Slightly mad idea; the Wettins trade Saxony for Silesia

[Valdemar II]

I was thinking with August II the Strong as King of Poland could we see him trade Saxony with the Habsburg for Silesia?

For the Wettins it would mean that their possessions are connected, while for the Habsburg it would ease the trade between their domains (Saxony and Bohemia are part of the same watersheed). Both possession are rich and Protestant and ruled by Catholic rulers.

I curious about the viability of the idea and of potential consequences

 

[ImperialVienna]

Hmmm an interesting idea. Would the position of Elector translate to the "Duke of Silesia" or would it remain attached to Saxony, because that could cause some what of a rumble even with the relative powerlessness of the Office of Emperor.

It would be even better if it could be coupled with Joseph II down the line (assuming he isn't butterflied away), trading the Habsburg Netherlands for Bavaria. Maybe with this as precedent he could pull Belgium-Bavaria swap off without objections from Maria Theresa, thus furthering his chances of being successful.

 

[Bee]

I wouldn't in his position because Saxony is the more valuable and Poland is Wettin only for his own lifetime. There's no guarantee that his son will be the next king.

 

[SavoyTruffle]

I wouldn't in his position because Saxony is the more valuable and Poland is Wettin only for his own lifetime. There's no guarantee that his son will be the next king.

Exactly. Saxony was Wettin for centuries, while Silesia was Habsburg for more than two centuries until Frederick II took most of it. Why would Augustus do it, unless he had ASB-levels of prediction that the region's coal production would be extremely beneficial for the economy?

And if I recall correctly the Electoral title was tied to the land title held by the electors; the Southern Netherlands-Bavaria switch Joseph II planned was based on the fact that Charles Theodore, upon his ascension to the Bavarian electorate, now held two electorates technically speaking.

 

[DrakeRlugia]

Seems rather unlikely, but not wholly impossible. Prior to it's attachment to Bohemia, Silesia was part of Poland. Many of the petty principalities (Brieg, Liegnitz, ect) were ruled by scions of the Piast dynasty. So Augustus II could certainly make a good argument that he is 're-claiming' Silesia for Poland. I suppose it could be maintained as a separate entity as part of the empire, so the Wettins could remain electors, but I'd say reattaching it to Poland would be more likely. Certainly it'd be popular amongst the ruling classes, even though Sarmatism has been entrenched for almost a century. Silesia would serve as a good base attached to Poland for royal power: certainly he could work on making the Polish throne de facto hereditary, and curb the powers of the Sejm. There's plenty of time for the Wettins to establish themselves in Poland--the Vasa ruled during the period of the nobles democracy and had no problems ensuring their heirs took the throne. It'd certainly make an interesting TL.

 

[Valdemar II]

Exactly. Saxony was Wettin for centuries, while Silesia was Habsburg for more than two centuries until Frederick II took most of it. Why would Augustus do it, unless he had ASB-levels of prediction that the region's coal production would be extremely beneficial for the economy?

Silesia was richest (or at least the part which paid the most in tax) part of the Bohemian crown, which was why the loss for the Habsburg was so devasting.

 

[Valdemar II]

Hmmm an interesting idea. Would the position of Elector translate to the "Duke of Silesia" or would it remain attached to Saxony, because that could cause some what of a rumble even with the relative powerlessness of the Office of Emperor.

Duke of Silesia

It would be even better if it could be coupled with Joseph II down the line (assuming he isn't butterflied away), trading the Habsburg Netherlands for Bavaria. Maybe with this as precedent he could pull Belgium-Bavaria swap off without objections from Maria Theresa, thus furthering his chances of being successful.

If the Habsburg keep Saxony from the Hohenzollern, I don't think any German prince would be strong enough to keep them from making that trade.

 

[Valdemar II]

Seems rather unlikely, but not wholly impossible. Prior to it's attachment to Bohemia, Silesia was part of Poland. Many of the petty principalities (Brieg, Liegnitz, ect) were ruled by scions of the Piast dynasty. So Augustus II could certainly make a good argument that he is 're-claiming' Silesia for Poland. I suppose it could be maintained as a separate entity as part of the empire, so the Wettins could remain electors, but I'd say reattaching it to Poland would be more likely. Certainly it'd be popular amongst the ruling classes, even though Sarmatism has been entrenched for almost a century. Silesia would serve as a good base attached to Poland for royal power: certainly he could work on making the Polish throne de facto hereditary, and curb the powers of the Sejm. There's plenty of time for the Wettins to establish themselves in Poland--the Vasa ruled during the period of the nobles democracy and had no problems ensuring their heirs took the throne. It'd certainly make an interesting TL.

More or less what I thought, Silesia was a medium sized state in it own right and rich, it would give the Wettins a strong base for establish a solid grib on the Polish crown.

 

[Falastur]

More or less what I thought, Silesia was a medium sized state in it own right and rich, it would give the Wettins a strong base for establish a solid grib on the Polish crown.

Except that if the Sejm thinks that the new Silesian Dukes are establishing themselves to get a good grip on the Polish crown, they will more likely than not elect a different person to the Kingdom at the next election, to prevent the King from threatening their own power.

 

[ImperialVienna]

The Silesian Dukes could probably get an agreement out of the Habsburgs to continue to support their position on the Polish Throne, with force if need. I mean the Habsburgs did it anyway IOTL.