Ride the Wave Hapsburg!- A Spring of nations Timeline

Yeah I'm going to go on hiatus for a bit to get all this straightened out!

and to deal with the demons of my inner demons of America wanking

But thanks dude!

Blame that Eurofed/General Zod Evil Influence... I'm too strong to be 'Infulence' by him(if he a Sith... I'm Jedi) but with the POD..

USA WILL HAVE LESS POPULATION(More Important. White Population). because a lot of Germans, Italians, Magyars and Some Slavs have not the reason to Emigrate to 'the land of Freedom' unlike OTL(Their home nations are more stable Consitutional Monarchies who gonna hit the Industrial and Colonial Revolutions), that gonna cause a lot of Butterflies late(more Irish and maybe Slavs in USA) and be problematic...

But Unless a European Power Intervent... the ceteris paribus in USA is the same(the same here in Latin America), but without Maximilian... maybe the French colonial adventure will be more south?

that are a lot fo Butterflies that can be problematic.

Att
Nivek von Beldo

P.S. And they will not have the 'Statue of Liberty' too, very in the future of the POD
 

Eurofed

Banned
And in Milan still chaos reing.. well, when the Major Unification will be(a detail who the Imperial vienna miss. Señor Maximiliano(Lord Maximilian) is Steril.. in fact he can't have childern.. in OTL their childer were adopted... and that will be a problem in Italy.. unless the Crown will be give to the Hasburg-Tuscana at his dead)

Yeah, at his death the crown shall have to pass either to the Habsburg-Tuscany, or to one of his nephews.

USA WILL HAVE LESS POPULATION(More Important. White Population). because a lot of Germans, Italians, Magyars and Some Slavs have not the reason to Emigrate to 'the land of Freedom' unlike OTL(Their home nations are more stable Consitutional Monarchies who gonna hit the Industrial and Colonial Revolutions), that gonna cause a lot of Butterflies late(more Irish and maybe Slavs in USA) and be problematic...

Less Germans, Italians, and Magyars, more Irish, Slavs, and perhaps French too, depending on how much the European Wars screw France.

But Unless a European Power Intervent... the ceteris paribus in USA is the same(the same here in Latin America), but without Maximilian... maybe the French colonial adventure will be more south?

Can't France find some other naive/ambitious cadet scion of a Royal House to play puppet king ?

P.S. And they will not have the 'Statue of Liberty' too, very in the future of the POD

If Germany, Italy, and Hungary become liberal constitutional monarchies in 1848, and in all likelihood get reasonably friendly to America, can't they gift the Statue of Liberty ? Although the design may be different... I had this idea for another TL where Germany and Italy triumph in the 1866 and 1870 wars, exchange statues of twin shieldmaidens to celebrate their alliance and victories, then gift a copy to America, and this becomes TTL "Statue of Liberty". Think of "Italia and Germania" by Overbeck, only with armed maidens, both have swords, one carries the shield of justice, the other the torch of truth. The latter design fits an ATL "Lady Liberty".
 
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Less Germans, Italians, and Magyars, more Irish, Slavs, and perhaps French too, depending on how much the European Wars screw France.



Can't France find some other naive/ambitious cadet scion of a Royal House to play puppet king ?



If Germany, Italy, and Hungary become liberal constitutional monarchies in 1848, and in all likelihood get reasonably friendly to America, can't they gift the Statue of Liberty ?

The First one is very true, and will make some hit effect for the USA( a french lobby in the next war, the french more as a second languange in USA)

Maybe The Savoys (because the gonna lose their thore in Piadmont)

I don't Know, Even if the German Mercenaries were more useful than the french in the cause of independance.. a lot of the Colonist were of German Heritage(the waves of Germania), in Germany that was little event anyway... my (personal)Answer is... NEIN NEIN NEIN. but more excatly... I Don't know again... the USA never was a friend(diplomaticaly and economically friendly) of Germany, less of the Habsburg(the Theodore Roosvelt was some diplomatic, his anglophilia was biggger than that)

Att
Nivek von Beldo

P.S. what do you want to answer me about the italian case?(you don't say nothing about it)
 
Ok I'm back well soonish

Yeah turns out I should try to create something of note be for remaking it so yeah, gonna edit than go to bed
Repeat but with Errors fixed. And misconceptions gone

March 16th
Outside world:
It is a busy day in Austria as the main phase of the Spring of Nations is set to begin. According to Count Kolowrat’s Planner All of the Following occur:
The Austrians accept the Hungarian acquisition of Dalmatia. So with that message in hand, Karl Ludwig and his escort say their farewells as they head off to Hungary to ensure that Hungary gets its new King Karol. By time of his Coronation on March 31st, the new king will need to Rush his new nation to war support its new obligations. This will cause problems with minorities that will be a Substantial part of this new conscript army. Frustration would become rebellion the first of the many ethnic revolts that would plague modern Hungary’s history.

