Russian forces kill Georgian President

boredatwork

Banned
Would the Americans wake up and get angry then? Or piss their pants?

Why in heaven's name would the US get worried? MAD hasn't disappeared, and Putin isn't going to all this trouble to reclaim dribs and drabs of the soviet empire just to commit national suicide.

Europe however is going to have some interesting times once the bear is done digesting it's latest snack. Putin might have some things to say about who is going to be the super power in those parts, and Europe is not nearly as well positioned to do anything about it as folks seem to have convinced themselves.

Then again, given the Russian experience in Chechnya - I'm unclear on why anyone thinks long term involvement in Georgia is going to go any easier.
 
Europe however is going to have some interesting times once the bear is done digesting it's latest snack. Putin might have some things to say about who is going to be the super power in those parts, and Europe is not nearly as well positioned to do anything about it as folks seem to have convinced themselves.

If Europe starts to feel threatened and the US is distracted with domestic issues and China then this might be just the thing to give the EU's collective security projects a kick in the pants.

European battlegroups in the Baltics, big show of defensive solidarity, general increases in defence funding coupled with reducing soft energy money flowing to Russia. All long term, but the eastern end of the EU will be getting twitchy so they'll push for it, which will all speed up the process :D
 

boredatwork

Banned
That would be beautiful, and would probably work.

If the folks in western Europe hadn't just finished making clear that they consider nations in the former soviet sphere of influence to be, at best, an ablative armor for the 'true' (western) Europe - aka the parts of Europe that 'matter'.

Hands up, everyone who actually thinks Germany, France, Italy, or Spain would go to war with Putin's Russia to protect Poland, frex, as per Nato Article 5 commitments.

...

anyone?

...

Yeah, I'm sorry to say it, but I don't think so either.
 
Maybe they would. The Germans and the other Eastern European nations minus Belarus and Serbia might. They remember life under the Russian heel
 
That`s why Poland and Czech republic are supporting missile shield - because only US matters in NATO, and is better ally than militarily weak WE countries, that are addicted to Russian resources.
 

Markus

Banned
Hands up, everyone who actually thinks Germany, France, Italy, or Spain would go to war with Putin's Russia to protect Poland, frex, as per Nato Article 5 commitments.

Funny you mentioned Italy. Italy has the same total GDP as Russia. Per capita Italy is ahead by a factor of 2 to 3. Russian threat my a... :D
 

boredatwork

Banned
Italy can have GDP coming out the wazzoo. Doesn't matter for two twigs if Italy doesn't have the men under arms, the material, and the will to use them.

How is Italy going to translate it's GDP into armed forces in Poland fighting off a Russian assault? - that's the could part.

Next, what evidence do we have that the Italian government would actually take such a step, rather than, oh, I don't know, blaming the Poles for inciting the Russians, while quietly celebrating the fact that Warsaw will no longer be blocking the latest subsidy scheme? - that's the would part.

I'm just not convinced on either end. Sure, the other former eastern block countries would try to help, because they're all in the same boat.
 
What's for our FSB do that? One thing-in Georgia the most part of politicians are anti-russian now--so it is better to have mentall sick man, who love to eat its own tie as enemy.
 
What's for our FSB do that? One thing-in Georgia the most part of politicians are anti-russian now--so it is better to have mentall sick man, who love to eat its own tie as enemy.

Indeed, during the current crisis, Saakashvili has been very useful to Russia. He is a rash, impulsive politician and the perfect candidate to walk straight in to the trap the Russian leadership expertly set for Georgia. In putinist propaganda, he used to be called a fool and a US puppet, but (like our friend Tuhachevskey points out) since the war preparations were started, he has been increasingly painted as a dangerous lunatic. This way he can be presented to the Russian public not as a source for ridicule but as a real enemy, whose actions should indeed be curbed by some well-timed peacekeeping. So no need for the FSB to kill the man.

Besides, if Russia wanted to kill him, it would not be through bombing or straight-out assasination, but through an anonymous, seemingly mindless act of violence (like Politkovskaya) or through a mysterious illness (like Litvinenko, Yushchenko).
 
seemingly mindless act of violence (like Politkovskaya) or through a mysterious illness (like Litvinenko, Yushchenko
First-do you know exactly, that it was FSB?
Second- gergian president has it ow security.....
 
Why even debate with these people, ie Tuhachevskey? If anything is clear it is the rights and wrongs of the Georgian aggression. It's like talking about Danzig with a German in 1939.

Sorry mate :(
 

Markus

Banned
Italy can have GDP coming out the wazzoo. Doesn't matter for two twigs if Italy doesn't have the men under arms, the material, and the will to use them.

You did not get it. If a medium sized country like Italy has the same economic strenght as "USA-size" Russia, that means actual russian strenght is smaller than it appears. They can defeat really small and weak nations like Georgia, but hardly larger ones like the Ukraine. And certainly not a coalition of several medium sized nations. This isn´t the USSR any more.
 
german(not russian) doctors said-he is ill man.
And the news source was...? The German doctor's position on the matter was? Propoganda, like any advertising, doesn't mean that it only comes from the source that benefits. Hence why advertisements have the "clinical studies" that support their product, or the "satisfied customer," or the "dissatisfied customer of the opposing brand" angles. Does the fact that these people aren't the producer mean that the advertising is any less biased and intended to form viewer oppinion?
 
And the news source was...? The German doctor's position on the matter was? Propoganda, like any advertising, doesn't mean that it only comes from the source that benefits. Hence why advertisements have the "clinical studies" that support their product, or the "satisfied customer," or the "dissatisfied customer of the opposing brand" angles. Does the fact that these people aren't the producer mean that the advertising is any less biased and intended to form viewer oppinion?

Like that "american guy" who appeared on FSB controlled channel Russia Today.
It has been proved the he was infact a KGB agent!
 
When does it happen? During the war? After the color revolution? Just after independence? During George Bushs visit? Or even president Shevanaze (spelling?)?

How does it happen? The lone gunman? A spetnaz raid on the capital? Some strange illness? A bomb? The armoured column toward Tiblisi keeps going?
 
Like that "american guy" who appeared on FSB controlled channel Russia Today.
It has been proved the he was infact a KGB agent!
it is your IMHO. Killing of Georgian President...Hmmm CIE can do it. it is usefull for McCain, for example.
Politkovskaya
her dead is usefukk for one men^ Beresovski... And she was (сensored), so she can be kiдled by:
1) kaddirov's men
2) veterain of Chechen war.
Litvinenko
His dead is good for Beresovski and Jamadaev-they could be given to russian...
Yushchenko
His illnes is good for him only^ he can say, that he is 'victim of russia"
 
it is your IMHO. Killing of Georgian President...Hmmm CIE can do it. it is usefull for McCain, for example.
I assume you mean the CIA, the Central Intelligence Agency. But while President Bush has many faults, assassinating foreign heads of states hasn't been one of them. That was more of a Kennedy/Cold War tradition.
 
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