Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by E. Burke, Jan 17, 2015.
Son... Let me tell you exactly how you were born....
Straight and without analogies !!!!! Tin!
In general, there is a special literature on this subject .... and then it is recommended to press, and there they tell about it not so ... clearly ...
If you believe the Russian-language Internet, that is, the book that begins like this - "I hugged your mother tightly, kissed her tightly and did not let me out of my embrace for a long time." It was so quiet that we heard our hearts beating loudly .. "," A tiny part of me has penetrated my mother, not even a piece, but all of me, only reduced a million times ... ".
To want! Only the book of 1991 year edition ....
What - the boys also think about the opportunity to have a family!
HAHAHAHAHA! You guys are hilarious!
RSRs family are an accurate depiction of how I'm going to treat my children.
It is well enough to account for these spectacular high profile examples in this opportunistic way, but it is also clear that at least a few vital figures did more than trim their sails to a shifting wind, or even shift incrementally leftward. The ATL Great War experience radicalized Patton and Eisenhower, for instance, and possibly Harry Truman as well (he seems more of an incremental shift though). They did more than become less right-wing; Patton leapfrogged right over Ike's relative moderation to become a key figure in the most radical wing of the Debs-DeLeonist movement.
I deny the "horseshoe theory" that radicals are essentially identical on both extremes of politics, but it is perfectly clear that some people are of a horseshoe sort of mentality; they are not comfortable in a middling position; they want sharp moral clarity and forthright positions for action. Patton is clearly such a person. I believe my grandfather might have been one too.
In addition to radical flips of a few people driving revolution rather than being driven by it, we also require, for the Reds scenario to exist, that large masses of American citizens wind up substantially to the left of their OTL positions, before the success of the 1934 revolution makes it a bandwagon that trimmers are going to flock to get onto. Now my grandfather would have been rather young to be a vanguard figure, but I do think that he'd veer sharply one way or the other--either adhere to his OTL conservatism, all the more strongly due to the greater radicalism of the mainstream, or he'd flip and admire and follow the vanguard in his own day. One or the other; I don't see him drifting to wind up relatively in the same relationship to the center as OTL. As Patton goes, so goes he I suppose.
So it is an open question whether the mass shift in American public sentiment is generally a matter of individuals drifting leftward to wind up left of their OTL positions generally, but in the same relative distribution more or less, versus individuals quantum-jumping from a pretty far right position to a far left one.
I think Jello's canon has given us concrete examples of both phenomena in different people, depending on their personalities and peculiar personal situations.
But it makes no sense at all to attribute all shifts due to a drift, because the question comes up, who leads the shift? Some people have got to make radical leaps relative to OTL, in order for the Revolution to be popular enough to win victory. And note that the character of the revolutionary regime is quite different from say the Bolshevik takeover. In Russia, it was not enough for the Bolsheviks to win in "October;" they had to then enforce a rather ruthless conformity to retain leadership and without that, surely the radical regime would have been overthrown. The Debs-DeLeonists were a minority, though a large one but had sufficient confidence in the basic radicalism of the US masses, or anyway a decisive number of them, that they tolerated internal party dissension and a multi-party system that did not require absolute commitment to communism among all legitimate parties, just a commitment not to reverse the gains the people won in '34. They were confident that despite dissent and debate, the revolution had mass grassroots majority support and would not be reversed even if reactionaries were given considerable latitude to criticize and even act within legal limits to demonstrate their dissent.
This is both a deep and broad shift in American public consciousness, and it cannot be accounted for by mere drift. To get a critical mass of radical leadership to pull public opinion this far left, a very large number of people had to make leaps to perspectives that have examples and precedents in OTL US history but not in numbers sufficient to account for the ATL outcome. Objective conditions help account for this shift, or anyway ATL decisions by elites that probably weren't the wisest that seemed open to them. With large numbers of people making large radical flips versus OTL, other large masses might drift in their direction, and then stampede that way with visible success of the revolution.