The Austrian military already on the 19th Century version of Alert are now starting to mobilize, which will be completely done by the end of Month. However, the first war-ready divisions are ready to serve as expeditionary forces by the 19th of March.

The Dual Letters are written in order to head off the expected objections to Franz’s plans by the two remaining multiethnic empires, Russia and Ottoman Turkey. Both letters’ promised to both powers that the revolutionary would not carry over into their spheres of influence. This would doom to failure the Serbian, Wallachian, Transylvanian, and the inevitable polish revolutions. The Ottoman Empire was treated extremely nicely in the letter, and most likely be the start of strengthening of ties with Sublime Porte and the eventual alliance signed between them. The Russian Empire appears to have wanted to interfere outside of its own border but was stopped by a combination of the Czar’s sudden and debilitating sickness,a serf uprising in addition to the famous generational Polish revolt. By time all this had been dealt with it was already January 1849 and within the next month the treaty of Lisbon changed everything.(This was actually a because of a cholera epidemic which allegedly the czar got, modern Doctors would probably diagnose it as mono.)

Miloslaw.jpg

The Great polish Revolt of '48 would Ultimately save franz's plans from an unknown danger, the Russian bear.
(Translator's note: Mussolini had a habit confused this with the 1846 revolt, this revolt actually happened in Prussia, specifically in what is now Posen province. In fact Russia will make a Big play against Franz's plans And Germany itself before the end of the year.)

Also on this day the Imperial heir sent orders to the Imperial Governor of the Kingdom of Galicia and Lodomeria Franz Stadion to begin the process of making the Kingdom a constitutional independent state. This would take a while as he had to deal with the Conflicting polish and Ruthenian national councils, unhappy German/Czech Bureaucrats and a Lack of military backup. His balancing act is story for another day, but was the situation was tentatively under control by Christmas day 1848.

Kingdom_of_Galicia.png

The History of Galicia, in map form. Notice the split of Czerowitz from galicia in 1849. This due to the Ruthenians area declaring it would rather stay Austrian than be ruled by Poles. This situation lasted for 2 months until the Prussians forced it back into galicia during the run up Congress of Lisbon. After the Half war of 1854-56, it again declared itself part of Austria, which was now a part of Germany. This secession was never recognized in the 3 weak period between their secession and the Treaty of Krakow, which was signed with Prussia and Polish Galicia . Which resulted in the Austrian lead reconstruction of the every more diverse kingdom. This gives Czerowitz the honor of being the only non German region to consistently apply to be part of Germany, and fail.

In Italy

As Garibaldi's Red shirts headed for Milan to figure out what was going on with Mazzini, another group by chance was also head the same way. Radetzky and his army were heading to Milan on the urging of Austrian garrison there as its Captain said ominously that “Anarchy in the City was on the horizon”. Radetzky found this odd as so far Lombardy-Venetia was unusually quiet for such a time of uncertainty, there was only a bit of republican rabble but the police could take care of that. This made him wonder and say to himself “What’s so special about Milan anyway?” It turns out that there was special about Milan, as the next day would prove.

any better guys!
 
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March 17, 1848 : the day of the tentacle I mean milan.

Italy

The Islands of Italy: The Supplies received from the Sicilian schooners finally prove their usefulness. Armed with more weapons and finally having an adequate supply of ammunition the Sicilian rebels strike. They under their Head of State/ Military commander Ruggero Settimo take the last Bourbon stronghold on The Island, Messina. This becomes their greatest achievement since the start of the Sicilian’s revolution in January of that year. They would officially join the unification war on the Hapsburg Italian side on March 21st.

