Racism in the USSR

[Awilla the Hun]

Having read this article in the Guardian-how were race relations in the Soviet Union? This appears to paint a very positive picture.

http://www.theguardian.com/artandde...ed-on-us-discrimination-in-pictures?CMP=fb_gu

 

[BeardedHoplite]

I believe the Politburo's number one concern from the 70s on was the "yellowing" of the army, so probably not as glamorous as the article suggests.

 

[overoceans]

The "Under Socialism" picture on that anti-lynching poster looks like something out of a Jehovah's Witness publication.

And, it's odd, given the theme, that none of the people shown in the march appear to be black.

 

[overoceans]

I believe the Politburo's number one concern from the 70s on was the "yellowing" of the army, so probably not as glamorous as the article suggests.

In fairness to the Soviets, on the global scene, they did tend to support those sections of Communism which were the most consistently anti-racist(the CPUSA, the South African Communist Party, etc).

As opposed to China, which backed the hyper-xenophobic Khmer Rouge, and was even seen for a while fighting on the same side as apartheid South Africa during the Angolan conflict.

North Korea might have been an exception on the Soviet side, since they preached a volkisch racial ideology imported (via the Japanese colonialists) from the same European theorists who inspired certain other racial ideologues.

 

[Joyeux]

Having read this article in the Guardian-how were race relations in the Soviet Union? This appears to paint a very positive picture.

http://www.theguardian.com/artandde...ed-on-us-discrimination-in-pictures?CMP=fb_gu

With regards to race and ethnicity, it varied depending on the leadership. Certainly Soviet citizens didn't have different seating and eating arrangements depending on their race, but you couldn't really advance, politically, unless you spoke Russian, and there wasn't much state support for other linguistic groups and their cultural development throughout the Stalin-Khrushchev-Brezhnev period.

 

[Plumber]

Machiavellian embrace of anti-racism doesn't change the fact that the USSR was the last European colonial empire whose leadership held such views of China in particular that they make Trump seem tolerant.

 

[overoceans]

Machiavellian embrace of anti-racism doesn't change the fact that the USSR was the last European colonial empire whose leadership held such views of China in particular that they make Trump seem tolerant.

Care to expand?

 

[Minchandre]

Care to expand?

The Soviet Union was very loud about supporting racial equality, both under general principles (the Revolution cares not what your race or religion is, for we are all equal men struggling together!), and also under realpolitik of currying favor among the former European colonies, who already had reason to dislike the USSR's enemies.

Race relations were, of course, not so equal within the USSR itself, where ethnic Russians were the clear winners, small Siberian tribes were often ridden over roughshod, Balts had any nationalist ambitions crushed brutally, Jews were singled out for official and unofficial discrimination at all levels of society, various Muslims were often treated themselves as colonial subjects in keeping with Russian Imperial tradition, etc.

 

[overoceans]

The Soviet Union was very loud about supporting racial equality, both under general principles (the Revolution cares not what your race or religion is, for we are all equal men struggling together!), and also under realpolitik of currying favor among the former European colonies, who already had reason to dislike the USSR's enemies.

Race relations were, of course, not so equal within the USSR itself, where ethnic Russians were the clear winners, small Siberian tribes were often ridden over roughshod, Balts had any nationalist ambitions crushed brutally, Jews were singled out for official and unofficial discrimination at all levels of society, various Muslims were often treated themselves as colonial subjects in keeping with Russian Imperial tradition, etc.

As far as Jews go, wasn't that more sectarianism than racism? My understanding(could be wrong) is that, after the death of Stalin and his Doctor's Plot paranoia, it was pretty easy to be ethnically Jewish in the USSR, as long as you weren't religious or political about it.

Anyway, what I was really wondering about was Plumber's characterization of the Soviets as anti-Chinese.

 

[B-29_Bomber]

As far as Jews go, wasn't that more sectarianism than racism? My understanding(could be wrong) is that, after the death of Stalin and his Doctor's Plot paranoia, it was pretty easy to be ethnically Jewish in the USSR, as long as you weren't religious or political about it.

