Smaller Portuguese America?

[naraht]

The amount of South America allocated to Portugal in the Treaty of Tordesillas was a small fraction of what ultimately became Brazil, and even the western most estimate from the follow on Treaty of Zaragoza didn't give *that* much more.

So how do we keep Portuguese America restricted to that small portion of the continent rather than making up half of the land of South America?

 

[Rdffigueira]

Most of the land that became Brazil was actually colonized before-hand by Portuguese colonists from the littoral (mainly the Bandeirantes who sought precious metals and enslaved Indians in the hinterland). The treaties of the 18th century that "gave" territories beyond the Tordesillas line to Portugal only recognized the uti possidetis principle, by which land was given to the one who settled and worked the land.

This means that a less "hands-off" approach might suffice to reduce the size of Portuguese America, if Lisboa somehow restricts internal colonial expansion, on the grounds, for example, that more people are needed on the coast to exploit the profitable extraction of brazilwood and sugar plantations (something I find unlikely, even more as the colonists find gold in Minas Gerais, the Crown will be interested in expanding there).

On the other hand, a more aggressive Spain might prevent the Portuguese from expanding beyond Tordesillas and giving incentives for their settlers to expand beyond their colonial empire.

 

[Escape Zeppelin]

A Paraguay wank would work. Have a different Uruguayan War and Paraguayan War that Brazil loses badly. Uruguay and Argentina governments fall to pro-Paraguayan factions in the Uruguayan War. Then Paraguay moves against Brazil. Uruguay gets a chunk of southern Brazil while Paraguay secures large portions of western Brazil. It's still a huge country but not nearly as big.

 

[St. Just]

Easiest way I can think of beyond the hard task of preserving Dutch Brasil is having France succeed in colonizing Guanabara Bay and lands to the west and south thereof, thereby restricting Brasil to its original northeast area.

 

[naraht]

A Paraguay wank would work. Have a different Uruguayan War and Paraguayan War that Brazil loses badly. Uruguay and Argentina governments fall to pro-Paraguayan factions in the Uruguayan War. Then Paraguay moves against Brazil. Uruguay gets a chunk of southern Brazil while Paraguay secures large portions of western Brazil. It's still a huge country but not nearly as big.

I agree that makes Brazil smaller, but I'm looking for more of an early change so that Brazil doesn't get those areas in the first place...

 

[Guilherme Loureiro]

This means that a less "hands-off" approach might suffice to reduce the size of Portuguese America, if Lisboa somehow restricts internal colonial expansion, on the grounds, for example, that more peoplePortuguese Crown was are needed on the coast to exploit the profitable extraction of brazilwood and sugar plantations (something I find unlikely, even more as the colonists find gold in Minas Gerais, the Crown will be interested in expanding there).

Even if the Portuguese Crown had been interested in restricting expansion to the interior, I don't think they would be able to do it. Having the Spanish stop the bandeirantes would be difficult as well; the regions the bandeirantes were travelling through were far from Spanish colonial interests; even Assunción was a backwater, after better paths between Potosí and the coast were built. So the Spanish wouldn't be able to project much power there.

Perhaps the only way in stopping the bandeirantes is by having the Dutch fail, both in occupying the sugarcane-growing areas and in occupying the African slave ports; if there isn't a labour shortage caused by the Dutch, there's less incentive to go down the interior looking for natives to enslave. That doesn't stop the expansionism driven by cattle-raisers, nor the expansionism in the Amazon basin, driven by the need to safeguard the region against the French.

 

[Rdffigueira]

Easiest way I can think of beyond the hard task of preserving Dutch Brasil is having France succeed in colonizing Guanabara Bay and lands to the west and south thereof, thereby restricting Brasil to its original northeast area.

Now that we think about it, France surely had incentives to invest on a "tropical" colonial empire (considering they didn't seem to care a lot about Canada), and might be interested in preserving their dominion in Brazil against Portugal. Sometimes I think the French gave up without putting too much of a fight, considering the resources they had at their disposal in comparison to Portugal (granted, France was being torn apart by the Huguenotes at the time, so perhaps we needed an earlier PoD to have a France more focused on South America).

I guess that if France finds gold before Portugal in southwestern Brazil, they might be less inclined to abandon it in favor of their enterprise in the Antilles.

 

[St. Just]

Hell, just have someone less competent than Mem de Sa in Brasil at the time of the Portuguese expedition against the French colony. Lord knows he'd be useful in Portuguese Asia