Sanesi_-_La_rivoluzione_di_Palermo-12_gennaio_1848_-_ca._1850.jpg

The Sicilians pulled off the first great battle victory of the war before it had even begun! Some would argue they were very much passive during the rest of the first Unification war as they did not as a whole participate much in the conflict. These people would be ignoring the role of the island's volunteers in the conflict. As well as the schooners diversion at the battle of the straits. Nobody would deny the role they played during the Sicilian Campaign of the Half baked war of 1854-1856.

Middle Italy: The Guelph alliance between The Kingdom of Sicily (now without Sicily), The Papal State, and Sardinia Piedmont is confirmed. It is dedicated to keeping "Italy for Italians, and preventing it from falling under foreign control. They would certainly try to stop foreign Influence, but they forgot about the opinions of the people.

Northern Italy: The Days of Milan (March 17- March 21st) begin.

On the Morning of the 17th the Austrian garrison of Milan, is ordered by its commander to arrest Mazzini and his provisional government based in Milan on the charges of "provoking unrest".The garrison's commander had refused to believe that the provisional government is working for Austria's government despite the documents that clearly say so, and demands that the provisional government surrender. Mazzini knowing that surrender equals death in this case, refuses and orders preparations for a siege.The majority of Milan, Loyal to Mazzini as Provisional governor of Lombardy-Venetia begins to defend Mazzini and comes to his armed defense. The garrison who numbered in the thousands are now forced out forced out of the majority of the city and have only a hundred or so conservative Allies. Never the less they attempt to retake the city and fighting breaks out throughout the city for most of the day. It is only in the evening that Garibaldi and Radetzky arrive at the Scene which will lead to the signing of the Milan Accord that very night.

Episodio_delle_cinque_giornate_%28Baldassare_Verazzi%29.jpg

This famous painting of the Fighting, Called "The five days" often adds to the common misconception that the fighting in the city actually lasted that long. In truth the Intense fighting lasted around 5 hours not the commonly imagined days. This often feed in to Idea to the incorrect idea that was skill not luck that allowed for the survival of Mazzini government. It was Garibaldi's tongue and Franz's Letter not Milan's guns that led to Old man Radish's cooperation.

Next time the scene itself in Celluoid form.
 
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The situation in Milan was.... something weird. Radetzky know or not know about the Plans of the Hasburg(as no as an aswer will be very unbeliveled, because He is the commander of all Lombardo-Venezia) and what will happen with the rest of the Situation(we gonna have Piadmont-Sardina in the same position than Venetia was for austro-hungary?).

And what is the Half war of 1854-1856.. that seems to be the 'planned' war against Russia and maybe france?

Sorry for some question.. some event from 1848 are very confusing for me(in fact that year was the years of surprise than revolutions). But excellent than you return to writte again the timeline... that is good so far

Att
Nivek von Beldo

P.S How is the situation in Germany.. because if germany fail.. the rest will be for nothing?

P.S Radetzky will be the first Field Marshall of 'Italy', that was was unbelievable loyal to the Hasburg and full of vitality for his age.. he was the reason why the revolutions fail in 1848... and was why the Savoy wait to his dead to try to fight agains austria again.
 
Well, its more of a vague letter from Franz's government in Vienna that convinces radetzky to join forces with the provisional. And your right that 1848 is confusing that's why I considered restarting.

Because of the confusion between the first page or so of the timeline when it made less sense, and the latter pages which were more detailed but also changed over time.

The Reason I even considered rebooting because of the contradictions in some of my writing.

Even hand waving it as In timeline mistakes strechs some of the early stuff a bit.

Basically I constantly shifted how it began and where I wanted so yeah even I'm a bit confused :eek:

Germany will be covered but I want to get the Days of Milan out of the way. Then move into Germany which happens a few days later.

and there's even a coup Attempt against Franz, during the days of Milan1
 
Reading it over, ignore the Second and the first post

canon starts at the revision

And if there are any contradictions or questions after that please let me known in the comments.

By the way thanks to those who read this mess ;) !
 
Reading it over, ignore the Second and the first post

canon starts at the revision

And if there are any contradictions or questions after that please let me known in the comments.

By the way thanks to those who read this mess ;) !

The first Canon Problem is in Part the POD.. we need something more than FJ having a Arquimedes-esque experience in a bath(but after reading Look out to the west.. any POD is pausable..that is true.. but only easily applied with the royals) and again the Reactions of the Plans of the Hasburg(Russia will scream and destroy them Specially after that letter than you send too them) and in general.. the developmt of the revolutions now than they count with the support of maybe one of the oldest royal families of europe.

