Question: Better powerplants for Kriegsmarine surface ships

Historically, the Kriegsmarine had severe problems with the reliability of the ultra-high pressure turbines of its surface warships, I think especially in the Hipper class heavy cruisers and the 1934 type destroyers.

Supposing Germany had not lost WW I, and the German navy had more money, other resources and time to experiment, what would have been the best powerplants for their various ship classes if they chose the same types of ships?
Spending more money on the ultra-high pressure turbines until they worked?
More conventional turbines?
Should the turbines be geared or turbo-electrical?
Diesel powerplants as in the Deutschland class Panzerschiffe?

Thank you very much in advance for your input!
 
The problems with the high pressure turbines included corrosion. Corrosion inhibitors might have been developed. I think that you need to force a good inorganic chemist to work on the problem. Why not Otto Hahn and his team (you might allow him to protect a few Jewish scientists to get his agreement). This might lead to a few minor butterflies.
 
Eh, during the Interwar years every navy worth its salt was using higher- and higher-pressure turbines. It's just Germans decided to do a "quantum leap" instead of gradual advancement (like US Navy), so they were running into problems unprepared.
 
Germans by wars end had come up with a diesel engine that could achieve 12,000 HP. Which is about double what the new engine on the Deutschland class could achieve. Assuming the economic disruptions are reduced and no treaty issues they could have gotten some very powerful diesels by the 1930's. Certainly avoided the problems they did have.

The key point made by Tizoc is that the Germans tried to achieve too much with their jump to High Pressure Steam Turbines. They just needed time to work out the bugs in whatever power plant they used.

Michael
 
Eh, during the Interwar years every navy worth its salt was using higher- and higher-pressure turbines. It's just Germans decided to do a "quantum leap" instead of gradual advancement (like US Navy), so they were running into problems unprepared.

Well, given that the German navy only launched 5 light cruisers and a dozen or so torpedo boats during the 1920s they probably simply didn´t have the chance to try for "gradual advancement". Try to tell a parliament why one of the very few naval ships funded needs a lot of additional money because the turbines don´t work as advertised. :)
Add to that the simple fact that the Weimar Republic just had 5 years of political stability (from the end of hyper inflation in the early 1920s to the start of the Great Depression). They probably and quite simply didn´t have the money available to do a gradual improvement program in the 1920s. How can you start a multiple year research and development program if you can´t be sure of next year´s funding?

You miss 10-15 years of development. You either leap and hope for the best. Or you accept your inferiority. Definitely not possible in Nazi Germany.
 
Germans by wars end had come up with a diesel engine that could achieve 12,000 HP. Which is about double what the new engine on the Deutschland class could achieve. Assuming the economic disruptions are reduced and no treaty issues they could have gotten some very powerful diesels by the 1930's. Certainly avoided the problems they did have.

The key point made by Tizoc is that the Germans tried to achieve too much with their jump to High Pressure Steam Turbines. They just needed time to work out the bugs in whatever power plant they used.

Michael

That diesel engine was a monster!
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...esel-engines-battleships-99-years-ago-162819/
And it needed 3 auxiliary engines to produce the pressured air needed to inject fuel into the "monster" cylinders.

I looked up a few things for BlondieBC´s TL.
In our TL the naval diesel engine was primarily developed for merchant ships. And after WW1 German shipping companies mostly rejected using any diesel engines except for the proven 1200 hp diesel engines used in submarines. They just weren´t that reliable yet. That changed around 1924/25 with new inventions (direct hydraulic fuel injection, light alloy pistons).
After that orders for naval merchant diesel engines rose.

So there already was considerable civilian interest in diesel engines.
It is of course possible that with less "economic disruptions and no treaty issues" the German navy might have funded additional research. Maybe pushing development further than in our TL. Possible but not certain, I´d say.
 
Thank you for the link that is very useful to me for something else.

The Germans problems was between the Inter Allied Control Commission and the general economic chaos Germany didn't do much of anything for several years. Lots of effort was lost. Just not scrapping the thing would have been a big help.

Michael
 

BlondieBC

Banned
The problems with the high pressure turbines included corrosion. Corrosion inhibitors might have been developed. I think that you need to force a good inorganic chemist to work on the problem. Why not Otto Hahn and his team (you might allow him to protect a few Jewish scientists to get his agreement). This might lead to a few minor butterflies.

I a German non-loss, Germany will treat the Jews well. No need for protection.

Historically, the Kriegsmarine had severe problems with the reliability of the ultra-high pressure turbines of its surface warships, I think especially in the Hipper class heavy cruisers and the 1934 type destroyers.

Supposing Germany had not lost WW I, and the German navy had more money, other resources and time to experiment, what would have been the best powerplants for their various ship classes if they chose the same types of ships?
Spending more money on the ultra-high pressure turbines until they worked?
More conventional turbines?
Should the turbines be geared or turbo-electrical?
Diesel powerplants as in the Deutschland class Panzerschiffe?

You restrictions strike me as a bit odd. Are you trying to do a TL?

If Germany does not loses, it ships will neither be like OTL or be exactly like any other Navy. Germany will have different basic needs from the major powers, so will build different types/mixes of ships. Germany had somewhat different ship designs before the war, and had a vastly different war experiences. It also has different needs and availability of ports.
 
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