio

Donor
aktarian said:
Israel is closer.....
Click to expand...

Singapore, Israel, S. Korea, Taiwan and Switzerland are probably the closest. Basically the countries which have meaningful National Service laws i.e. not like a lot of the European ones where deferment is easy and training is only intermittent and short-term.

Then again all of those are more like the Roman Republic rather than Sparta- all male citizens are required to serve. A proper Spartan analogue would have all male citizens as actively serving professional soldiers.
 

aktarian

Flocculencio said:
Singapore, Israel, S. Korea, Taiwan and Switzerland are probably the closest. Basically the countries which have meaningful National Service laws i.e. not like a lot of the European ones where deferment is easy and training is only intermittent and short-term.

Then again all of those are more like the Roman Republic rather than Sparta- all male citizens are required to serve. A proper Spartan analogue would have all male citizens as actively serving professional soldiers.
Click to expand...

well, if high degree of militarisation is your only criteria then yes.
 

Solomaxwell6

Banned
Not really, but, when you think about it, in the United States every able bodied man is considered in the military by virtue of being in the Militia,
Click to expand...

Ehh...

That's not at all comparable to what the Spartans had. Maybe I just missed my agoge, but I don't recall doing any sort of military training, even if, technically speaking, I'm part of the reserve militia.
 
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