Shadow Master
Banned
Ok, so looking at the poll results so far, as of around 8:30 am, EDT we seem to have about three times the number of votes split fairly evenly between "Yes, commerce raiding in WWII could be effective, but you have to be able to adjust for enemy countermeasures" and "Yes, commerce raiding in WWII could be effective, but not hugely so" vs the 10 votes for, "Yes, commerce raiding in WWII could be effective, and done correctly could be a war winner". Votes for the first two options total just a 1:7 ratio against the total for the top three, and I think that these reflect thoughts that commerce raiding might be tried against foes that are not depending upon trade over the worlds oceans, or those that can make due without it, and thus voted the way they did.
Some things that I have not really considered before, but may perhaps be worth looking into, would be the use of signint(sp) work, being performed by non-combatant ships, subs, and aircraft as well as shore installations. What kind in information could be collected by a dedicated network of 'signals intelligence' platforms, what would such platforms need in terms of power, antennas, space and personel, and how could they contribute to commerce raiding efforts?
I'm also thinking here about a 'neutral nations' search aircraft that 'miss' seeing a raider in one location, thereby (mis)directing an otherwise safe convoy into believing that a location is clear when it isn't (you would want to be able to do this deniably, like for a disguised or submerged raider, rather than claiming that you totally overlooked or mis-identified a surface combatant), or claiming to see a raider in the path of a convoy (which can be either because you mistook that innocent merchantman to be a disguised merchant raider, or a sub that submerged upon being sighted) in order to both redirect an otherwise safe convoy into a path that is less so, and also to generate false-positives for the anti-raider folks to have to check out.
Another thing that I have wondered about, what if, by pre-war arrangement, you setup a system whereby you can sell your raiders to neutral nations, before you enter their waters and get interned? The Graf Spee comes to mind, as they could not legally get repairs in a neutral port, and without intel on what was waiting for them off shore, had the choice of being interned or scuttling AFAIK. This still looses you the raider, but not the code books, crew, or commanding officer, and you get a small amount of cash out of the bargin in the process. Is something like this do-able, provided that the 'sale' takes place before the ship violates the nations neutrality?
More later, but so far two folks have gone into some interesting observations of alternate submarines, and I am eagerly looking for similar ideas in the future.
Some things that I have not really considered before, but may perhaps be worth looking into, would be the use of signint(sp) work, being performed by non-combatant ships, subs, and aircraft as well as shore installations. What kind in information could be collected by a dedicated network of 'signals intelligence' platforms, what would such platforms need in terms of power, antennas, space and personel, and how could they contribute to commerce raiding efforts?
I'm also thinking here about a 'neutral nations' search aircraft that 'miss' seeing a raider in one location, thereby (mis)directing an otherwise safe convoy into believing that a location is clear when it isn't (you would want to be able to do this deniably, like for a disguised or submerged raider, rather than claiming that you totally overlooked or mis-identified a surface combatant), or claiming to see a raider in the path of a convoy (which can be either because you mistook that innocent merchantman to be a disguised merchant raider, or a sub that submerged upon being sighted) in order to both redirect an otherwise safe convoy into a path that is less so, and also to generate false-positives for the anti-raider folks to have to check out.
Another thing that I have wondered about, what if, by pre-war arrangement, you setup a system whereby you can sell your raiders to neutral nations, before you enter their waters and get interned? The Graf Spee comes to mind, as they could not legally get repairs in a neutral port, and without intel on what was waiting for them off shore, had the choice of being interned or scuttling AFAIK. This still looses you the raider, but not the code books, crew, or commanding officer, and you get a small amount of cash out of the bargin in the process. Is something like this do-able, provided that the 'sale' takes place before the ship violates the nations neutrality?
More later, but so far two folks have gone into some interesting observations of alternate submarines, and I am eagerly looking for similar ideas in the future.