Signs of Western Defeat in Cold War?

If the fall of the Soviet Union in OTL can be predicted by these events:
• Soviet loss in Afghanistan War
• Fall of the Berlin Wall
• Chernobyl disaster
• Gorbachev

What events in ATL can be viewed as signs of the coming fall of Wsetern powers (mainly the USA)?

Thanks in advance!
 
If the fall of the Soviet Union in OTL can be predicted by these events:
• Soviet loss in Afghanistan War
• Fall of the Berlin Wall
• Chernobyl disaster
• Gorbachev

What events in ATL can be viewed as signs of the coming fall of Wsetern powers (mainly the USA)?

Thanks in advance!

Fall? As in the same kind of fall that happened to the Evil Empire?
Not happening.
Yes, the West will have to yield more of the field to China in the coming decades, but it'll take ASBs to make that kind of an "occident-screw" that you're proposing.
 
Vietnam War :D

Cuba Crisis - Russians keep the missiles on Cuba

Ronald Reagan - an actor as president

Iran crisis - a superpower can't protect its own embassys

Israel falls in 1967
 
Vietnam
Widespread Eurocommunism (Italy) and anti nuclear movement (Germany, Great Britain) leading to withdrawal from nuclear NATO by left leaning governments
Apollo 13 and Skylab are total failures, Skylab lands in populated area. Three Mile Island is significantly worse
Carter gets reelected
 
And all that leads to is a loss of prestige, whereas the Soviets were faced with something of an economic collapse weren't they?
 
  • The west never recovers from the Oil Shock and suffers economic stagnation into the 80s and 90s.
  • Technology from Western Europe flows into the Soviet Union in exchange for desperately needed oil and raw materials.
  • Somehow, somewhere a successful Deng-like reform process begins in the Soviet Union, permanently solving its food shortages and launching a sizable consumer sector.
  • A series of US Presidents unleash hair-brained economic policies, including protectionism, currency regulations (this cripples the global financial system), and dwells on silly domestic social issues.
  • In Southeast Asia, Vietnam had pacified Laos and Cambodia and next turns its sights on Thailand and Malaysia.
  • Zia ul-Haq dies earlier than OTL and in similarly violent circumstances, plunging Pakistan into civil war. The Soviets obtain a port on the Indian Ocean after pacifying Afghanistan.
 
Personally I think that in no circumstances can the Soviet Union defeat the USA similarly post-1945 as it was itself defeated (balkanized and its political system mostly changed). Thus the Soviet victory in the Cold War would be more like the West losing its prestige and the USA withdrawing from most of Eurasia thus leaving the Soviet Union in the dominant position on the continent. These are some things which came to my mind:
  • the collapse of NATO following rise of left-wing/pacifist governments in Europe
  • a long depression and economic stagnation in the West and social upwheal they have caused
  • disastrous foreign adventure by the USA to stop spread of Communism
  • Soviets landing on the moon (preferably first but I think a more important thing is just to show that they can do it)
  • South American countries either starting to do more independent foreign policy or becoming Soviet aligned without the US being able to stop it
 
The debt crisis
Political polarization, especially in the us.
Which prevents the first from being dealt with.

The flight from science and logic to soundbites and dogma.

The loss of manufacturing capacity in the ,,west,,

Enviromental collapse. Global warming.


Im not saying these are indicators of a collapse of the west, but if it does collapse, they will be pointed to as such.

Otoh, people having been pointing fingers and predicting collapses for half a century now and weve managed to stumble through all the crises more or less successfully, so far.
 
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