Again.. this was good first sketch of the timeline... give you experience and the ability to spot issue

I will support in the V2

Att
Nivek von Beldo
 
I guess i didn't put it in clearly but I kinda want russia to react seeing as they will anyway.

I was thinking it would make conservative elements fall in line because the Russians are god damned invading!

This forces Britain and France to get there acts together well probably.

the point is that franz's "calming" letter get Whilhelm the first killed, and forces a unifictation due to russian intervention by the end of August.

thoughts or too foolish on russias part?
 
Russia and the Ottomans: true Unifier of Germany?

The Tale of the spring of nations is very well story to those at all interested in the modern world. However what is less known is the Russian and ottoman effect on the Conflict itself. The Dual letters sent by Franz and Austria Didn't actually do any of the things they were supposed to. The Ottomans were drawn to the Central powers for completely selfish reasons later in the century and only exploited Austria's week position in the Balkans for concessions. The Russians meanwhile actually mobilized because of the Dual Letter even with the cholera epidemic and Serf Revolts by September leading to the famous Russian-German conflict centered in Greater Poland and Galicia by the start of September of that year. So in Reality, the dual letter was only a proof of Weakness that the Remaining Multi-ethnic states took advantage of.

Russia- The Dual Letter and the Hungarian split from the Austrians did not at all Calm down Russia.In fact It set it off starting off the long mobilization that would finish by the end of September that year. Even with the delay of around a month of the already slow process by The Czar getting what was thought to be cholera, but ended up actually being mono. By the time the Russians actually invaded the German Confederation in Eastern Prussia and Galicia the revolts in those places were already crushed. The Russians even Though unprepared for war themselves still managed to Roll there way through Prussia capturing Koenigsberg, Put down the Revolutions in what would be Romania and almost overran Galicia capturing Krakow within the first month of Conflict.

It was only due to the Sacrifice of Prussian Prince Wilhelm at Danzig, The Galician resolve at Krakow's siege, the Hungarians early victory against the Slovak Rebels near the Carpathian mountains Earlier that month that allowed the various European allies to even hold their ground. Victories were only able to be achieved because the Russian general succumbing to Cholera in mid October, the mobilized Austrians were covered for the Prussian host on the Danish front, and the Italian War being pretty much won by mid June allowing most of the veteran army of Italy to be usable in Reinforcing Galicia.

The situation was so bad that even after all that, It was only the British Declaration on December 5th, and travel times that allowed for the Congress of Lisbon to Convene in February with little Russian involvement. by the Time the Russian heard of the congress to object, the treaty was signed and she found most of Europe hostile to any Adjustments. Russia would try to get her vengeance in only a handful of years anyway.

The Ottoman empire- The Letter to The ottomans was much nicer than the one to Russia, Almost grateful for the assumed Neutrality that would come. The Ottomans were not as weak or dithering as Franz thought they would be however. The Price for their "Neutrality" was rather harsh actually. The funny thing is that many Turkish Scholars think the Ottomans would have actually been neutral if not for the Letter. The Letter indicated that the Hapsburg clan was in a very prone Position due to their planning of the new order. The Porte was entirely correct in this regard and thus asked for many things in order to guarantee non interference. From concessions on the river Danube to a Guarantee of territorial integrity, The Sublime Porte tied the new nation states to the Turks and their interests thus dooming themselves and the world to a Future of Multiple global conflicts.
 
The Tale of the spring of nations is very well story to those at all interested in the modern world. However what is less known is the Russian and ottoman effect on the Conflict itself. The Dual letters sent by Franz and Austria Didn't actually do any of the things they were supposed to. The Ottomans were drawn to the Central powers for completely selfish reasons later in the century and only exploited Austria's week position in the Balkans for concessions. The Russians meanwhile actually mobilized because of the Dual Letter even with the cholera epidemic and Serf Revolts by September leading to the famous Russian-German conflict centered in Greater Poland and Galicia by the start of September of that year. So in Reality, the dual letter was only a proof of Weakness that the Remaining Multi-ethnic states took advantage of.

