That's what I was thinking of. A reducto ad absurdum critique of the authoritarian state. I presume V is going to be more of an American-influenced anarchist.
Reds fanfic
- Thread starter E. Burke
- Start date
That's what I was thinking of. A reducto ad absurdum critique of the authoritarian state. I presume V is going to be more of an American-influenced anarchist.
Heavy Metal was heavily influence by Hard Rock, which was, in turn, inspired by R&B and Blues, both of which are probably still alive. However, it might also have a palpable Jazz influence in there, so it might resemble prog rock as well.
Good to know metal still around. I admit I have not listened to prog rock, what does it sound like?
When it comes to culture, music is the thing I am most interested in in this TL.
Blues certainly can't be butterflied away, as it predates the POD, whilst Jazz is still quite likely to emerge, as it's roots are pretty strongly in place by the time the TL kicks off, and there isn't any reason it should be butterflied. As an aside, the lead up to the Civil War will have great effects on Blues and a lot of great pieces will probably be produced by artists who lived through it, particularly in the South.
Rock and Roll, if it emerges, will almost certainly not be as "white" as it became OTL, as Black artists will not receive the same discrimination, and the Second Great Migration probably won't happen meaning fewer whites are exposed to the genre. This alone probably butterflies the Beatles and such, although the geopolitical situation also does this. As such, I don't think Metal is likely to emerge in the same way as we know it.
Rock could be consigned to the South, or become a predominantly African-American thing with relatively few white artists, or simply be much more like it was originally. Southern whites like Johnny Cash, Elvis, and Buddy Holly, if not butterflied, could become the progenitors of a "white" rock and roll, similar to OTL, but one which may have far less appeal outside the South. It all depends on its competition, I think. Jazz, swing, and it's variants could be the dominant musical style in the country, probably with a lot of Russian and Latin American influence. If so, Rock and Roll will almost certainly not achieve the heights it did.
Another interesting factor in the battle for musical dominance is dance. Swing, jazz, blues, and rock and roll all have their own unique dance styles (both patterned and individual) (for examples of the latter, think about the dance hall scenes in Back to the Future and Grease), and I'd think that a population with fewer pressing financial concerns, and greater opportunity to pursue recreation would quite naturally turn to dancing as a significant pastime.
With no Great Migration, Compton won't have the same black population as OTL, butterflying hip-hop, although spoken verses over a musical track is too old and too simple an idea to not emerge. Beyond the 50s and 60s I think it becomes quite difficult to predict. Certainly, styles derived from Latin American, Eastern European, Russian, and Central Asian traditions will emerge and fuse and blend.
God, the musical wealth alone is reason enough for me to want to live ITTL.
Blues certainly can't be butterflied away, as it predates the POD, whilst Jazz is still quite likely to emerge, as it's roots are pretty strongly in place by the time the TL kicks off, and there isn't any reason it should be butterflied. As an aside, the lead up to the Civil War will have great effects on Blues and a lot of great pieces will probably be produced by artists who lived through it, particularly in the South.
Rock and Roll, if it emerges, will almost certainly not be as "white" as it became OTL, as Black artists will not receive the same discrimination, and the Second Great Migration probably won't happen meaning fewer whites are exposed to the genre. This alone probably butterflies the Beatles and such, although the geopolitical situation also does this. As such, I don't think Metal is likely to emerge in the same way as we know it.
Rock could be consigned to the South, or become a predominantly African-American thing with relatively few white artists, or simply be much more like it was originally. Southern whites like Johnny Cash, Elvis, and Buddy Holly, if not butterflied, could become the progenitors of a "white" rock and roll, similar to OTL, but one which may have far less appeal outside the South. It all depends on its competition, I think. Jazz, swing, and it's variants could be the dominant musical style in the country, probably with a lot of Russian and Latin American influence. If so, Rock and Roll will almost certainly not achieve the heights it did.
Another interesting factor in the battle for musical dominance is dance. Swing, jazz, blues, and rock and roll all have their own unique dance styles (both patterned and individual) (for examples of the latter, think about the dance hall scenes in Back to the Future and Grease), and I'd think that a population with fewer pressing financial concerns, and greater opportunity to pursue recreation would quite naturally turn to dancing as a significant pastime.
With no Great Migration, Compton won't have the same black population as OTL, butterflying hip-hop, although spoken verses over a musical track is too old and too simple an idea to not emerge. Beyond the 50s and 60s I think it becomes quite difficult to predict. Certainly, styles derived from Latin American, Eastern European, Russian, and Central Asian traditions will emerge and fuse and blend.
