Return of the Lionheart

So, practically all fanciful renditions of Robin Hood have the return of Good King Richard after the death or overthrow of Bad King John. Now, as we know, Lionheart died on the fields of Aquataine before his return to England. What if he had survived and returned?
 
Um, Richard returning IS history.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/richard_i_king.shtml

Bad weather drove him ashore near Venice and he was imprisoned by Duke Leopold of Austria before being handed over to the German emperor Henry VI, who ransomed him for the huge sum of 150,000 marks. The raising of the ransom was a remarkable achievement. In February 1194, Richard was released. He returned at once to England and was crowned for a second time, fearing that the ransom payment had compromised his independence. Yet a month later he went to Normandy, never to return. His last five years were spent in intermittent warfare against Philip II. While besieging the castle of Châlus in central France he was fatally wounded and died on 6 April 1199. He was succeeded by his younger brother John, who had spent the years of Richard's absence scheming against him.
 
I mean what if he had not been killed and had a long reign.

Probably more of using England as a money tree to fund his military campaigns against whoever he felt like.

I still think there's not much he could have done in the long term in Normandy/Aquitane/Wherever, but he might avoid pissing the same people off.
 
I mean what if he had not been killed and had a long reign.

Richard was forty-one (not yet forty-two) when he died OTL, how long do you want him to live?

Richard outliving Philip II would be interesting.

He might have an heir of his body if he lives longer (unclear why he failed to OTL).

He might outlive John (depending on what happens to John).

Arthur of Brittany becomes an interesting factor - at some point he'll be Duke (Count?) of Brittany whether he's Richard's heir or not. But he's already been influenced by Philip by 1199, so I imagine Richard is not going to be comfortable with that.
 
I always thought that a cool POD would be Leopold not managing to capture Richard. Imagine the time and money that would be saved by England were Richard to return home sooner. He might have even found time to marry and produce an heir; even if not, butterflies could likely avoid his death, as he had no illnesses.

So he fights against Philip, has peace with Philip, fights against Philip, puts John and the barons back in line, has peace with Philip, etc., and, before you know it, guess who comes of age? Duke Arthur of Brittany, son of the late Geoffrey. Arthur's claim to the English throne is stronger than John's and, if he plays his cards right, could be proclaimed heir by a childless Richard. This is not unlikely, as Richard seems to have despised--or at least been repelled by--John, and Arthur was young, possibly vigorous, and brought the wealth and continental stability of Brittany with him.

Wouldn't that be cool?
 
I always thought that a cool POD would be Leopold not managing to capture Richard. Imagine the time and money that would be saved by England were Richard to return home sooner. He might have even found time to marry and produce an heir; even if not, butterflies could likely avoid his death, as he had no illnesses.

Richard was married in 1191 OTL, even allowing for crusading and captivity that leaves five years for him and Berengaria to start a healthy brood of children.

I think Leopold not capturing Richard would be interesting to say the least - but Richard having children would come out of the butterflies if anything.

I think the other POD would be the Austrian marriage of Eleanor of Brittany happening..

Who was Eleanor going to marry?
 
Richard was married in 1191 OTL, even allowing for crusading and captivity that leaves five years for him and Berengaria to start a healthy brood of children.

I think Leopold not capturing Richard would be interesting to say the least - but Richard having children would come out of the butterflies if anything.

Well then, who's to say that Berengaria isn't infertile? I mean, it might not have been true OTL, but it might have too. I guess it depends on whether you want Arthur of Brittany owning everything, or Richard's kids fighting everyone.
 
Well then, who's to say that Berengaria isn't infertile? I mean, it might not have been true OTL, but it might have too. I guess it depends on whether you want Arthur of Brittany owning everything, or Richard's kids fighting everyone.

It's possible - she didn't remarry after Richard died OTL, so there's no way to check.

As for which I want, I personally think OTL is fine - I prefer Philip to any of the Angevin brats of his day.

That's not very helpful to this discussion, but for alt history's sake I'd say that either works. Arthur is not much more of a definite we-have-any-idea than hypothetical sons of Richard.
 
If Richard lives longer then probably no John, which in turn means no Henry III and in turn no Edwards I, II or III. Massive butterflies in England's relationships with Scotland and France.
(Also no Magna Carta)
 
Robin Hood Myth where he fights against the taxes and levies of King Richard and supports the Return of a King Arthur to the throne.
 
Robin Hood Myth where he fights against the taxes and levies of King Richard and supports the Return of a King Arthur to the throne.

Holy hell this would be great. Arthur, after becoming king and solidifying his rule, joins a Crusade to the Holy Land and leaves Uncle John in charge. John's rule is idiotic, etc. as in OTL, and people begin to shout for the "one true king", "the once and future king", "King Arthur"! A great turn of events.
 
In one current tl's Richard survives and Philippe Auguste dies and Richard becomes the King of France by election which leads to Barbarossa gaining Toulouse.
 
For those that may not know, Randall Garrett wrote his Lord D'Arcy books that had a premise that Richard lived and Arthur became his heir.

Now they would be an ASB story as it allowed magic but I enjoyed them.
 
In one current tl's Richard survives and Philippe Auguste dies and Richard becomes the King of France by election which leads to Barbarossa gaining Toulouse.

Incredibility unlikely. For one the French throne isn't elective, so Louis VIII would become King. Or if he's dead then the King's brother. Second, WHY would the Holy Roman Empire get Toulouse? If anything it would go to the ENGLISH, thanks to the distant claim via Eleanor of Aquitaine.
 
Incredibility unlikely. For one the French throne isn't elective, so Louis VIII would become King. Or if he's dead then the King's brother. Second, WHY would the Holy Roman Empire get Toulouse? If anything it would go to the ENGLISH, thanks to the distant claim via Eleanor of Aquitaine.

Actually the french throne was elective until Phillipe II. He was the first king to do away with the election and make it formally hereditary
 
WHY would the Holy Roman Empire get Toulouse? If anything it would go to the ENGLISH, thanks to the distant claim via Eleanor of Aquitaine.
The Counts of Toulouse at that time have a claim to Provence and if they were lucky they could leave France and gain Provence which is an HRE Fiefdom from Aragon with HRE help.
 
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