Spanish Armada succeeds

On England -- IIRC, Phillip wanted to install his daughter Isabella to the throne (I think he was somehow claiming it through his dead wife, Mary... yeah :confused:) Still a good possibility he'd settle for a Stuart, though...

I checked it out, apparently the only time that Isabella was mentioned with England in the same sentance was in the film, Elizabeth, so I can't really see it as being accurate or factual.

On France -- Phillip II wasn't the type, esp. in his early years, to say no to a war, even if he had a lot of other problems on his plate (joined the Hapsburg league while fighting a Dutch rebellion, etc); so I can easily see him going ahead with his French intervention. The Hughenots would, I have to think, demoralized upon hearing the fate of England; Cardinal de Bourbon taking the throne may be possible...
Actually, during the same time as the Spanish Armada, Henri IV had just taken the throne. In the aftermath of the Spanish Armada, Parma's invasion force for England was used instead to invade France.

On the Netherlands -- Unsure; on the one hand, they're losing a major ally in England, even if they never got direct support; OTOH, Spain had tried OTL to retake the Dutch for decades without success, so it may be less of an impact than that...
Yeah, I can't really see much changing in the short term. Of course, in the long term there'll probably be a lot of different consequences.
 
Actually, during the same time as the Spanish Armada, Henri IV had just taken the throne. In the aftermath of the Spanish Armada, Parma's invasion force for England was used instead to invade France.

I stand corrected :eek:

That means the Edict of Nanes endures, but the UPI are a lot less likely to endure, probably gone by 1650. With a Catholic England and a shorter lived Dutch Republic, the HRE may be more likely to tear up the Peace of Augsburg and come down hard on protestants sometime in the 17th Century. We could be looking at Protestantism ended as a force on the Continent, outside of Sweden.
 
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Anyway, at the risk of repeating myself, does anyone have anymore theories? I've more or less completed the first section of the AAR and I'll have it posted up tomorrow. First, though, I'd like your theories so if I have to, I can change the AAR quickly to make it more logical and makes sense.
 
Another area is in how long Spain can continue to maintain its hold over England? At this point, Spain's finances had largely run out and was overreliant upon bullion exports from the New World which were irregular at best. What can England basically provide for Spain's coffers? I know that England did a very good trade in wool, so how far might that continue?

Spain's shipments might become less irregular if English warships are not constantly attacking it. Of course, the question will arise as to whether the Dutch will be able to step into their shoes, or potentially some sort of amalgam of Free England and Scotland (which could be sort of like North Korea and South Korea, here with the Free English accepting James as king of England, and Scottish inflluence stretching over the NE and NW...)

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
According to wikipedia, in exchange for the support of the Pope, both he and Philip II would come together to decide who the next King of England was. It had been decided that Cardinal William Allen, a English Cardinal in exile, would take over temporarily. I've been doing some tracing, and I've worked out that the closest relative is a Plantagenet. Its very confusing tracing a family history, but apparently Arthur Plantagent, who served at the court of Henry VIII had three daughters; Frances, Elizabeth and Bridget. Frances, the eldest daughter, married twice and had a son in the second marriage to a Thomas Monke, and her son was called Anthony Monke. After that, it gets very confusing but Anthony Monke had two sons, the eldest (Christopher Monke) died (I think) at a young age, and his second son (Thomas Monke) ended up living in Devon where he had more than seven children.

Now, its very confusing, but the dates in which Thomas Monke's children were born tend to be just after the Spanish Armada, so, I'm guessing that Mr. Thomas is a candidate for the throne of England. Of course, whether he's Protestant or Catholic, I cannot tell :confused:

The thing is Arthur was a bastard of Edward IV

IIRC the legitimate descent is through the Poles, descended from George, Duke of Clarence by his daughter. I can't recall the state of descent at this period, but am sure that their descendants remain alive to this day.

Cardinal Pole of course was a big name

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
The thing is Arthur was a bastard of Edward IV

IIRC the legitimate descent is through the Poles, descended from George, Duke of Clarence by his daughter. I can't recall the state of descent at this period, but am sure that their descendants remain alive to this day.

Cardinal Pole of course was a big name

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

If I'm not mistaken, the Yorkist pretender at the time of the Armada would be Henry Hastings, 3rd Earl of Huntingdon. But he was deeply Protestant and loyal to Elizabeth, so I'm not sure if he would be a viable candidate to Philip II.
 
If I'm not mistaken, the Yorkist pretender at the time of the Armada would be Henry Hastings, 3rd Earl of Huntingdon. But he was deeply Protestant and loyal to Elizabeth, so I'm not sure if he would be a viable candidate to Philip II.

Aha, true... But would he go for a bastard's descent? Maybe, considering the Trastamara were bastards...and the Habsburgs owe their claim via their marriage into them

Who was governing the Netherlands? Weren't they...um?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
Would resistance be more or less universal between the average Brit or would there be regions that rose up in favor of the Spanish? What would be the fate of these regions? Crushed by the British? Used as a core for a Spanish led British Army?
 
If I'm not mistaken, the Yorkist pretender at the time of the Armada would be Henry Hastings, 3rd Earl of Huntingdon. But he was deeply Protestant and loyal to Elizabeth, so I'm not sure if he would be a viable candidate to Philip II.
Aha, true... But would he go for a bastard's descent? Maybe, considering the Trastamara were bastards...and the Habsburgs owe their claim via their marriage into them

Who was governing the Netherlands? Weren't they...um?

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

Well, I've found these sites which are a great help in deciding what'll happen next.

http://www.suite101.com/content/possible-heirs-of-elizabeth-i--descendants-of-mary-and-eleanor-a253921

http://www.suite101.com/content/possible-heirs-of-elizabeth-i--descendants-of-mary-and-frances-a253920

http://www.suite101.com/content/possible-heirs-of-elizabeth-i--descendants-of-margaret-tudor-a253872

Go wild, boys and girls :p
 
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Fascinating idea. End result is similar to Henry VIII getting his male heir from Catalina of Aragon, Catholic England remains... just a bit more bloodshed along the way.
 
Ok, I've been working on the AAR for a bit, and I've got some new questions.

How centralised is England at this point in regards to government

How likely is James VI to assist Elizabeth if she requested it? I'm in two minds with this; firstly that Elizabeth executed his mother and so might not help because of that; or whether he would help because he doesn't want to see a Catholic back on the throne and bordering a very Protestant Scotland

He certainly wouldn't want a Spanish friendly catholic in power in England.
However, to be an active enemy of them may not be the wisest choice. It may be best for him to try and play it friendly and get on the good side of the Spanish.
It depends what sort of character he was really, I don't know much of that period of Scottish history.
 
Even if Spain were to somehow to prop up a catholic monarch of England and manage to extract some sort of financial payments from Britain, Spain's financial situation would be in dire straights. As in the book:What if, Spain would just have even more to lose in terms of power and influence if it didn't get its act together. As the saying goes- The bigger the are the harder they fall. And usually the louder and messier the fall will be the more powerful the nation is.
 
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