But someone has to lead first. OTL leaders account for some of it but alone could not do it without some converts.
I propose my grandfather might have been a later-generation convert versus OTL. And that otherwise, my family would be erased from history if he and my grandmother had not made a radical shift.
RSR? By the way - first you have to endure them ...
I might live in Mumbai, since, despite both my parents being Southerners, both lived in that area at some point in time. That of course, is dependent on whether they'd actually meet. Like I said, they meet, when my mother's family sent out a newspaper ad for an arranged marriage, and my Dad's family responded. My parents were both from Tamil Nadu and are Brahmins, but they spoke two different mother languages.
Fair and Public: The Martin Fosher Story
A true crime documentary directed by Richard Stephenson, and released in 2015. Stephenson was inspired by the online reaction to recent popular Franco-British true crime documentaries in America, which focused on dubious murder convictions, claiming that false convictions displayed in those could never happen in the socialist democracy of America. Stephenson was familiar with Fosher, due to the latter's interview in Stephenson's previous documentary The Red Terror (where Fosher described the extralegal measures taken against members of counterrevolutionary groups like Sons of Liberty during the 30's). He discussed with Fosher making an American documentary on his false conviction, and Fosher agreed. Stephenson hoped to avoid the controversy surrounding the Franco-British documentaries that focused on ongoing cases.
Martin James "Marty" Fosher was born in 1946 in Los Angeles. His father was killed serving in the Pacific during World War II, leaving his mother to raise Martin until her own death when he was 8. He was then raised in the Culbert Olson Children's Crèche. Whilst he described the caretakers there as good, he was simply distant from them, and they couldn't help him bond with the other children there. He began to sneak out, and interact with seedier parts of the LA commune. He served a single year in the militia without distinction. By age 19, he was living in a single dwelling, where he sold legal soft drugs and pornography. He rarely ever participated in social life.
His 1966 assault charge was discussed in detail. Fosher was at a bar, and began to flirt with a girl sitting next to him, Deborah Falk. Her brother Dan became protective of her, and hit Marty's face with a bottle. This began a bar fight, and Fosher, having been one of the fighters, was among those arrested. Fosher was left with a large distinct scar on his left cheek. He went through 6 months of mandatory service and rehabilitative services. (Dan and Marty were able to bury the hatchet, and both Deborah and Dan spoke at his trial in his defense).
After his service, he sold off his remaining stock, bought a motorcycle and headed east. During the late 60's, he went through the Southwest, buying and selling goods from town to town. Fosher said he had little direction in his life at this point. He simply drifted from place to place, and his deals weren't even for survival, just to satiate boredom. In 1971, He ended up in Haywood City, where he set up shop for several months. Fosher said that he had only tangentially had heard of the disappearances and murders that were occurring across the city at the time. It had started before he had entered the city in 1968. He then moved down to the Navajo ASR, where he decided to gain more purpose in life. While continuing to buy and sell, he also worked delivery for several Navajo shops.
Little did Fosher realize that a series of murders similar to the ones in Haywood City were also happening around the Navajo ASR. The killer (who also murdered several in Nevada ,Colorado, and Arizona) was dubbed the "Colorado River Killer", due to the states involved. Local Navajo militias investigating learned of a strange traveler with a scar was in the proximity of some of the murder sites (not very close, but somewhat close), and it matched vague descriptions of the killer by survivors in Haywood City (which were done in the dark). The Navajo militia matched it to Fosher, and after learning that Fosher was in several of those states around the time of the murders (though several miles away, and sometimes months before the women were even reported missing).
With this rather tenuous evidence, Fosher was arrested in 1975 on multiple manslaughter charges. Fosher describes his shock at this turn of events, and films of the event show him profusely stating his innocence. He was transferred to the Union Tribunal Court in Haywood City. While the defense vigorously pointed out the various flaws with the charges, the prosecution was able to use the jury's own biases. Fosher's anti-social tendency was emphasized, as was the lack of participation in the system. His assault charge was brought up as an indication of his "violent tendencies."