Russia- The Dual Letter and the Hungarian split from the Austrians did not at all Calm down Russia.In fact It set it off starting off the long mobilization that would finish by the end of September that year. Even with the delay of around a month of the already slow process by The Czar getting what was thought to be cholera, but ended up actually being mono. By the time the Russians actually invaded the German Confederation in Eastern Prussia and Galicia the revolts in those places were already crushed. The Russians even Though unprepared for war themselves still managed to Roll there way through Prussia capturing Koenigsberg, Put down the Revolutions in what would be Romania and almost overran Galicia capturing Krakow within the first month of Conflict.

It was only due to the Sacrifice of Prussian Prince Wilhelm at Danzig, The Galician resolve at Krakow's siege, the Hungarians early victory against the Slovak Rebels near the Carpathian mountains Earlier that month that allowed the various European allies to even hold their ground. Victories were only able to be achieved because the Russian general succumbing to Cholera in mid October, the mobilized Austrians were covered for the Prussian host on the Danish front, and the Italian War being pretty much won by mid June allowing most of the veteran army of Italy to be usable in Reinforcing Galicia.

The situation was so bad that even after all that, It was only the British Declaration on December 5th, and travel times that allowed for the Congress of Lisbon to Convene in February with little Russian involvement. by the Time the Russian heard of the congress to object, the treaty was signed and she found most of Europe hostile to any Adjustments. Russia would try to get her vengeance in only a handful of years anyway.

The Ottoman empire- The Letter to The ottomans was much nicer than the one to Russia, Almost grateful for the assumed Neutrality that would come. The Ottomans were not as weak or dithering as Franz thought they would be however. The Price for their "Neutrality" was rather harsh actually. The funny thing is that many Turkish Scholars think the Ottomans would have actually been neutral if not for the Letter. The Letter indicated that the Hapsburg clan was in a very prone Position due to their planning of the new order. The Porte was entirely correct in this regard and thus asked for many things in order to guarantee non interference. From concessions on the river Danube to a Guarantee of territorial integrity, The Sublime Porte tied the new nation states to the Turks and their interests thus dooming themselves and the world to a Future of Multiple global conflicts.

I always was a critic of the Dual Letter... by a simple reason: They're almost an ASB... in the Victorian Era.. that was the era of the Secret Diplomacy and a letter like than can be uses against Austria in the Concert of the Nations(The British) and a direct letter against Russia is a Suicide for a extremly ethnical divided nations as Austria... An Remember Who Frederick Wihelm and Bismarck Still Plot their conservative germany sans Austria.. and with russia support that is possible in exchage for Galicia and consesion... i think you must remove that letter from the timeline.

If you wan to provoke Russia... The same liberal constitution and the Formation of Independant Galicia-Poland is Enough.

And if pretty weird than Nicholas I Have Cholera... he in 1848 was old but full of vitality to work as the gendarme of Europe

And what is that of travel time.. don't tell me that is Time travel?.. That means jump the shark for a timeline who have potential...

Sorry if I very critic.. but i like this timeline.. and i fell you gonna make this an ASB at this Pace

Att
Nivek von Beldo
 
wheres the Time travel :confused:

I meant that the czar gets mono

ohhh!

And I may delete the Letter from cannon and prepare my second version of the timeline

Thanks for the support! I need criticism!
 
wheres the Time travel :confused:

I meant that the czar gets mono

ohhh!

And I may delete the Letter from cannon and prepare my second version of the timeline

Thanks for the support! I need criticism!

My black resalted Part in my Quote.

But again... the Czar was in good health.. was the Flu in crimea and his stuborness of look for a doctor or take care of himself than degenerate in a pheumonia and kill him. Even with the Still in progress Medical Science.. the royality can afford good health when they want and can.

and yes... the letter were a lot much for the timeline and still we have a lot of causus belis if russia is the agressor(remember Eltass-Lothrigen)

And a advice.. if you Kill Wilhelm I.. the crown of Prussia will not go to his son... but rather Either Prince Charles or Albert of Prussia(I'm not a expert in Salic law, in fact know little about it.. but i think that is the prussia interpretarion of that law)
 
Ok for the revision I will remove the Letter, the mono, and have clear chronilogical dates.

Also I may have answered other Questions in the other revised thread.

Please Continue to point out inconsistencies you see, I'm in need of such service.

now Off to study Salic law!
 
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