Retrospective US Presidential Election: 1916

[Nerdlinger]

I plan to run through every US presidential election, two per week. The 28 elections from 1789-1896 will be run simultaneously with the 28 elections from 1900-2008. Be sure to vote in each election!

For 1789-1800, I will include in the poll everyone who received at least 5% of the electoral vote. From 1804-2008, I will include everyone who received at least 0.05% of the popular vote. Results for each election will be posted on the dedicated Retrospective US Presidential Election Results Thread (here) and compared to the actual results. The thread for general project discussion is here.

Here's the link to the 1804 election.

 

[Turquoise Blue]

One thing I am sure of, is that Woodrow Wilson will not have much votes.

 

[Aelita]

I am not happy with the results of the 1912 Socialist Party convention, in which the Yellows undemocratically and illegitimately took over the party from the Red rank and file.

So I vote Socialist Labor.

 

[NKVD]

I'd appreciate if someone could tell me why they'd vote Socialist Labor over Socialist. I'm not very familiar with the differences among the historical splintered left.

I am not happy with the results of the 1912 Socialist Party convention, in which the Yellows undemocratically and illegitimately took over the party from the Red rank and file.

So I vote Socialist Labor.

I didn't see this.

Care to explain? I'm not too familiar with the history of the Socialist Party of the US.

 

[mowque]

This one may split the Left vote, with Wilson picking up the crumbs. Should help Hughes out.

 

[eaglesfan101]

Charles Evans Hughes. Wilson sucks. The Socialists don't have Debs and the Socialist Laborites are too radical.

 

[Aelita]

I'd appreciate if someone could tell me why they'd vote Socialist Labor over Socialist. I'm not very familiar with the differences among the historical splintered left.



I didn't see this.

Care to explain? I'm not too familiar with the history of the Socialist Party of the US.

The Socialist Party was divided between the "Reds", who were the large party's rank and file, and they generally favored industrial unionism and a grassroots kind of "workers' commonwealth" very close to anarcho-syndicalism.

But thanks to some use of the by-laws, the pragmatic "Yellows", who were reformists, took control of the party national executive, and broke the party's ties with the IWW, and pushed a reformist platform on the party.

Charles Evans Hughes. Wilson sucks. The Socialists don't have Debs and the Socialist Laborites are too radical.

They're to the right of Debs for the most part. I'd hardly call that too radical.

 

[Cuāuhtemōc]

Allan Benson.

 

[NKVD]

The Socialist Party was divided between the "Reds", who were the large party's rank and file, and they generally favored industrial unionism and a grassroots kind of "workers' commonwealth" very close to anarcho-syndicalism.

But thanks to some use of the by-laws, the pragmatic "Yellows", who were reformists, took control of the party national executive, and broke the party's ties with the IWW, and pushed a reformist platform on the party.

Thanks.

Bens...comrades! Don't shoot! I was going to say "Reimer it is then."

 

[Makemakean]

I am not happy with the results of the 1912 Socialist Party convention, in which the Yellows undemocratically and illegitimately took over the party from the Red rank and file.

So I vote Socialist Labor.

You know, I cannot deny that I am intrigued by all this "Yellow" and "Red" factionalism within the Socialist Party of the United States you keep talking about. Give me a link or two about these two sides, their goals and policies I pray, I'm curious.

 

[Aelita]

You know, I cannot deny that I am intrigued by all this "Yellow" and "Red" factionalism within the Socialist Party of the United States you keep talking about. Give me a link or two about these two sides, their goals and policies I pray, I'm curious.

Finding links has proven difficult, because this is obviously not a subject most people delve into, so most of my sources are in print. Unfortunately, even the Wiki article on the Socialist Party of America, which is otherwise quite well constructued, glosses over the entire issue, as well as the entirety of pre-world war I history, in a few paragraphs.

The section on the split of the left-wing is decent. It should definitely give you an idea of the long-standing divide within the party over the party's future and it's role in society.

 

[OAM47]

Yeah, I'd rather change my vote to S-L, voted this way by accident x.x

 

[Makemakean]

Finding links has proven difficult, because this is obviously not a subject most people delve into, so most of my sources are in print. Unfortunately, even the Wiki article on the Socialist Party of America, which is otherwise quite well constructued, glosses over the entire issue, as well as the entirety of pre-world war I history, in a few paragraphs.

