Question: Could France/GB/USA fall to Communism after the first WWI?

Pretty much what it says in the title. Could any of them fall to communism after the First World War, and what would the aftermath of that be?


P.S. Just realized I said World War I twice in the title whoops haha
 
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France possible but unlikely; Britain very unlikely, very but remotely possible; the USA virtually impossible.
 
Depends on how bad the Great Depression gets. France has a shot, buts it's a very low probability event, with the UK even lower.

The US is a wildcard. An out-and-out Communist revolution along the lines of Russia? Not gonna happen. Socialism getting a toe-hold and becoming a viable third/local party? Now we're talking.
 
France possible but unlikely; Britain very unlikely, very but remotely possible; the USA virtually impossible.

Depends on how bad the Great Depression gets. France has a shot, buts it's a very low probability event, with the UK even lower.

The US is a wildcard. An out-and-out Communist revolution along the lines of Russia? Not gonna happen. Socialism getting a toe-hold and becoming a viable third/local party? Now we're talking.

I figured that the USA would be rather impossible. What would be the outcome of a French Communist State? I ask for possible TL/story I'm thinking about
 

Lateknight

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I figured that the USA would be rather impossible. What would be the outcome of a French Communist State? I ask for possible TL/story I'm thinking about

They would copy the Soviet Union a great deal obviously as they were first, so see the French empire become a federation of "republics" and probably a swing to the soviets side so there's going to a great deal of tension between France and its former allies. As to the state its self it would fail but I doubt would fail as badly as the soviets or Maoist the French were already industrialized so no plans that end with millions dead for the sake of more industry.
 
They would copy the Soviet Union a great deal obviously as they were first, so see the French empire become a federation of "republics" and probably a swing to the soviets side so there's going to a great deal of tension between France and its former allies. As to the state its self it would fail but I doubt would fail as badly as the soviets or Maoist the French were already industrialized so no plans that end with millions dead for the sake of more industry.

If France did go Red, there's no way that the Empire would follow. Either the "White" (for lack of a better word) government moves to Algeria and operates the empire from quasi-exile, or the other great powers (especially the UK) swoop in and gobble the bits up/set up puppet regimes.

As for butterflies, you can bet your bottom dollar that a Red France, on top of a Red Russia, means that Germany gets the official go-ahead to wipe its ass with the Treaty of Versailles. You'd almost certainly see some kind of military-but-not-neccesarily-right-wing government take over in Germany, who reaches an understanding with the UK (and probably Poland).
 
They would copy the Soviet Union a great deal obviously as they were first, so see the French empire become a federation of "republics" and probably a swing to the soviets side so there's going to a great deal of tension between France and its former allies. As to the state its self it would fail but I doubt would fail as badly as the soviets or Maoist the French were already industrialized so no plans that end with millions dead for the sake of more industry.

Would they have tried to spread it around in other places, like Spain during their Civil War?
 

Lateknight

Banned
If France did go Red, there's no way that the Empire would follow. Either the "White" (for lack of a better word) government moves to Algeria and operates the empire from quasi-exile, or the other great powers (especially the UK) swoop in and gobble the bits up/set up puppet regimes.

As for butterflies, you can bet your bottom dollar that a Red France, on top of a Red Russia, means that Germany gets the official go-ahead to wipe its ass with the Treaty of Versailles. You'd almost certainly see some kind of military-but-not-neccesarily-right-wing government take over in Germany, who reaches an understanding with the UK (and probably Poland).

Oh I doubt the rest of the empire would follow them but I'm guessing some of it would there actually alegeria is the one place I think would follow definitely as it's very close and there's a lot of French military assets in place already. Also your supposing it comes to power via a viloent revolt there was a chance the French could have elected the communist in not a great chance mind you but a chance in that case the empire follows. Or there could have bee a coup in that cause it could follow depending on the success of the coup. Your observations on Germany are spot on I think I wonder if this would weak or strengthen the nazi party on one hand no more crippling treaty on the other hand encirclinment by communist.
 
