Radical Republicans go ahead with "State Suicide" theory- what does the new Southern map look like?

Byz

During the American Civil War, some Radical Republicans, Charles Sumner being prominent among them, proposed that the States of the CSA, by seceding, had essentially "committed suicide" and could now be governed- and redrawn- as territories. This was generally proposed as a way to abolish slavery without a new amendment. The idea never had much support outside of radical Republicans, and OTL did not really come close to passing into law.

But let's say the Civil War gets more radical, events change, and for one reason or another the Northern Congress is now willing to go along with this idea. They still win the war, and afterwards they now have a bunch of territories in the former Southern United States to redraw as they like. Obviously, they are going to redraw them in their political favor, as free states. They're also going to attempt to gerrymander to be as pro-Republican as possible, probably making a few African-American majority and Appalachian states and then lumping the rest of the South into 1-2 big states that are overwhelmingly full of former secessionists.

What would this map actually look like? How could Republicans draw things up to make as many states out of the Black Belt as possible, while also creating zones in Appalachia that they can at least compete in?
 

The Tai-Pan

It is hard to imagine getting large-scale buy-in for this process. Who is the president in this scenario? There is virtually no precedent for tearing states up except for West Virginia (which, admittedly, happened under similar circumstances). I think the most you can hope for is some minor adjustments and maybe an East/West Tennessee?
 

Strategos' Risk

Eh, maybe something like Lincoln's battlefront assassination in Turtledove's "Must and Shall" happens, and the enraged Union decides to tear Southern society limb from limb and treat it as occupied territory.

Granted, you have to somehow pair this with a war where the North wins more quickly doesn't feel as exhausted in the end, having the gumption to continue with a more vigorous occupation.

But yeah, in some ways this is more interesting than "what if they just hanged Lee and Davis and all the traitors", because it's "what if we devolve these states into territories."
 

Byz

The Tai-Pan said:
It is hard to imagine getting large-scale buy-in for this process. Who is the president in this scenario? There is virtually no precedent for tearing states up except for West Virginia (which, admittedly, happened under similar circumstances). I think the most you can hope for is some minor adjustments and maybe an East/West Tennessee?
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Perhaps as a start Lincoln is assassinated by a fire eater shortly after entering office? This puts Hannibal Hamlin (or, if you'd prefer with an earlier PoD, Cassius Clay) in charge, and sets the US on a more radical path early on.
 

Analytical Engine

Areas that voted against secession might be given statehood, like East Tennessee or north Alabama.

Secession_Vote_by_CountyA.0.jpg


Maybe Texas is split in two (Jefferson and Lincoln etc.).
 

Ephraim Ben Raphael

Banned
To supplement the map in the above post, here's a map of slave populations in the South (not showing free blacks);

1592600322545.png


Mississippi, Louisiana, and South Carolina are already black majority. Northern Alabama and Georgia (where whites voted against secession) might make for a state, while central Alabama and Georgia could be combined to form a new black majority state. Southern Alabama and Georgia could be combined with Florida as a way to put a maximum number of of anti-union whites in one state.
 
Basileus282

Basileus282

image0.png

I guess from what others have said this would be the result. Maybe Appalachia (the Northern one) and Franklin?
 
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Marc

Marc

Donor
A point to consider: any reconfiguration of the Southern States should not end up with more states than previously. Perhaps deliberately less, as a final hammering point.
 

Byz

Exvio74 said:
image0.png

I guess from what others have said this would be the result. Maybe Appalachia (the Northern one) and Franklin?
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Not bad. Now combine North Carolina and Virginia to screw them in the Senate,cut off a little of SC to join that state to ensure a black majority, create two states out of the black belt, and combine the rest into two other "secessionist majority" states. Like so (apologies for the ugliness):
State Suicide.png

Maybe combining West Carolina and Franklin and/or Sherman and Lincoln, maybe not. But that's 3 black-majority states, 2 Unionist Appalachian states, and 4 "Secessionist" states where once there were 11 seceding states.

Of course, the background to make such a harsh reconstruction as to tear apart southern borders would have to be quite intense.
 
Born in the USSA

Born in the USSA

TheByzantineOttoman said:
Not bad. Now combine North Carolina and Virginia to screw them in the Senate,cut off a little of SC to join that state to ensure a black majority, create two states out of the black belt, and combine the rest into two other "secessionist majority" states. Like so (apologies for the ugliness):
View attachment 558571
Maybe combining West Carolina and Franklin and/or Sherman and Lincoln, maybe not. But that's 3 black-majority states, 2 Unionist Appalachian states, and 4 "Secessionist" states where once there were 11 seceding states.

Of course, the background to make such a harsh reconstruction as to tear apart southern borders would have to be quite intense.
Click to expand...
With your map wouldn't renaming SC "East Carolina" make more sense than leaving it as is? I think West Virginia would also deserve a new name, while we're at it.
 
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