God, the musical wealth alone is reason enough for me to want to live ITTL.
Oh Metal better not be butterflied. 
Metal in general is cool as a genre and Power metal is my preferred form of Metal so I would not be happy.
Also I remember that somewhere back in the previous thread Jello confirmed that Punk still existed and that Rock n Roll also stilled existed. Metal from what I understand was heavily influenced by Punk in the New British Metal Wave, which was one of the main codifier of Metal along with Black Sabbath, during the late 70's and early 80's so I would hope that it would still produce Heavy Metal.
Metal in general is cool as a genre and Power metal is my preferred form of Metal so I would not be happy.Also I remember that somewhere back in the previous thread Jello confirmed that Punk still existed and that Rock n Roll also stilled existed. Metal from what I understand was heavily influenced by Punk in the New British Metal Wave, which was one of the main codifier of Metal along with Black Sabbath, during the late 70's and early 80's so I would hope that it would still produce Heavy Metal.
Oh Metal better not be butterflied.
Also I remember that somewhere back in the previous thread Jello confirmed that Punk still existed and that Rock n Roll also stilled existed. Metal from what I understand was heavily influenced by Punk in the New British Metal Wave, which was one of the main codifier of Metal along with Black Sabbath, during the late 70's and early 80's so I would hope that it would still produce Heavy Metal.
I'm sure rock and roll will exist, but I can't see it being the same with race relations being so much better TTL. Less The Who, more Fats Domino.
Will the FBU adopt the OTL Soviet route and ban rock and roll? They arguably have even more reason to (within their own internal logic). Not only is it subversive, socialist, and American, but it's also written by black people.
It's very slow, electronic, and pondrous. Pink Floyd is the main pregnoiter of the genre.
Oh Metal better not be butterflied.
Also I remember that somewhere back in the previous thread Jello confirmed that Punk still existed and that Rock n Roll also stilled existed. Metal from what I understand was heavily influenced by Punk in the New British Metal Wave, which was one of the main codifier of Metal along with Black Sabbath, during the late 70's and early 80's so I would hope that it would still produce Heavy Metal.
She specified in that particular case that "Rock'n'Roll" is combination of "Urban Folk" and Jazz, which sounds heavily like prog rock. Personally, I'd also add in the Blues and other traditionally African American music as another influence, which skewers the sound closer to 60's rock. While Joyuex has a point that perhaps it would remain a predominately African American genre, that doesn't necessarily mean it wouldn't get popular. If anything, the lack of discrimination and censorship would actually increase the popularity of the genre.
I had the idea that instead of Rock singers, many of the white progenitors of rock was instead "Electric Urban Folk" artists, merging the folk sound of the Revolutionary South with African influenced rock sensibility
I considered that, but I'm unsure about its ability to nationally proliferate to the same extent and in the same manner without mass migrations of African Americans out of the South. That said, I probably underestimated it. It probably will be a national phenomenon much like OTL.
Hmm, interesting. I'm not sure I'd enjoy Prog rock from what it sounds like though, I prefer my songs to be faster paced.
Though with your comment about it being closer to 60's rock well that still doesn't necessary butterfly the ITTL equivalent of metal. It was after all an off shoot of 60's rock from what I understand and was also far slower in the old classical Metal songs than it got later in it's history.
Note that the South is not exactly a paragon of racial harmony now. The Revolution failed to really address the systemic problems of race relations in the South, which means that, in places, the share cropper system is de facto maintained. This was one of the impetus for the "Second Cultural Revolution", which hasn't been addressed yet. So, given this, there might still be a migration to the more tolerant North and West, though not as large.
Also, one of the main things to spread rock'n'roll was the use of radio stations. While not the main purpose, it did allow the genre to spread far and wide.
I could very well see Industrial Music (like Frank Klepacki's more famous video game sound tracks) becoming very popular for obvious reasons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSQQTeFwPwc
Listen to that glory.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSQQTeFwPwc
Listen to that glory.
It was mentioned earlier that there was not two shared universes, and comic universes tend to either part of a large sandbox with a committee in charge, or they run around in their own separate universes. Given this, I suspect that the result would be a combination of the two. Sometimes heroes interact in the same universe, sometimes they exist in different universes. Take for example Marvel Comics, which has been discussed several times in this thread before. I suspect that the Universe would be split into two or three worlds. One with JLA, the other dealing with the Mutants. (Possibly one to deal with the Fantastic Four). They are separate Universes, yes, but otherwise, there is a large sandbox to deal with.