Oh I doubt the rest of the empire would follow them but I'm guessing some of it would there actually alegeria is the one place I think would follow definitely as it's very close and there's a lot of French military assets in place already. Also your supposing it comes to power via a viloent revolt there was a chance the French could have elected the communist in not a great chance mind you but a chance in that case the empire follows. Or there could have bee a coup in that cause it could follow depending on the success of the coup. Your observations on Germany are spot on I think I wonder if this would weak or strengthen the nazi party on one hand no more crippling treaty on the other hand encirclinment by communist.

The Nazi's would probably get butterflied away, they had a very specific path to power that could have blown up in their face (sometimes literally) a dozen times over. If they didn't get derailed, they'd probably get folded into whatever center-right party emerged (probably with covert funding from the UK). Remember, a big part of the Nazi's appeal was their promise to revoke the ToV: if the UK is giving Germany the all clear to re-militarize the fuck out of the Rhineland, than that support vanished.
 

Lateknight

Banned
Would they have tried to spread it around in other places, like Spain during their Civil War?

I think they would after a peroid of purging the old society they would seek to exapand there ideology. One wonders how the fall of another major western nation to communism would effect Russia I think Stalins policy of communism in one country would be somewhat discredited it would empower the more expansionist elements within the country it could very well lead to war. The would be tension in the long run of coarse neither France nor Russia would be conferable being supbordines of the other but at first I would think that he set aside as there both the same system later rivialry would come in.
 

Lateknight

Banned
The Nazi's would probably get butterflied away, they had a very specific path to power that could have blown up in their face (sometimes literally) a dozen times over. If they didn't get derailed, they'd probably get folded into whatever center-right party emerged (probably with covert funding from the UK).

True one wonders if I'm the next war the British and Germany's would be allies against a communist alliance. Both would probably turn to the right in the face of increasing communism.
 
I'm agree that Germany would definitely get the okay from GB to begin arming themselves. I myself think they would try to get Communist gov't. What does Italy do and what camp do they fall into?
 

Lateknight

Banned
I'm agree that Germany would definitely get the okay from GB to begin arming themselves. I myself think they would try to get Communist gov't. What does Italy do and what camp do they fall into?

Communism probably the biennio rosso weren't that far behind them at that point I know that even during there communist insurgents operating in Italy and afterwards a communist government was almost voted into power. If the communist had a benefactor on the border Italy going to go red at some point or another. It could end up in civil war communist vs facist that would be ugly.
 
Communism probably the biennio rosso weren't that far behind them at that point I know that even during there communist insurgents operating in Italy and afterwards a communist government was almost voted into power. If the communist had a benefactor on the border Italy going to go red at some point or another. It could end up in civil war communist vs facist that would be ugly.

Yeah I can see the French supporting the communists in Italy
 

CalBear

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France is low possible. It would require a number of things to go in the (im)proper direction, starting with Germany going Red. The War ended before any serious risk of the Red Flag being unfurled in Germany. France had a solid Communist political movement, so the seedcorn was there.

Britain is much less likely. If anything the danger is fascism, or a British flavor of it. (the two systems are actual two sides of the same coin in practical use despite the huge differences on paper). Communists were nowhere as potent in political terms in the UK, although it did have somethng of a presence.

The U.S. is, as has been mentionedj ust about impossible. The U.S. wasn't hurt seriously by WW I. If anything the War made the U.S. the global economic powerhouse at least a couple decades earlier than would otherwise have been the case simply by gutting the British and French economies. There is always a statistical above Zero chance of any outcome politically, but once you get enough zeros to the right of the decimal point the reality is that it is zero. There was never any serious Communist groundswell in the U.S., there was something of successful Socialist movement, even managed to get one representative elected to Congress, but the American version of Socialism was quite different from that seen in Europe.
 
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