Space programmes in a continuing USSR

Let's say that for whatever reason the USSR never collapsed. By today, how would space programmes in both the US and the USSR look like? For the sake of argument, let's say that the Soviets still remain in a viable economic position for this.
 
I suppose if you kept the Soviet Union going till it finds all the oil and gas and put it through some PRC style reforms maybe.

It would probably want to go to the Moon etc. Though I'd imagine there could be a fair bit of co-operation with the US if the Cold War had softened and a US - China style relationship emerged. If not expect round two of the world's biggest ever pissing contest as both race for Mars.
 
Soviets had plenty of oil money in the 70's, but failed to restart the space race: the propaganda effects of merely duplicating what the US had already done would be negligible, and going to Mars would have been horrendously expensive and possibly beyond Soviet tech at that time (it's barely technically feasible nowadays; radiation, legnth of trip with no chance of resupply, the problems in landing with Mars' annoyingly too-thin-but-not-thin-enough atmosphere...).

If the Soviet Union "goes Chinese" and improves relations with the US (and it's hard to see what, except maybe Russian nationalism and brute force, is going to keep the USSR together once the ideological glue and outside threat go away), there's no need for great propaganda feats: great-power nationalism might lead to the USSR landing a man on the moon to celebrate the 80th aniversary of the Revolution, or something, but I can't see a low-key competition leading to a "race to Mars." And a cooperative effort makes little difference: the problem of motivation remains. (As a thought experiment, if the cost of a trip to Mars and back were to drop by 50% tomorrow, do you think it would happen sometime soon?)

We probably see a Soviet shuttle operating, and the Soviets controlling a bigger share of the satellite launch market: more science probes to the planets, and perhaps some cooperative efforts (we do the flyby, you drop one into the atmosphere). More near earth stuff: weather satellites, spy satellites (Soviet Google earth?), and perhaps Mir is either renovated and kicked into a higher orbit or replaced by something new: continued continual presence of Man In Space, for whatever good it does.

Now, a nastier US-USSR relationship might lead to more competition on the "High Frontier" :rolleyes: , but what is the US-Soviet dispute? There needs to be some sort of ideological dispute - we aren't in competition with the Soviets for resources (yet), they are unlikely to be buying up our national monuments or whatever, they're a continent away - but what substitutes for old-style Communism? (I can't really see North Korea in the Large Industrial Size successfully sending men to Mars).

Bruce
 
The Buran program would continue, and be used to build Mir-2 (as planned).

More interesting may be the US reaction. The only thing that saved ISS (which is Freedom plus the Mir-2 core and an FGB) was Clinton's desire to keep former Soviet engineers in Russia (and not, say, North Korea). Without this push, the US/ESA/Japan station may have fallen through early in the Clinton administration, leaving just Shuttle/Spacelab.

Couple this with a Shuttle fatality in 1997-8 (distinct possibility), and it may set the stage for a reaction like the OTL Vision for Space Exploration, only with no ISS in the way, and five years earlier. In such a case, you may end up with a lunar profile looking something like 2 Shuttle-C's (one with lander, one with Earth departure stage), followed a manned shuttle with crew and the return vehicle. With the USSR still intact, this would probably involve purposeful cooperation with the Europeans and Japanese...

Simon ;)
 
I think OTL is as "good as it gets" for both sides, from the eighties to the present. Once the cold war was over, there were no goals and no sentiment to ignite a new space race. Let us be glad the Russian Soyuz program produced capsules that could take travelers up and down without casualties.
 
on Long term the Energiya Rocket family
had to replace rokets like Proton, R-7 Soyuz, R-7 Molniya-M
with Zenit, Energiya-M and Energiya-Uragan
(a completely reusable and would be able to land on a conventional airfield.)
http://k26.com/buran/Info/Energia_HLV/energia_fly_back_booster.html

But The Buran program and Energija Rocket
died after the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Why ?

First: lot parts were build now abroad
like in Ukraine, the Boosters of Energia the Zenit rocket.

Second: the Buran project manager was one of the 1991 coup plotters
one reasion why new president Boris Yeltsin cancels Buran project

so WI the Soviet Union was still there ?

The 1991 Soviet coup world
the Cold War had gone on and Energija had launch a fleet of Polyus Combat Sats in orbit
supplied and maintained by Buran Shuttle

a reform Soviet Union or Commonwealth of Independent States
This would be a more civilian program
Mir and Mir-2 Space Station supplied and maintained by Buran Shuttle
mabye Lunar flights

this had be ironic
in 2003 USA ask the USSR for Help
and send Buran to U.S. Space station Freedom
after Space Shuttle Columbia disaster...
 
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