Anyway, what I was really wondering about was Plumber's characterization of the Soviets as anti-Chinese.

The nature of post-war antisemitism in Soviet Russia is a combination of a number of factors, such as wartime Nazi propaganda, the lack of mentioning Jews in the narrative of the war, and the foundation of a Jewish State that was friendly to the West, and of course existing antisemite feelings in the Soviet Populous.

 

[Tom Colton]

There's all measure of racist humour, at the very least.

 

[Falk]

With regards to race and ethnicity, it varied depending on the leadership. Certainly Soviet citizens didn't have different seating and eating arrangements depending on their race, but you couldn't really advance, politically, unless you spoke Russian, and there wasn't much state support for other linguistic groups and their cultural development throughout the Stalin-Khrushchev-Brezhnev period.

To be fair requiring somebody to learn your language isn't racism. After all in the United States you have to speak English if you want to advance.

 

[ZhugeLiang]

As opposed to China, which backed the hyper-xenophobic Khmer Rouge, and was even seen for a while fighting on the same side as apartheid South Africa during the Angolan conflict.

North Korea might have been an exception on the Soviet side, since they preached a volkisch racial ideology imported (via the Japanese colonialists) from the same European theorists who inspired certain other racial ideologues.

Sadly, this is true. Communist China didn't care about who it backed or how racist those people were. The Khmer Rouge, for example, massacred Chinese people.

 

[sloreck]

Communism in the USSR no more eliminated racism (a curse of the capitalists) than it prevented pollution (a product of soulless plutocrats). Discrimination social and otherwise even against "white" non-Russians like Armenians, Georgians, etc is prevalent. For Non-white like folks from the "stans" they are generically known as "black-asses" and very second class. As far as Jews, that hasn't changed much since the days of the Czars and pogroms. When you had African students in Moscow and Leningrad studying at the big universities on grants to students from "friendly" African nations, back in the 60's & 70's mixed couple like Russian girl/African student would not be very accepted - this was hushed up but there were some really nasty incidents.

 

[Bakenellan]

On official level USSR was very egalitarian, anti-racist etc. The same Politburo consisted of people of many nationalities and Stalin was georgian after all On the other hand common xenophobia was... well... common. Still I'd say nowdays Russia is much more racist then USSR ever was.

Like one of the above posters said, crucial was a mastery of Russian language. If you spoke well you'd be accepted in most educated circles starting from school regardless of your nationality. That is, unless you were a Jew. There was a strong prejudice against Jews unofficially encouraged, officially hushed up. Even then there were plenty of Jews around doing pretty well, though it was much easier with a Russian surname.

It also depended on how mixed your immediate communication circle was. When a few nationalities were mixed together there usually a certain level of tolerance emerged. I've no doubt, it was not always the case, but I lived in a few very mixed communities and never witnessed any serious conflicts based on ethnicity.

Only about half of our class in middle and high school was Russian (and not all officially defined as "Russian" were this, a lot of people with mixed parentage were written as Russians). It was far from common situation, but in large cities and in special cases like the army and newly built towns could happen fairly often.

The one of the Armenians was bullied quite seriously exactly because his Russian was very poor (and he was overweight), though not explicitly for this reason but because he was "a dumb churka" (I am not sure that "blacks" or "black-ass" was ever applied to any non-white or non-russian back then though it is very common now). Two other Armenians were generally liked despite one being genuinely a bit dumb (but big and strong), both spoke Russian very well. None other non-Russian kids had any problem because of their nationality, but all of them had good Russian. There was even one genuinely black boy (his father was from Burkina-Faso), though that was exotic.

What was discriminating is that all non-Russian speakers were expected to learn Russian or excluded from any possible advancement and good education. Russian themselves had not to learn anything even when living in -SSRs. They had obligatory native language classes there but you could easily fail them and suffer no worse then bad mark in your diploma.

 

[Marc Pasquin]

On official level USSR was very egalitarian, anti-racist etc. The same Politburo consisted of people of many nationalities and Stalin was georgian after all On the other hand common xenophobia was... well... common. Still I'd say nowdays Russia is much more racist then USSR ever was.

