is this plausible?Instead of the title of custodian of the two holy cities, the saudi kings decided to declare themselves as the successor to the Ottoman or Abbasid Caliphate after 1922 and the conquest of Hijaz?
idk but the alids held the title of sharif of mecca. They never claimed the khilafat. Ru saying they had pretentions of doing so?Wasn't attempting to play Caliph part of why the Hashemites got booted out of Hijaz?
idk but the alids held the title of sharif of mecca. They never claimed the khilafat. Ru saying they had pretentions of doing so?
Yes, but it was the Saudis themselves who booted them out. Once the Hashemites and Rashidis are out of the way there is nobody left to stop the Saudis.Wasn't attempting to play Caliph part of why the Hashemites got booted out of Hijaz?
"[The] declaration issued by the Islamic State is void under sharia […]", adding that the title of caliph can "only be given by the entire Muslim nation",
It's still possible to get a hereditary Caliphate, as the Umayyads and Abbasids showed, but it does have to start by taking it by force, as you said. The Umayyads cleaned up after Caliph Ali's assassination, and the Abbasids just took power after a rebellion and proceeded to slaughter the Umayyads. Having a Saudi Caliphate exist because they have Britain's backing would not be a very strong set of credentials.If they declare themselves a caliphate, they're going to be under a lot of pressure. Under the Sunni interpretation of a caliphate, a caliph may come to power in one of four ways: either through an election, through nomination, through a selection by a committee, or by force. Note how 'hereditary monarch' doesn't get mentioned anywhere in that list,
I'm no theologician, but I think there are references to shura, basically that Muslims come together and discuss their affairs and their problems. And the Rashidun Caliphates were elected, but that follows the Prophet's precedent of electing Abu Bakr as his successor in leading the Muslims.so if the Saudis want to establish a true Islamic caliphate, then they must reform their government so that rather than being selected through bloodline, the caliph is selected through either one of the first three ways. Ibn Saud would technically be a legitimate caliph, since he came to power through force, but his sons have to be elected or nominated for the possession of Caliph.
Since they're Wahhabis, though, I doubt they're going to be open to having any form of democracy in their government, so this Caliphate's claim would ring hollow. Since they follow the Hanbali school of Sunni Islam, Wahhabis reject any law that does not come from the Qur'an and I doubt there are elections in the Qur'an. (Correct me if I'm wrong).
This is basically the biggest issue with being Caliph; all eyes are on you since you and your own are supposed to be a good example. While that hasn't always been followed, it's clear the Saud family aren't exactly the best candidates for the job.I wouldn't be surprised if this statement is made by Muslims all over the Middle East about the Saudi caliphate. The Wahhabis are a group of Muslims. They are not a nation, so under sharia, they have no rights to the title of caliphate.
Also, this is before oil is discovered in Saudi Arabia, so this 'Caliphate' would be 100% dependent on Britain, which presents a bad image to the Muslims that the caliphate and Ibn Saud, proclaiming himself to be 'Successor to God's Prophet', are Western puppets, besmirching the name of the Caliphate for their own religious and political agendas. The Ottoman Empire, on the other hand, was largely self-sufficient until it began decaying in the 18th Century, when it became more and more reliant on the European powers.
Also, if Ibn Saud declares himself or his sons caliph of this new caliphate, then he's opened up a way for his bloodline to be removed from power. As a caliph, Ibn Saud is required to hold to each dictate of the sunnah, whose precedence is set and recorded in the sahih hadiths. According to tradition, if a caliph fails to meet any of these obligations at any period, he is legally required to abdicate his position and the community has to appoint a new caliph, theoretically selected from throughout the caliphdom as being the most religiously and spiritually pious individual among them.
So, if he fails to uphold anything in the sunnah and the hadiths, he can be legally removed from power by a rival, which would make the Caliphate unstable politically and religiously. It's going to be a den of corruption and political turmoil, which again, would make the Caliphate look unstable and illegitimate.
I'm no theologician, but I think there are references to shura, basically that Muslims come together and discuss their affairs and their problems
From what I understand the shura bodies in current Saudi Arabia are either from the ruling family, or from clans aligned to said ruling family, assigned by the King and his associates. There are no elections in Saudi Arabia, and even at the municipal level you have appointed emirs (who are of the Royal Family) rather than mayors or other elected officials.You're right, the Qu'ran does make references to shura and apparently, OTL's Saudi Arabia does have a shura-like body called the Consultative Body, but it has little to no power, aside from proposing laws. The King has all of the executive authority. I expect this to be the exact same in this Wahhabi caliphate, just replace the King with the Caliph.
From what I understand the shura bodies in current Saudi Arabia are either from the ruling family, or from clans aligned to said ruling family, assigned by the King and his associates. There are no elections in Saudi Arabia, and even at the municipal level you have appointed emirs (who are of the Royal Family) rather than mayors or other elected officials.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharifian_Caliphate
The last recognised caliph wS the Ottoman Caliph. Very few people recognised the Sharifian Caliphate.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharifian_Caliphate
Oh this. I thought the last Caliphate was the Ottoman Caliphate, with final caliph being Abdul-mejid II. I know very little about this, wikipedia had a very contradictory approach to this.
So by this definition, the last sunni caliphate was the caliphate of yogyakarta, which was abolished in 2015.The last recognised caliph wS the Ottoman Caliph. Very few people recognised the Sharifian Caliphate.
Spellcheck is your friendidk but the alids held the title of sharif of mecca. They never claimed the khilafat. Ru saying they had pretentions of doing so?
My bad, sorry. I need to be careful when I type sometimes. I don't want to get in trouble.Spellcheck is your friend