regan dies from assasination, john lennon lives.

radical_neutural · Jan 2, 2006

i think this would be a better world, but i'm not sure what the result would be. who was regan's VP? still a world with john lennon still alive would be a better place, maybe he could help with live aid? still a world without regan.

Flocculencio · Jan 2, 2006

Well Reagan getting killed would obviously have massive side effects.

However Lennon, like Macartney would become old and embarrassing, probably pump out more crappy concept work with his wife- the only reason he's thought of so highly and not considered a stupid self-righteous hippie is because he got shot.

Floid · Jan 2, 2006

John Lennon not getting shot would be as important as when he did get shot - in other words, it's not important.

Ronald Reagan getting killed.. it really depends when he got shot, perhaps you could be more specific?

Count Dearborn · Jan 2, 2006

The country is really screwed as Bush the Elder takes over, and f***s up the country twenty years early.

radical_neutural · Jan 2, 2006

Floid said:
John Lennon not getting shot would be as important as when he did get shot - in other words, it's not important.

Ronald Reagan getting killed.. it really depends when he got shot, perhaps you could be more specific?

john f. hinkly.

Floid · Jan 2, 2006

radical_neutural said:
john f. hinkly.

You mean John Warnock Hinckley, Jr.? That would put the assassination date at March 30th 1981. If so, then Reagan would be dead just 3 months into his term in office. I should leave this to someone more in touch with American history and policy in the early 1980's.

Scomerger · Jan 2, 2006

Count Deerborn said:
The country is really screwed as Bush the Elder takes over, and f***s up the country twenty years early.

So will his son (George W. Bush).

Hierophant · Jan 2, 2006

George Bush Senior was probably one of our more level headed presidents, he just made a mistake in ruling out no more taxes, as well as being screwed over by the Reform parties bid in '92.

Scomerger · Jan 2, 2006

Justin Green said:
George Bush Senior was probably one of our more level headed presidents, he just made a mistake in ruling out no more taxes, as well as being screwed over by the Reform parties bid in '92.

Exactly! If he never said "Read my lips: No New Taxes", then everything might be changed. Drastically changed, to be exact.

Wendell · Jan 2, 2006

JEDCJT said:
Exactly! If he never said "Read my lips: No New Taxes", then everything might be changed. Drastically changed, to be exact.

I assume that Bush would win the 1984 election. Who will he take for VP, Donald Rumsfeld, perhaps?

Xen · Jan 3, 2006

I dont think Bush would win in 1984, unless he does something to kick start the economy. Had the incumbent been anyone other than Reagan the election would have been lost, however ol' Ronnie had alot of charisma while George H.W. Bush is a stiff.

We could see an alteration between Republican and Democrat for the next several terms.I could even see Bush nominating Bob Dole as his Veep. The 1980s and 1990s will be very different. It would be intresting to see the Republicans upholding an anti-gun lobby while the Democrats have the support of NRA. (Not that it would necessarily happen, it would just be something if this incident caused the parties to trade positions)

As for John Lennon its hard to tell. He would certainly enjoy success in the 1980s, perhaps even have a few cutting edge songs and music videos. Perhaps he reunites with Paul McCartney for a world tour in 1989 but for the most part remains a solo artist, his popularity drops by the 1990's to where he is a secondary artist, perhaps going back into retirement.

The Beatles maybe will reunite a couple of times, once or twice in the 1980's for Band Aid/Live Aid type of stuff, and again in the mid 1990's as Beatlemania gains a surge among the worlds teens for a short while. However he'd most likely be retired, perhaps giving some input on a variety of things, doing specials and benefit concerts. If there is still a September 11 you can expect to see Lennon singing songs like Imagine, Give Peace a Chance and a few others.

Redbeard · Jan 3, 2006

Without Reagan I think we might still have a Soviet Union or at least have its end postponed until now. And considering how lucky we really were in the relatively peaceful dismemberment of that evil empire I'd hate to do it all over - I fear we can't be that lucky again.

Next, if without Reagan I fear we have a much weaker USA. I think it is difficult to overestiamte the effect Reagan had on the rebirth of American self-confidence. Without that, things are likely to go beserk in a lot of places in the world - as there will be no US President with the guts and will to smack the crooks. Just imagine what had happened in Yugoslavia without US resolve to put a stop to attrocities

...or what do you think Saddam will be like when allowed to keep his Kuwaitian loot, or just allowed to play games with weapon inspectors?

