Why bother? The Matilda's still useful as is, and is needed in the Far East so the break in production to change to the Vickers tank would be an issue.
Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
- Start date
I recall a story about the first Gurkha paratroopers. The officers who wanted them to volunteer were sent a film on paratroopers and without previewing it, showed it to the Gurkhas. Only then did they discover that the film was about defeating a landing by paratroopers.
All the Gurkhas volunteered for paratrooper training. Not understanding English, they had seen that being a paratrooper meant that you got dropped into a huge fight, and it seemed like a good idea to them.
Better to die than to be a coward
Ayo Gurkhali!
In the '80s there were some scots posted as part of the hong kong garrison.
I remember talking with some other members of the garrison, who were home on leave.
They said that the scots had a reputation of fighting with just about anyone, for recreation, including the hong kong police.
On being asked by one of the police why they didnt fight with the gurkhas, the reply was "were not fighting them, they're mad bastards, they are."
25 January 1942. Port Said. Egypt.
allanpcameron
Donor
25 January 1942. Port Said. Egypt.
The ships of the convoy Winston Special 14A had dispersed off Aden a few days earlier. Now the troops were being disembarked and heading for the camps where they would regain their fitness and be prepared for life in North Africa and the Middle East.
The ships that carried supplies were being tied up alongside and the well-rehearsed process of unloading was getting into full swing. The Quartermaster General’s staff were trying to bring some kind of order out of the chaos along the wharfs, ships’ manifests were being scoured and guards being assigned to things of value.
A whole group of men from the Royal Armoured Corps’ depots were on hand to oversee the hundreds of tanks that had been delivered. As usual, despite the best efforts of the tank factory and the dockers at Liverpool, there would be some remedial work needed to get them ready for operations. Since the tanks were all from Vickers the work wouldn’t be as bad as it may have been.
There were always a few Vickers’ employees on hand to supervise the loading at Liverpool. This was an aspect of Vickers’ commitment to their customers. A team from Vickers were also on hand in Egypt to pick up from the army comments and ideas for bettering the design of the tanks. Some new members of the team had arrived in the convoy and some of those who had been in Egypt for over a year would sail home on the ships.
One of the questions that had been raised as tank manufacturing had expanded over the last few years was about quality control. In the initial rush to get more companies involved, many of which had never been involved before in building tanks, and even more companies who were building components for the tanks, just getting them started had been the priority. The result had been that the Royal Armoured Corps, the Royal Army Ordinance Corps and the Royal Army Service Corps had had to spend too much time repairing tanks that shouldn’t have left the factory until they had been properly examined and tested. The dearth of spare parts had made this worse, with otherwise good tanks being stripped to keep others going.
Spread throughout the ships that had carried the tanks across the ocean were boxes of spare parts, tracks and extra tools. While there weren’t quite enough spare engines for every tank, the ships carried enough to provide a spare for every second or third tank. The men responsible for taking the tanks off the ships, preparing them for life in the Middle East, and then providing them to the Armoured Division, looked at the manifests with enormous relief.
After the fighting that had ended the Italian and German efforts in North Africa, the depots had managed to put together a battalion of working tanks to send along with 9th (Highland) Division to the Far East. Then they had worked through the tanks used by the 2nd and 7th Armoured Divisions. Many of those that had been knocked out, and more that had just broken down, had been stripped to keep the rest running. Most of the tanks had reached the 1000-mile mark, which was just about all that a tank could take before it needed a major overhaul. Just keeping 2nd and 7th Armoured Division up to strength, or as near as possible, had cleaned out much of the depots’ stocks of spares. The new tanks and all the spares would finally mean that the depots might just be able to keep ahead of demand.
8th Armoured Division’s tanks had all been fully prepared before being shipped out. The Divisional Adjutant had threatened severe repercussions on anyone responsible for a tank needing anything more than minimal remedial work on arrival in Egypt. As the tanks and other vehicles were unloaded, this threat seemed to have done its job.
Major-General McCreery was currently meeting with Wavell and O’Connor about how best to use this fresh Division. The decision to bring the Division to Egypt, rather than send them to Rangoon or Singapore, had been a matter of great debate. Lieutenant General Bill Slim had declined the offer of a full Armoured Division as he didn’t believe it could properly be maintained in the field due to Burma’s woeful infrastructure. Lieutenant General Percival had given it greater consideration, but London was still looking at the German thrust into Russia with concern.
