rich and mighty early modern Denmark 16th century onwards through New World discovery

Lately, I posted a thread, were Columbus offers his services to Denmark. What if Denmark mainatains Greenland connection throughout 15th century and eventually sets foot on old Markland and Vinland in 15th century. Imagine, the country manages to get rich by Walrus tooth (a subscriber noted, taht they had been as worthy as gold ) and pelt trade . Could Denmark become one of the richest kingdoms in Western Europe (at least main power of the North), maybe cementing Schleswig and Holstein rule, bound Norway , hire merchenary armies and build mighty fleets ? Maybe outcompetate England, or England not emerging as great power ? ? Swallow Hamburg ? No rise of Sweden ?

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=372886
 
No offense to Denmark, but I do not think that walrus horns and furs will get you going the way Incan silver did.
 
There are things you can do with Denmark, but I don't think the North Atlantic Empire is a promising start. Walrus ivory is a very limited demand commodity, and prices drop with rising supply very quickly. The climate in the 1500s and 1600s is not conducive to safe navigation in polar latitudes or living in Iceland, Greenland or Labrador. You'd have to go further south.

If you want to make Denmark great, I'd go with keeping the nearer holdings under control. Gobbling up Hamburg and Lübeck is trivial, and gives the realm a good port to points west. Now Denmark controls the Elbe estuary - that's not as good as the Rhine delta, but not shabby, either. Sweden is going to be harder, but if you can hold on to that, Denmark could effectively dominate the Baltic. On that foundation and with historic claims to Greenland, Iceland and 'Vinland' (wherever that is), this Alt-Denmark could easily end up in control of the St Lawrence and the Grand Banks. It would have access to plenty of German settlers come time (not for a long while, though - settling the interior of Canada and the Midwest isn't feasible until much later).

I can't see it rivaling Spain and Portugal, or even England, though. It'll be too busy defending its borders and is poorly placed to take full advantage of the new Atlantic shipping routes.
 
I can't see it rivaling Spain and Portugal, or even England, though. It'll be too busy defending its borders and is poorly placed to take full advantage of the new Atlantic shipping routes.

You clearly never read Shikaku-Mon.The Scandinavians need only invade England and seize any British colonies at gunpoint.
 
Oldenburg and Denmark were often competing over Holstein, so managing to work that out in a dynastic Union would give a good base for which to incorporate the Bisphoric of Verden and Archbishopric of Bremen. They may then have a market through which to sell items from overseas. Though really, Greenland was potentially doomed from the start, which is why the entire Norse population vanished. And, come to think of it, potentially the Skraeling/Thule people who were there before them. Anyways, why wouldn't Sweden rise? They had much of the Baltic, which was filled with amber, fish, tar, grain, lumber, iron, you name it. They were also dynastic ally linked to the Poles for a while. If anything, it might give the Danes less of a reason to mind them. Or they can try coming to an arrangement, if the Swedes are the ones getting lots of the jobs of conquest and there are monopolistic companies with many Swedish board members.

There is of course the issue of whether or not items they bring back would be worth the cost. They would need to go a very round about way to get to the Americas and they might not have a market walrus teeth alone. Sugar and spice is where th eminent is in. Heck, I once read on TVTropes for Pocohantas why they wondered why they didn't ship all the lumber home. IOTL, they didn't think the trees in the Americas were good for ship building. Hardly profitably to sail across the sea with wood anyways, unless it is of the highest quality or used for burning for the scents.
 
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Lately, I posted a thread, were Columbus offers his services to Denmark. What if Denmark mainatains Greenland connection throughout 15th century and eventually sets foot on old Markland and Vinland in 15th century. Imagine, the country manages to get rich by Walrus tooth (a subscriber noted, taht they had been as worthy as gold ) and pelt trade . Could Denmark become one of the richest kingdoms in Western Europe (at least main power of the North), maybe cementing Schleswig and Holstein rule, bound Norway , hire merchenary armies and build mighty fleets ? Maybe outcompetate England, or England not emerging as great power ? ? Swallow Hamburg ? No rise of Sweden ?

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=372886

If they already have colonies out west why do they hire a foreigner to look out for them?

I have to give it to Thande. Columbus = most overrated person in history.
 
Lately, I posted a thread, were Columbus offers his services to Denmark. What if Denmark mainatains Greenland connection throughout 15th century and eventually sets foot on old Markland and Vinland in 15th century. Imagine, the country manages to get rich by Walrus tooth (a subscriber noted, taht they had been as worthy as gold ) and pelt trade . Could Denmark become one of the richest kingdoms in Western Europe (at least main power of the North), maybe cementing Schleswig and Holstein rule, bound Norway , hire merchenary armies and build mighty fleets ? Maybe outcompetate England, or England not emerging as great power ? ? Swallow Hamburg ? No rise of Sweden ?

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=372886

Not entirely sure Walrus ivory will be their in sufficient quantity, also Ivory from Africa would be cheaper i believe. Pelt trade will also have a hard time to compete with the pelt trade in Scandinavia and Russia.

However historical Denmark did became one of the richest kingdoms in Europe if not the richest (more the King actually than the kingdom, and only for a short time.)

it was all thrown away with the Danish participation in the Thirty year wars. Before Denmark participated, Denmark was seen as the strongest protestant nation in Europe (over the Netherlands and England) Unfortunate this was a paper tiger due to the way Denmark was ruled. The Nobles had way too much power.

Remember the Danish participation in the Thirty years war, was not actually Denmark but Holstein-Schleswig and Christian IV as its Duke.

Due to the disastrous defeats in The Thirty Year Wars, Torstenson War and The Second Northern wars saw Christian IV second son successful in making Denmark into a Absolute Monarchy.

If you want Denmark to be a major power, it need to go from a elective monarchy to a absolute monarchy, and while doing it, it have to not suffer severe territorial losses.

Anyways back to your question:

Columbus discovered the Americas in 1492 which i believe is just as the little ice age sets in, and since Denmark lost contact to the original settlers in the 15th century, i believe at this point that have already happened.

the Danish king is King Hans/John which ruled Denmark from 1481-1513. Norway: 1483-1513 and Sweden 1497-1501.

Which means the period Columbus would be approaching the king, is during one of the many periods where Sweden have rebelled.

so to sum up:

Lost contact with the settlers of Greenland, Knowledge of it is probably still there.
Sweden rebelled, King Hans/John will be focused on regaining his rightful kingdom.
Hanseatic League is still up and kicking, need to be dealt with.
Need to go from Elective to Absolute monarchy.

While King Hans/John might have had the money personally, from the Sound dues. I don't see him going on this. however depends on what it cost.

If it did happen, i have a hard time to see it value, fur he can get from regaining Sweden, and i am very unsure if Walrus Ivory is there in sufficient quantity. Furthermore he is a long way from the Silver and Gold of Central/south America.

I simply do not think the will is there for Columbus to sail to the Americas sponsored by Denmark, as much as i would love it :)
 
Your best bet might just be to get Denmark involved in the fur trade rather than France. This could then lead to more exploration and settlement of North America.
 
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