This factors made Fosher fit into the mold of serial killers that many people in America held at the time, going back to the persecution of Albert Fish in 1934. The Jury ultimately came back with a guilty verdict. Fosher was sentenced to death by the Tribunal. Fosher noted that during the trial, several other women went missing.
At first, it seemed a victory of the socialist justice system... until another woman was found dead in train tracks in Provo. Another was discovered in an agricultural collective near Haywood City. It became clear that the real killer was still out there. Fosher noted the injustice of his sentence was short lived, as the appeal overturned his conviction in 1976, fairly quickly.
The case was eventually taken over by the CSS, who managed to locate the real killer, a well-respected union leader and minor political player Herbert Koehler, in 1978. Koehler immediately confessed as he was taken in, and was sentenced to death (which was carried out in 1981).
Fosher, for his part, examined his situation, and realized that there could potentially be victims like him, falsely accused for crimes. He decided to act to ensure it would not happen again. He cleaned up his act, sold his motorcycle, and went back to California. He finally went to a university, and eventually to law school. He became a public defender, particularly for those whose charges were spurious at best. He joined the Innocence Project, and became a legal personality on TV. He co-wrote a book discussing the Red Terror from a legal perspective, describing the violations of due process during the era.
I must admit to being a bit of a puritan by nature, so suffice it to say I personally would not raise my children in that manner.
I wanted to dissect the term "Red Turn," and also explore how the ideological leanings of ITTL America could negatively affect scientific research.
The Testy Origins of the term "Red Turn", and How It Set Back Autism Research By Decades
March 17, 2012
The term Red Turn has long entered the American and British lexicon. To say someone has "turned Red" is to say they've embraced revolutionary socialism. Canadians also use it to describe their nation's unexpected exit from the British Commonwealth and entry into Comintern, calling it "The Red Turn"
However, when the expression first emerged, it developed negative connotations due to the politics of the era, which would have a detrimental effect on psychiatric research.
The origin of the term came from the infamous Eisenstadt Paper, written by pediatrician and medical theorist, as well as one of the first psychological researchers, Hans Asperger.
Born in 1906 in the Austria-Hungary, Hans Asperger came from a lonely but cultured background, as did many of his young patients. By the time of the Nazis' seizure of power in Germany in 1933, Asperger had received a degree in medicine from the University of Vienna and was managing the university's children's clinic.
When the annexation of Austria occurred in 1938, Asperger was already beginning his research that would lay the groundwork for the study of the autistic spectrum. With Austria's absorption into the Nazi Reich, doctors across Austria were forced to pay lip service to Nazi ideology. Many medical professionals in Austria would adopt the Nazi's twisted methods, including Asperger's employer Franz Hamburger. Many of the worst crimes of Aktion T4, the Nazi child euthanasia program, had been committed in Austria. The extent to which Asperger collaborated with Nazism, and how Nazi pseudoscience may have influenced his research has remained a source of controversy and would prove detrimental to his career. despite him never officially joining the party.
The black hole surrounding the extent of his beliefs would prove to his initial advantage with the destruction of the Reich. Unlike many of his colleagues, who would face prison time and blacklisting during the Comintern occupation, Asperger's lack of political ties spared him persecution by Soviet authorities. He was eventually recruited to work as a pediatrician at a refugee camp in the East Austrian city of Eisenstadt in 1947.
By that point, Asperger had already identified the symptoms of what would become Asperger's Syndrome, what he called "autistic psychopathy", publishing them in his seminal work Autistic Psychopathy in Childhood in 1944. While studying children in Eisenstadt, Asperger became keenly interested in the effects of socialist education on their psyche.