Any thoughts?
Any thoughts?
E. Burke
Banned
My guess is that it becomes more like, say the Lovecraft mythos. There's a shared pool of characters, themes and ideas but no overarching universe beyond that which individual writers choose to create. IMHO comic book style continuity is only possible when a single company owns the rights to characters. While patents for inventions are a thing in the UASR I doubt that they exist for literary works, and if they do they can't be endlessly renewed and the enforcement mechanisms won't be as intense.
Has the Great Migration been butterflied away ? I know the revolution occurs in the 30's but that was well into Great Migration.
Hip hop started in the Bronx so I don't think the lack of a heavy black population in Compton will completley butterfly away hip hop though we might not see Gangster Rap emerge in the same form. I'm not to sure about the demographics of the Bronx ITTL but its not impossible for hip hop to emerge.
Also whats the status of Carribean and African music ITTL ?
I'm in a bit of an Oscar mood. However, rather than rip-off Jello's previous Oscars fake thread from the last thread,I'll just add the 2016 Best Pictures brief descriptions of them. (I'd do Actors, but I can't think of anyone.
The Best Picture Nominations for the 88th Academy Awards:
Liberation- Follows the story of Harry Haywood, controversial African revolutionary, during the Revolution and First Cultural Revolution as he fights for African self determination and clashes with the revolutionary establishment. Very balanced depiction, showing both his promotion of African rights, and his participation in the Red Terror. Favored contender
Across the Pond- A romance film, where an American exchange student falls in love with a British student, and the conflicts that arise, because of the Cold War. Generally disliked among, well, everyone, but nominated for whatever reason.
Universe- Based off the 2003 novel of author and prominent Californian SEU politician Kim Stanley Robinson, follows the journey of a young girl through the Solar system, which has now been mostly terraformed, particularly Mars, Venus, Mercury, Europa, and Triton. Acclaimed, but token Science fiction entry.
The Adventures of the Escapist- Based off the 2000 novel by Michael Chabon, follows two Jewish cousins in New York during the First Cultural Revolution, as they establish their own comic collective, and write up the stories of the superhero "The Escapist", intertwined with the Nazi invasion of Czechoslovakia and later, the USSR, as well as the post-war comic controversies. (Based off a favorite novel of mine)
Stories of the River- Tells the real life story of a team from National Geographic, who try to document the plight of the Gorillas in the Kongo during the 60's and 70's Kongo Wars.
Revolution Street: An coming of age anime film, featuring a teenage writer during early 60's Japan, as political changes continue sweep the nation.
--------------
Yeah, I only did six, but it's hard to come up with good film ideas. Anyone have any suggestion for another 4 films?
The Best Picture Nominations for the 88th Academy Awards:
Liberation- Follows the story of Harry Haywood, controversial African revolutionary, during the Revolution and First Cultural Revolution as he fights for African self determination and clashes with the revolutionary establishment. Very balanced depiction, showing both his promotion of African rights, and his participation in the Red Terror. Favored contender
Across the Pond- A romance film, where an American exchange student falls in love with a British student, and the conflicts that arise, because of the Cold War. Generally disliked among, well, everyone, but nominated for whatever reason.
Universe- Based off the 2003 novel of author and prominent Californian SEU politician Kim Stanley Robinson, follows the journey of a young girl through the Solar system, which has now been mostly terraformed, particularly Mars, Venus, Mercury, Europa, and Triton. Acclaimed, but token Science fiction entry.
The Adventures of the Escapist- Based off the 2000 novel by Michael Chabon, follows two Jewish cousins in New York during the First Cultural Revolution, as they establish their own comic collective, and write up the stories of the superhero "The Escapist", intertwined with the Nazi invasion of Czechoslovakia and later, the USSR, as well as the post-war comic controversies. (Based off a favorite novel of mine)
Stories of the River- Tells the real life story of a team from National Geographic, who try to document the plight of the Gorillas in the Kongo during the 60's and 70's Kongo Wars.
Revolution Street: An coming of age anime film, featuring a teenage writer during early 60's Japan, as political changes continue sweep the nation.
--------------
Yeah, I only did six, but it's hard to come up with good film ideas. Anyone have any suggestion for another 4 films?
Rise & Revolt: Blue Alert 2 installation process
Initializing, please stand by.
Current security clearance is invalid, shutting down.
