Ship formation in slightly larger Force Z

@Fatboy Coxy a formation for Force Z would be two lines of ships with destroyers leading. In real time, the only two modern cruisers available were heavy cruiser HMS Exeter and HMS Mauritius. HMS Exeter was covering a convoy to Singapore but could have arrived by December 6, while HMS Mauritius was in Singapore getting repairs on her engine. Other cruisers were available but in order to be with Force Z, they had to be in good shape. HMS Glasgow was in the Bay of Bengals but she had her after turrets X and Y out of service due to damages she had in the Mediterranean. HMS Danae and HMS Durban were in Singapore but had poor anti-aircraft protection and were no use for Admiral Phillip. HMS Dragon was patrolling off the Adamans Islands and was in the same case as her two other sisters.
Now destroyers were available but some were in repairs. HMS Encounter, HMS Jupiter, HMS Iris were in repairs in Singapore, which could have join Force Z. Another three destroyers under repair were HMS Ilex in Durban and HMS Nubian in Bombay and HMS Kelly (I think) also in Bombay. Now having this six destroyers ready with Force Z and the three modern cruisers, Force Z would be a battle fleet. Also add the 4 American destroyers and USS Marblehead and then you got yourself a scout and battle fleet.

The USS Marblehead and the four overage Destroyers were of no use, other than to offer more targets toshootat for the Japanese. Marblehead and the DD's lacked AA seriously at the time. (Only a number of 3 inch guns on them and Marblehead had perhaps a pair of useless .50 cal MG's at best, as she still had not been refitted, due to her absense in Asia. Short range AA was missing as a whole in these ships.) Torpedoes also were problematic, as all USN torpedoes were at the time, though not yet experienced to be so bad. Much better was the inclussion of the Dutch naval forces,a s these at east had the very useful 40mm bofors guns on their cruisers, which were unmatched in AA capabilities at medium to short range. Also the Ducth had seven relatively modern DD's in the region, which were generally of more value than the USN ones.

Still the force Z would be outmatched severely, as the general threat would still be airpower, against which the added ships and AA could not make much difference, as long as the ony real protection in the form of (capable) fighter aircraft was missing. A squadron of Spitfires would have been nice here, but these were not available outside the European front.
 
Still the force Z would be outmatched severely, as the general threat would still be airpower, against which the added ships and AA could not make much difference, as long as the ony real protection in the form of (capable) fighter aircraft was missing.
Any reasonably modern fighters would have allowed Force Z to survive on December 10, the Japanese bombers had no fighter escort. How long it could have survived after that in the South China Sea without a carrier in support is debatable.
 
Any reasonably modern fighters would have allowed Force Z to survive on December 10, the Japanese bombers had no fighter escort.

IIRC the bombers had no fighter escort because they knew Force Z had no fighter escort, and that Zeroes were on call if there had been a fighter escort of Force Z.
 
I've posted this in other threads but what Force Z needed was this. The work could have been done in Ceylon or Australia.

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Any reasonably modern fighters would have allowed Force Z to survive on December 10, the Japanese bombers had no fighter escort. How long it could have survived after that in the South China Sea without a carrier in support is debatable.

That would depend on how much time these CAP fighters were able to stay over the taskforce. Most allied aircraft of that period in history were rather short legged and could not do much more than remain for s short time over the target, unless it was over their own airfield, or mothership. Even the pictured HMS Hermess was a liability, as she only had a seriously modest airgroup of around a dozen aircraft at best, part of which were torpedoplanes. The sheer number of attacking airplanes the Japanese could bring in would overmatch it. (At the time HMS Hermes was equipped with half a dozen Sea Gladiator biplane fighters and short of a dozen Swordfishes. That is not that much of an impact, when facing around a total of 88 attackers of the Genzan, Mihoro and Kanoya airgroups)
 
IIRC the bombers had no fighter escort because they knew Force Z had no fighter escort, and that Zeroes were on call if there had been a fighter escort of Force Z.
How could they really know if land based fighters who be trying to fly CAP (as they did to late on)? Was it not more that the IJN did not have sufficient Zeros to escort and provide CAP over the landing ships at such a range from its own base?
 
How could they really know if land based fighters who be trying to fly CAP (as they did to late on)? Was it not more that the IJN did not have sufficient Zeros to escort and provide CAP over the landing ships at such a range from its own base?

The A6M's were not deployed over the landingbeaches, as that was the job of the IJA, which also was stationed there and had aircraft in reach of the landingzones. The A6M fighters, totalling just 18 in all, as the other half of the Genzan Airgroup was still stationed in Formosa, covering operations over the Philippines. The Kanoya and Mihoro groups seemed to lack the A6M type in their inventory still, being equipped with the older A5M, which was training in Japan at the time. The A6M types present in Indo-China were not yet equipped with the external fueltanks, so had a reduced range, making it unable for them to reach all the way to Singapore and back. (The IJN Airgroups lacked more equipment in Indo China, such as the heavy 800kg AP bombs, as all were taken by Nagumo's carriers for the Pear Harbor Raid. The G3M and G4M bombers had to do with the smaller GP bombs of 500kg and 250kg, besides two types fo airdropped torpedoes: Type-91, mod 1 and mod 2, with warheads of 150kg and 205kg resp.)
 
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