Comintern occupation authorities had pushed a strict policy of de-Nazification for children, called de-progamming by today's vernacular. The program was motivated by one of the final depravities of the war, the use by the Nazi Reich of child soldiers, as well as the motive of ensuring the longevity of the worker's states.
Refugee camps became the centers of the policy. Children who had been raised to worship the Fuhrer were given a crash course in Socialist education, as well exposed to photos detailing the graphic crimes of the Nazis.
While working at the Eisenstadt camp, Asperger was astonished to see children who once said "Heil Hitler" suddenly giving praise to the proletariat within months of entering the camp. He wrote his findings in the work Die Kinder von Eisenstadt (The Children of Eisenstadt) in 1948. There, he dubbed the sudden transformation of Austrian children from loyal fascists to loyal socialists as "Rote Veranderung", roughly meaning "red change".
But as post-war relations between the two blocs worsened, the thesis of the Eisenstadt Paper would soon be lost, as both sides began a brutal mudslinging campaign. Conservative political forces in England used the Paper for scare tactics, using sections in which Asperger compared Socialist education to Nazi indoctrination, to convince British families of "Red Brainwashing". British tabloids ultimately created the term "Red Turn" to portray socialism as a devious cult ready to turn innocent youth into "Red Warriors".
These mudslingers pointedly ignored sections of the Eisenstadt Paper,where Asperger observed how the kind treatment camp authorities had given the children proved to be more effective than the Nazis more ruthless methods at indoctrination, as many of them had been taught by Nazi authorities that "Bolshevik hordes" would seek their doom.
But these propaganda tactics hurt Asperger's reputation among Comintern, who in the paranoid political atmosphere, believed he had deliberately attacked Socialist authorities. A covert propaganda campaign was launched by Soviet authorities, who tried to slander Asperger with truly inflammatory charges, with one of the worse accusations being that he murdered feeble children by stuffing poison into their mouths.
While Asperger avoided any of these charges, these accusations would damage his reputation, as the crimes of Mengele gave rise to the stereotype of Teutonic doctors being sociopathic murderers. Asperger would be barred from any public university, and died in relative obscurity in 1980, his work largely blacklisted by both blocs.
By the 1990s, the research into autism would posthumously revive Asperger's reputation, his name becoming the namesake of the disorders he studied, and in 2002, the Soviet Union would issue a public apology for their political tactics against Asperger.
Asperger's story must be remembered a cautionary tale about how innocent people can find themselves pawns of a political games, and how their effects can harm not only people, but their ability to contribute to progress.
The Camera (2010)
The Stuffed Giraffe is a 2007 film, directed by Barry Levinson.
Set in 1963, it centers around Michael Li (Jordan Nagai), a young autistic child who struggles to fit in amongst his peers. Labeled an outcast by his peers and his teachers for his refusal to participate in community events and his horrible temper tantrums, a psychiatrist (Edward Norton) tries to help the child become more open while nurturing his interest in photography.
I was thinking about it - Anti-Japan is connected with Japanese Imperialism and the Vietnam War. Can there be no prerequisites for it after the revolution?
One more thing - Traditional Japanese Culture is strictly hierarchical, characterized by a high degree of estrangement between people. The person of Japanese society traditionally does not belong to himself, but to those who gave birth to him, or to whom he swore an oath of loyalty. Hence the rejection of any actions that go against this principle or are simply superfluous. All this leads to strict regulation of the way of life and groveling before the authorities: the employees do not go home before the chief, each employee must deal strictly only with his own business, and the initiative can be shown only in the process of career growth, which is rather tightly tied to the work experience. I suppose that the Revolution will be a real breakdown of the norms of behavior of the Japanese (and yes, one must understand that culture is a superstructure that depends on the basis). Perhaps some of the Japanese habits will be the backbone for collectivism.
You make an interesting observation: Japanese society is going to struggle to move from transition from this culture of hierarchy and servitude to a culture of collectivism and democratic self-management.