Personal authorization by first secretary of the Union of American Socialist Republics to upgrade current terminal to Alpha-6 clearance. Oath of secrecy is required to proceed.
Encryption code required, you have thirty seconds to comply.
Clearance code incorrect.
Beginning military trace.
Tracing...
Terminal located.
Special forces extraction team scrambled.
ETA to hostile terminal, 5 minutes.
Enter CD-Key to avoid immediate liquidation.
Security clearance complete, customize combat software commander.
*Directory designation stuff goes here*
Combat software fully customized, proceed to military intelligence emergency briefing.
*Shows a picture of Albert Einstein*
Initializing:
Theater data.
In 1947 Albert Einstein used his Chronosphere to go back in time, and forever alter history.
UASR geographic data
*A picture of Mosley signing some papers is shown*
Einstein's good intentions however, upset the delicate balance of world power; allowing Oswald Mosley to lead Imperialist Britain and his Alliance in a massive invasion of eastern Europe, China, and the Americas.
*A picture of Alliance advance in Europe is shown, with Comintern forces in retreat*
European geographic data
*Picture shows Alliance heavy tanks rampaging in Russia*
Initially the Alliance invasion was successful, and soon it appeared that the spirit of the revolution would be forever crushed.
*Picture shows Comintern medium tanks in parade formation in London*
Asian geographic data
But the Communist International rallied, smashing the capitalist war machine.
African geographic data
*A picture of Jack Stewart is shown, mugging it for the Camera as he leans on his desk, clad in an Alliance military uniform*
With Mosley's defeat, this man; Jack Stewart, came to power with the blessing of Comintern command.
*The picture shows him at a podium, arms spread while he wears a peaked cap, eyes closed as he speaks*
Pacific geographic data
Although an aristocrat, and a member of the Alliance party; Stewart was an advocate of peace.
*Picture now shows a world map with seven red dots, one in Canada, one in France, one in Japan, one in India, one in Mozambique, one in Brazil one in Scotland, and one in Hashemite Arabia, with a cutaway zoom in focusing on the one in Canada, a night vision image next to a picture zooming in on an Alliance war factory*
Central American geographic data
Current satellite intelligence indicates that Stewart may not be acting in good faith.
South American geographic data
*A picture is shown, displaying Alliance battleships, aircraft carriers, and cruisers being spotted by binoculars as they move fast enough to produce noticeable wakes*
Alliance fleets have been spotted moving at high speeds into the Atlantic.
Combat simulator
*A picture is shown of a bald man with a goattee with a hebrew symbol on his forehead and a metal device attached to his skull played by Udo Kier is shown*
This man, known only as Geoffrey, may be responsible for shutting down our entire covert intelligence network in the Alliance of Free States.
Simulator diagnostic
Spy satellite uplink
*A picture is shown of Geoffrey, clasping his hands and leaning towards the Camera while Stewart stands tall and firm with his hands behind his back.*
Ever since Geoffrey became Stewart's chief advisor, relations with the Alliance of Free States have deteriorated. Most of our agents have gone missing, some have been seen collaborating with MI6 operatives.
*The screen goes black*
We need to prepare for the worst commander, war with the Alliance.
*The screen now says "Top secret weapon profiles"*
The following are technical specs on current battlefield weapons, observe carefully commander, you may need to command some of these units in combat
*What follows is a slideshow of Blue Alert 2 units*
Initializing, please stand by.
Current security clearance is invalid, shutting down.
Personal authorization by first secretary of the Union of American Socialist Republics to upgrade current terminal to Alpha-6 clearance. Oath of secrecy is required to proceed.
Encryption code required, you have thirty seconds to comply.
Clearance code incorrect.
Beginning military trace.
Tracing...
Terminal located.
Special forces extraction team scrambled.
ETA to hostile terminal, 5 minutes.
Enter CD-Key to avoid immediate liquidation.
Security clearance complete, customize combat software commander.
*Directory designation stuff goes here*
Combat software fully customized, proceed to military intelligence emergency briefing.
*Shows a picture of Albert Einstein*
Initializing:
Theater data.
In 1947 Albert Einstein used his Chronosphere to go back in time, and forever alter history.
UASR geographic data
*A picture of Mosley signing some papers is shown*
Einstein's good intentions however, upset the delicate balance of world power; allowing Oswald Mosley to lead Imperialist Britain and his Alliance in a massive invasion of eastern Europe, China, and the Americas.