Once the weather was right, then Wavell’s plan to secure more islands in the Mediterranean would get underway. The 7th Australian Division were now adept at amphibious warfare, and elements of 2nd Armoured Division would be involved. The situation with Vichy, especially in Algeria and Syria was still on a knife-edge, and if that came to blows, Wavell wanted at least one solid Corps ready to take them on. 10th Armoured Division were sitting in Persia, and it seemed that General Jumbo Wilson’s command was beginning to look like an army than a collection of units in the same area. Wavell wanted McCreery’s Division in Palestine, ready to move into Syria if it came to that, or ready to back up Wilson in Persia if the Russians collapsed.
The ships of the convoy Winston Special 14A had dispersed off Aden a few days earlier. Now the troops were being disembarked and heading for the camps where they would regain their fitness and be prepared for life in North Africa and the Middle East.
The ships that carried supplies were being tied up alongside and the well-rehearsed process of unloading was getting into full swing. The Quartermaster General’s staff were trying to bring some kind of order out of the chaos along the wharfs, ships’ manifests were being scoured and guards being assigned to things of value.
A whole group of men from the Royal Armoured Corps’ depots were on hand to oversee the hundreds of tanks that had been delivered. As usual, despite the best efforts of the tank factory and the dockers at Liverpool, there would be some remedial work needed to get them ready for operations. Since the tanks were all from Vickers the work wouldn’t be as bad as it may have been.
There were always a few Vickers’ employees on hand to supervise the loading at Liverpool. This was an aspect of Vickers’ commitment to their customers. A team from Vickers were also on hand in Egypt to pick up from the army comments and ideas for bettering the design of the tanks. Some new members of the team had arrived in the convoy and some of those who had been in Egypt for over a year would sail home on the ships.
One of the questions that had been raised as tank manufacturing had expanded over the last few years was about quality control. In the initial rush to get more companies involved, many of which had never been involved before in building tanks, and even more companies who were building components for the tanks, just getting them started had been the priority. The result had been that the Royal Armoured Corps, the Royal Army Ordinance Corps and the Royal Army Service Corps had had to spend too much time repairing tanks that shouldn’t have left the factory until they had been properly examined and tested. The dearth of spare parts had made this worse, with otherwise good tanks being stripped to keep others going.
Spread throughout the ships that had carried the tanks across the ocean were boxes of spare parts, tracks and extra tools. While there weren’t quite enough spare engines for every tank, the ships carried enough to provide a spare for every second or third tank. The men responsible for taking the tanks off the ships, preparing them for life in the Middle East, and then providing them to the Armoured Division, looked at the manifests with enormous relief.
After the fighting that had ended the Italian and German efforts in North Africa, the depots had managed to put together a battalion of working tanks to send along with 9th (Highland) Division to the Far East. Then they had worked through the tanks used by the 2nd and 7th Armoured Divisions. Many of those that had been knocked out, and more that had just broken down, had been stripped to keep the rest running. Most of the tanks had reached the 1000-mile mark, which was just about all that a tank could take before it needed a major overhaul. Just keeping 2nd and 7th Armoured Division up to strength, or as near as possible, had cleaned out much of the depots’ stocks of spares. The new tanks and all the spares would finally mean that the depots might just be able to keep ahead of demand.
8th Armoured Division’s tanks had all been fully prepared before being shipped out. The Divisional Adjutant had threatened severe repercussions on anyone responsible for a tank needing anything more than minimal remedial work on arrival in Egypt. As the tanks and other vehicles were unloaded, this threat seemed to have done its job.
Major-General McCreery was currently meeting with Wavell and O’Connor about how best to use this fresh Division. The decision to bring the Division to Egypt, rather than send them to Rangoon or Singapore, had been a matter of great debate. Lieutenant General Bill Slim had declined the offer of a full Armoured Division as he didn’t believe it could properly be maintained in the field due to Burma’s woeful infrastructure. Lieutenant General Percival had given it greater consideration, but London was still looking at the German thrust into Russia with concern.