While this may also add to Japan's postwar aggravations, in the long term, it will be a very good thing. Maybe Japanese people don't have to suffer from karoshi. Maybe they can have the time to raise their babies, and the time to make them, thus preventing Japan's current population death spiral.
We Russians had to go through something similar with the Bolsheviks. Fortunately, social being determines social consciousness, and this already determines us.
Guys .... Comrades! I found something, maybe you heard about it but ....
It makes me cry!
Commonslang.com-The Dictionary of Politics
n. A somewhat pejorative term used to describe a person from a Comintern country or Comintern-descended person who immigrates to a capitalist nation and achieves economic success, while professing or practicing a communist lifestyle.
The term was coined by Larry Lamb, the controversial editor of the acclaimed British tabloid The Sun during the 1970s. Larry Lamb was known for his reactionary viewpoints, which he expressed through colorful and sharp-tongued invective . In a declassified memo in 1983, Section 9 agents were revealed to have put Lamb on an "enemy of the people" list, to which Lamb quipped ,"even their assassination strategies are clogged with bureaucracy".
Lamb used the term in a 1975 article about the arrest of Michael Stanley, a 38 year old American defector to the Franco-British Union for polygamy, then a felony (although he was eventually acquitted). Stanley, a Boston born engineer, had immigrated to the FBU in the 1967, lured by promises of great riches. By 1975, he had managed to build a successful aerospace company, Stanley Airspace in Birmingham, building airplane engine parts, and his company was valued at 5,000,000 pounds or 33,000,000 pounds in today's money.
Despite living a lavish lifestyle, Stanley was known for his incredible generosity toward his employees, giving them benefits he had enjoyed in the UASR, such as public housing, free meals, and college tuition, which contributed to his popularity and acquittal. This distinguished him from other American expatriates and their descendants who largely came from the old money of capitalist America, and were known for their traditionally exploitative business practices. It also challenged the myth of Americans rendered feeble by the effects of capitalism, which was common throughout the capitalist bloc.
However his arrest for free-love earned him the scorn of conservative British establishment, including Larry Lamb, who called him "a red cap, a man who seeks the wealth of her majesty, but lives with the decency of a Irish whore, or an American schoolgirl, who are often one and the same".
The far-left in America was no less sympathetic toward Stanley, with some calling him a "bourgeois turncoat", or "a fool who tried to play the bourgeois game", and also adopted the term "Red Cap" to describe him, making it a rare idiom that found popularity on both sides of the Atlantic.
When counting American and American descendants throughout the FBU born after 1933, the number is estimated to be 250,000. According to statistics, Americans have an average median wealth of 193,000 pounds, second behind the Indian diaspora. Many of them are college graduates and thus can work highly skilled and entrepreneurial jobs.
Many are politically left-wing despite their upper class lifestyle, many of them joining the Communist Party. Businesses run by Americans often provide excellent employee benefits, are often staunch advocates of social reform.
Their political activism is not without controversy, with hardcore leftists and hardcore rightists often calling them hypocrites, either for their willingness to participate in capitalism, or for their desire to live as libertines in a socially reactionary country.
I was messing around with the Paragon Chat (RIP city of heroes) character creator; figured this was decently close to my vision of Columbia (though her hair does flow out of her helmet) City of heroes never released one handed spears before NCsoft's corporate shenanigans closed it down so I had to make do with a sword.
And as Amanda Aaron
Whereas Red and Black are colours that we OTL associate with villains and edgelords; I imagine that in this timeline it'd be seen as a much less threatening colour combination in America at least.
Was it 4 or 6? Do I have the icon "missing image"? By the way - it's much better than "Captain America".
Although I removed, would Bust - I do not understand how it turns out that in the comics it is always visible outlines under the armor?...
Oh I just accidentally uploaded the imgur link instead of the imgur file sometimes. Not sure how to get rid of the Xes, but those are all the images.
Separate names with a comma.