*A picture of Alliance advance in Europe is shown, with Comintern forces in retreat*
European geographic data
*Picture shows Alliance heavy tanks rampaging in Russia*
Initially the Alliance invasion was successful, and soon it appeared that the spirit of the revolution would be forever crushed.
*Picture shows Comintern medium tanks in parade formation in London*
Asian geographic data
But the Communist International rallied, smashing the capitalist war machine.
African geographic data
*A picture of Jack Stewart is shown, mugging it for the Camera as he leans on his desk, clad in an Alliance military uniform*
With Mosley's defeat, this man; Jack Stewart, came to power with the blessing of Comintern command.
*The picture shows him at a podium, arms spread while he wears a peaked cap, eyes closed as he speaks*
Pacific geographic data
Although an aristocrat, and a member of the Alliance party; Stewart was an advocate of peace.
*Picture now shows a world map with seven red dots, one in Canada, one in France, one in Japan, one in India, one in Mozambique, one in Brazil one in Scotland, and one in Hashemite Arabia, with a cutaway zoom in focusing on the one in Canada, a night vision image next to a picture zooming in on an Alliance war factory*
Central American geographic data
Current satellite intelligence indicates that Stewart may not be acting in good faith.
South American geographic data
*A picture is shown, displaying Alliance battleships, aircraft carriers, and cruisers being spotted by binoculars as they move fast enough to produce noticeable wakes*
Alliance fleets have been spotted moving at high speeds into the Atlantic.
Combat simulator
*A picture is shown of a bald man with a goattee with a hebrew symbol on his forehead and a metal device attached to his skull played by Udo Kier is shown*
This man, known only as Geoffrey, may be responsible for shutting down our entire covert intelligence network in the Alliance of Free States.
Simulator diagnostic
Spy satellite uplink
*A picture is shown of Geoffrey, clasping his hands and leaning towards the Camera while Stewart stands tall and firm with his hands behind his back.*
Ever since Geoffrey became Stewart's chief advisor, relations with the Alliance of Free States have deteriorated. Most of our agents have gone missing, some have been seen collaborating with MI6 operatives.
*The screen goes black*
We need to prepare for the worst commander, war with the Alliance.
*The screen now says "Top secret weapon profiles"*
The following are technical specs on current battlefield weapons, observe carefully commander, you may need to command some of these units in combat
*What follows is a slideshow of Blue Alert 2 units*
bookmark95
Banned
An Ocean and a Heart Apart (2015)
A comedy-thriller produced by Burbank Movie Collective and directed by Rob Reiner.
Set during the thaw of the mid-1990s [1], a teenager joins the Transatlantic Student Exchange, and goes abroad to live in a small English village. The city-bred young man struggles to adapt to life in a quiet town, a reactionary British family, and the peculiar older daughter. But before long, the young man discovers that he is pawn in a much bigger conspiracy, and may need the help of the villagers to keep his head above water.
Aside from the excellent action and comedy, the film was notable among many "thaw" films for having a socialist protagonist who was not able to convert outsiders to socialist ideology, but in fact was forced to adapt to the ideology of his contemporaries, and reflected the difficulty of many exchange students in adapting to difficult circumstances.
The film was critically praised for its humor, action, and political themes.
[1] While the Cold War may not end, I imagine by this point that the FBU and UASR tolerated each other enough to allow cultural exchange.
A comedy-thriller produced by Burbank Movie Collective and directed by Rob Reiner.
Set during the thaw of the mid-1990s [1], a teenager joins the Transatlantic Student Exchange, and goes abroad to live in a small English village. The city-bred young man struggles to adapt to life in a quiet town, a reactionary British family, and the peculiar older daughter. But before long, the young man discovers that he is pawn in a much bigger conspiracy, and may need the help of the villagers to keep his head above water.
Aside from the excellent action and comedy, the film was notable among many "thaw" films for having a socialist protagonist who was not able to convert outsiders to socialist ideology, but in fact was forced to adapt to the ideology of his contemporaries, and reflected the difficulty of many exchange students in adapting to difficult circumstances.
The film was critically praised for its humor, action, and political themes.
[1] While the Cold War may not end, I imagine by this point that the FBU and UASR tolerated each other enough to allow cultural exchange.
To continue the music discussion, I expect sounds like two tone ska and the clashes more jazz influenced stuff to be popular in the UASR. Stuff with heave Caribbean or Latin influence in general. Similarly, I'd expect a widespread battle ground of the Cold War to influence music by virtue of refugee populations. So Brazilian slum music could really catch on.