The section on the split of the left-wing is decent. It should definitely give you an idea of the long-standing divide within the party over the party's future and it's role in society.

Yeah, I read through that and came to the conclusion that it couldn't be the split you were talking about, since that split occurred in 1919, and seemed to have revolved around whether or not socialism should come about through a revolution á la Red October 1917 or through democratic reformism, á la the Fabian Society. The entire article makes no mention of the terminology red or yellow at all, and when I tried googling it, there were no results. Judging from your earlier use of the terminology, as well as your comment that Debs was not a proponent of nationalization, I tried to see if I could find anything to suggest that Debs wasn't a supporter of democratic socialism as practiced by, for example, the British Labour Party (as I had always assumed), but was in favor of (and this is my own guess-work) some sort of syndicalist communism. However, upon googling "Eugene Debs Syndicalism," the first link is to a page at Marxists.org, which claims that Debs "fought against Anarchism and Syndicalism within the unions" and the second link is a letter sent by the perennial presidential candidate to H. M. Hyndman, in which Debs writes:

The Anarchists are all jubilant over the prospect that syndicalism may disrupt the Socialist Party, but they will again be disappointed. There are many of our Socialists who favor syndicalism and sabotage, or think they do, but the party is overwhelmingly opposed to both, and will stick to the main track to the end.

The same letter also contains the words:

Revolutionary political action and revolutionary industrial organization will finally win out against all opposition, both from without and within.

Which, unless I am mistaken of course, seems to smack a little of Bolshevism...

Considering how hard it is to find any information on the yellow and red factions within the SPA, may I ask you to provide a little information here, as well as concerning what kind of socialism it was that Eugene Debs favored, that doesn't include state ownership and management of industries?

 

[Know Nothing]

Hughes.

Ironically, he may perform better than Theodore Roosevelt since Hughes did not have to compete with the juggernaut that is Debs.

 

[Aelita]

Which, unless I am mistaken of course, seems to smack a little of Bolshevism...

Considering how hard it is to find any information on the yellow and red factions within the SPA, may I ask you to provide a little information here, as well as concerning what kind of socialism it was that Eugene Debs favored, that doesn't include state ownership and management of industries?

Naturally, it does. Debs was a revolutionary socialist, which I find it interesting that he became the unifying figure of the SPA, and not someone more moderate. There were a lot of people, like Victor Berger and Morris Hilquit, who were altogether uneasy of any revolutionary element in the party. They considered it on the whole counterproductive to the reformist politics they were fighting for.

Part of what kept the reformists and revolutionaries together so long was the fact that they could agree on a certain minimum program, some of which were economic issues. While the left was in general not supprotive of strict nationalization, they were definitely unafraid to use state power as a tool to build their co-operative commonwealth.

They key difference between the Yellows and Reds was that Yellows favored nationalization as an end in itself. That is, by the federal government, or state or municipalities, taking ownership of capitalist enterprises, and administering them for the public good, they'd abolish exploitation, and put these industries to work for social goods.

Reds, on the other hand, at best considered nationalization a tool, and some in the more syndicalist elements like Haywood, considered it an unnecessary legalism. The left-wing of the party was heavily involved in the IWW, even after the two organizations severed official connections, and in the Wobbly mold they favored workers taking direct ownership and control of large capitalist conglomerates.

Debs would be on the center-left, within the "Red" category but also conciliatory to the party's right-wing, the "Yellows".

 

[Makemakean]

Part of what kept the reformists and revolutionaries together so long was the fact that they could agree on a certain minimum program, some of which were economic issues. While the left was in general not supprotive of strict nationalization, they were definitely unafraid to use state power as a tool to build their co-operative commonwealth.

Now when you say co-operative commonwealth, surely I am not mistaken in assuming that you are referring to some sort of anarcho-syndicalist system?

 

[Aelita]

Now when you say co-operative commonwealth, surely I am not mistaken in assuming that you are referring to some sort of anarcho-syndicalist system?

It has similarities. But one, I wouldn't call it anarchist, but definitely state-skeptical. Two, I wouldn't call it strictly syndicalist. Some enterprises, like infrastructure, would be managed by the state.

 

[Tsao]

What's so bad about the Yellows? If I did not vote for Wilson, I would have voted Socialist.

 

[Jasen777]

Don't know who to vote for in this one.

 

[Tsao]

Don't know who to vote for in this one.

When in doubt, WILSON.