Once the weather was right, then Wavell’s plan to secure more islands in the Mediterranean would get underway. The 7th Australian Division were now adept at amphibious warfare, and elements of 2nd Armoured Division would be involved. The situation with Vichy, especially in Algeria and Syria was still on a knife-edge, and if that came to blows, Wavell wanted at least one solid Corps ready to take them on. 10th Armoured Division were sitting in Persia, and it seemed that General Jumbo Wilson’s command was beginning to look like an army than a collection of units in the same area. Wavell wanted McCreery’s Division in Palestine, ready to move into Syria if it came to that, or ready to back up Wilson in Persia if the Russians collapsed.
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I recall reading about Scots and Gurkhas teaming up in the old Afghan War (1870s) and being functionally unstoppable in urban warfare. The Scots, some of the largest/strongest fighters in the British force, would break open a building enough for the Gurkhas, the smallest/strongest fighters, to get inside. By the time the Scots had widened the hole enough to follow them in, the Gurkhas had already cleared the building and were ready for the next breech.
Rinse, repeat.
By the end of the war, the combined Scots/Gurkhas teams could terrify the Afghans into surrender or flight just by making their presence known (although that's how most people respond to bagpipes).
There's also the joke, which I'm sure has been repeated on this forum, of 'A Scot and a Gurkha walk into a bar. Ten minutes later they leave the bar, having had a lovely time, and inform the MPs that the Germans are ready to surrender now that their officers have all been knocked out in their own officers' club.'
Like a wartime version of Asterix & Obelix.
So an update focusing on the logistics and planning of the war. The High Command is now currently planning on the takeover of some island on the Mediterranean as a hopping off point to Continental Europe, unlike IOTL when there currently still only halfway through Libya. Meanwhile, there is some consideration that for a division being sent to the Far East, which is rejected since the infrastructure is not adequate enough. (Altough if the North Africa is ITTL, but the situation on the Far East is IOTL, perhaps the division would be sent East anyway in a moment of panic due to the rapid losses occur by this point?) I wonder if ITTL plans of an potential invasion of French North Africa is feasible without the need of Americans thanks to due the reduced losses (and potential gains) to the Commonwealth army?
All in all, a great and interesting update that made me read to the end (especially for me who is currently mostly here for the military battles at Malaya,which I am addicted to a point of concern TBH,) so I would be actually interested to see more of these logistical updates, perhaps the impact ITTL in regards to the rubber industry perhaps, since the fact that the rubber plantations in the Far East is still technically available would have a very high impact on multiple countries.
All in all, a great and interesting update that made me read to the end (especially for me who is currently mostly here for the military battles at Malaya,which I am addicted to a point of concern TBH,) so I would be actually interested to see more of these logistical updates, perhaps the impact ITTL in regards to the rubber industry perhaps, since the fact that the rubber plantations in the Far East is still technically available would have a very high impact on multiple countries.
Currents, waves coming in off the Atlantic, tidal ranges and other conditions in the Channel are different from the Mediterranean quite often. Someone should want to try to raid somewhere on the coast of Northwest Europe at some point, if for no reason other than to sea how the landing craft handle in the Channel. On what scale, with what preparation, and whether somewhere like the beachfront of a fortified port is another question altogether, maybe.
Dieppe probably will happen anyway, simply to try and capture the Enigma machines and codebooks.
Problem is other than raids the British and commonwealth forces don't have the resources or ability current to do more than port raids in Europe they are in an infinitely better situation than OTL with drain on resources from North Africa gone.
So more and better kit can go east compared to OTL. Battle of Atlantic will still be the same but the Med right now is effectively a British lake in major parts of it which simplifies things immensely especially if and when the French territories switch sides in the Levant, Syria and North Africa.
Heck other than the exigencies of the War I have to wonder with all the Victories if some will be badgering to restart commercial production in some small areas.
So more and better kit can go east compared to OTL. Battle of Atlantic will still be the same but the Med right now is effectively a British lake in major parts of it which simplifies things immensely especially if and when the French territories switch sides in the Levant, Syria and North Africa.
Heck other than the exigencies of the War I have to wonder with all the Victories if some will be badgering to restart commercial production in some small areas.
Early ending in NA is also a plus for the Axis. How many more troops, vehicles and planes can be added to case blue. How many more trucks and resources can now support it. Will there still be weak wings supporting the 6th army or will they have the force need to protect them from the counterattack.