Like one of the above posters said, crucial was a mastery of Russian language. If you spoke well you'd be accepted in most educated circles starting from school regardless of your nationality. That is, unless you were a Jew. There was a strong prejudice against Jews unofficially encouraged, officially hushed up. Even then there were plenty of Jews around doing pretty well, though it was much easier with a Russian surname.

It also depended on how mixed your immediate communication circle was. When a few nationalities were mixed together there usually a certain level of tolerance emerged. I've no doubt, it was not always the case, but I lived in a few very mixed communities and never witnessed any serious conflicts based on ethnicity.

Only about half of our class in middle and high school was Russian (and not all officially defined as "Russian" were this, a lot of people with mixed parentage were written as Russians). It was far from common situation, but in large cities and in special cases like the army and newly built towns could happen fairly often.

The one of the Armenians was bullied quite seriously exactly because his Russian was very poor (and he was overweight), though not explicitly for this reason but because he was "a dumb churka" (I am not sure that "blacks" or "black-ass" was ever applied to any non-white or non-russian back then though it is very common now). Two other Armenians were generally liked despite one being genuinely a bit dumb (but big and strong), both spoke Russian very well. None other non-Russian kids had any problem because of their nationality, but all of them had good Russian. There was even one genuinely black boy (his father was from Burkina-Faso), though that was exotic.

What was discriminating is that all non-Russian speakers were expected to learn Russian or excluded from any possible advancement and good education. Russian themselves had not to learn anything even when living in -SSRs. They had obligatory native language classes there but you could easily fail them and suffer no worse then bad mark in your diploma.

A question about learning the russian language, Do you think it was a case of xenophobia on the part of the dominant ethnic group that was passed on to those who assimilated or was it that russian was simply seen as a lingua-franca within the USSR and that someone who didn't speak it (or badly) was anti-social ?

 

[spkaca]

Machiavellian embrace of anti-racism doesn't change the fact that the USSR was the last European colonial empire whose leadership held such views of China in particular that they make Trump seem tolerant.

Care to expand?

According to the Mitrokhin Archive the KGB's code-name for the Chinese was "ants". That might be the sort of thing he was thinking of. Also SCM Paine in The Wars for Asia points out that the Soviets took a very long time to hand back their share of the Manchurian railways (acquired in a bit of pre-WW1 colonialism) - they held on to their share well into the 1950s.

 

[Clandango]

Sadly, this is true. Communist China didn't care about who it backed or how racist those people were. The Khmer Rouge, for example, massacred Chinese people.

Perhaps they said to themselves only capitalist Chinese went down there? Though knowing Mao, he really just didn't care.

 

[Bakenellan]

A question about learning the russian language, Do you think it was a case of xenophobia on the part of the dominant ethnic group that was passed on to those who assimilated or was it that russian was simply seen as a lingua-franca within the USSR and that someone who didn't speak it (or badly) was anti-social ?

Interesting question...

Russian was a lingua-franca. Without it the Union would quickly fall apart. Officially it had no special status in comparison to other national languages. Nevertheless it was compulsory taught in all national schools which frankly is a way of cultural assimilation which was at the same time denied officially. So de-facto government politics was aimed at russification and marginalization of national cultures.

At the same time I don't think many Russians actively were derisive of national languages and cultures and wanted to make everyone and everything Russian. They were even encouraged to pride themselves as the creators of truly multi-national state where all peoples are equal and constantly told to respect cultural traditions of others. But de-facto privileged status of Russian language and culture led them to believe their superiority and anyone not good with them were treated as second class at best. An then xenophobic reaction would fire up.

So the case is probably more is of national arrogance of a dominant people then outright xenophobia or conscious assimilation efforts. Russians were (not sure if still are) in general tolerant if often insultingly condescending and sometimes mildly intrigued of subjugated cultures as long as their own superiority stayed unquestioned and acknowledged.

 

[Flocculencio]

I think the articles point is not that the USSR was free of racism, but rather that it wasn't officially institutionalised, as was the case in, say, the US or the European colonies.