When Reagan came to power I considered him a 100% fool, but the more I learn the closer I get to seeing him as a true 20th century hero!

Regards

Steffen Redbeard

Hendryk · Jan 3, 2006

There's already been some speculation in this thread about a TL in which John Lennon isn't killed.

ruisramos · Jan 3, 2006

No Reagan = Longer Cold War

Without the massive spending on Defense made during the Reagan administrations,the SU ecomomy would not be under an equal stress it was in our TL.

Without the increased spending in Defense the I think the SU would take at least two decades more to crumble as it did on our TL.

Archangel Michael · Jan 3, 2006

The Cold War would have ended maybe in a few years later. Soviet internal policies brought down the Soviet Union, not Reagan's out of control defense spending.

radical_neutural · Jan 3, 2006

Xen said:
I dont think Bush would win in 1984, unless he does something to kick start the economy. Had the incumbent been anyone other than Reagan the election would have been lost, however ol' Ronnie had alot of charisma while George H.W. Bush is a stiff.

We could see an alteration between Republican and Democrat for the next several terms.I could even see Bush nominating Bob Dole as his Veep. The 1980s and 1990s will be very different. It would be intresting to see the Republicans upholding an anti-gun lobby while the Democrats have the support of NRA. (Not that it would necessarily happen, it would just be something if this incident caused the parties to trade positions)

As for John Lennon its hard to tell. He would certainly enjoy success in the 1980s, perhaps even have a few cutting edge songs and music videos. Perhaps he reunites with Paul McCartney for a world tour in 1989 but for the most part remains a solo artist, his popularity drops by the 1990's to where he is a secondary artist, perhaps going back into retirement.

The Beatles maybe will reunite a couple of times, once or twice in the 1980's for Band Aid/Live Aid type of stuff, and again in the mid 1990's as Beatlemania gains a surge among the worlds teens for a short while. However he'd most likely be retired, perhaps giving some input on a variety of things, doing specials and benefit concerts. If there is still a September 11 you can expect to see Lennon singing songs like Imagine, Give Peace a Chance and a few others.

regan dies= weakened republician party=no 9/11

radical_neutural · Jan 3, 2006

Redbeard said:
Without Reagan I think we might still have a Soviet Union or at least have its end postponed until now. And considering how lucky we really were in the relatively peaceful dismemberment of that evil empire I'd hate to do it all over - I fear we can't be that lucky again.

Next, if without Reagan I fear we have a much weaker USA. I think it is difficult to overestiamte the effect Reagan had on the rebirth of American self-confidence. Without that, things are likely to go beserk in a lot of places in the world - as there will be no US President with the guts and will to smack the crooks. Just imagine what had happened in Yugoslavia without US resolve to put a stop to attrocities

...or what do you think Saddam will be like when allowed to keep his Kuwaitian loot, or just allowed to play games with weapon inspectors?

When Reagan came to power I considered him a 100% fool, but the more I learn the closer I get to seeing him as a true 20th century hero!

Regards

Steffen Redbeard

the soviet union fell because of bankruptcy, not because of an evil war criminal united states prez. regan was an evil bastard and the world would be better f without out him. if the soviet union didn't fall, no distructive california gang wars in the early 90's. no crack wars in the 80's, because it was under regan that the CIA began to import cociane. regan should have died and lennon should have lived. lennon was a great man and activist, regan was an evil bastard. as for yugoslavia, the americans hurt as much as they helped, the rest of europe would have done something.

Justin Pickard · Jan 3, 2006

radical_neutural said:
regan dies= weakened republician party=no 9/11

A tad simplistic, methinks. A Democrat-dominated US would probably still have incurred the wrath of Al Qaeda or something comparable. It's modernity, rationality, secularism, and neoliberal values that terrorists are lashing out against, not the American Republican party.

radical_neutural · Jan 3, 2006

Justin Pickard said:
A tad simplistic, methinks. A Democrat-dominated US would probably still have incurred the wrath of Al Qaeda or something comparable. It's modernity, rationality, secularism, and neoliberal values that terrorists are lashing out against, not the American Republican party.

the terrorists worked for the government, do i need to spell it out for you?

Floid · Jan 3, 2006

radical_neutural said:
the terrorists worked for the government, do i need to spell it out for you?

Please do. Meanwhile, please try reading up on your history, psychology, politics and geopolitics. You're being simplistic like Justin said.