Proposals and War Aims That Didn't Happen Map Thread

I've been reading the findings of the American Arbitral Award of the President of the United States of America Woodrow Wilson: Full Report of the Committee upon the Arbitration of the Boundary Between Turkey and Armenia, which was the basis for the whole concept of "Wilsonian Armenia". This is part of a small side-project surrounding the idea of such an Armenia's actual survival in the wake of WWI. However, an interesting side-project, or ought I say a side-side-project, concerns the port city of Batum.

Of the schemes to grant Armenia access to the Black Sea, two were initially proposed by the allied powers after WWI. The first was that Batum ought to become an international / free port. Not dissimilar to ideas surrounding Trieste or Danzig, the idea was that Batum would become an international territory or condominium which could be used not only by Armenia, but by Georgia, Azerbaijan and Persia. Below is my best approximation of the boundaries of such a micro-state: The dotted line represents Batum Oblast (the maximum area that could be allotted to Batum) and the solid line represents the most desirable boundaries (according to the Americans).
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However, this proposal was not taken up; chiefly on the grounds that such a port could only ever serve "Russian" Armenia, and had no commercial links whatever to Erzurum, Erzincan or other settlements in "Ottoman" Armenia - meaning the economic, industrial and social divisions that already existed would only widen with Batum serving as Armenia's main port. Furthermore, though Georgia at the time was amenable to Armenian interests in this direction, the Americans of the Committee upon the Arbitration of the Boundary Between Turkey and Armenia had no confidence this would last, especially with the Bolsheviks cascading into the region.
The second main proposal prior to the work of the Committee was that a semi-autonomous Lazistan would comprise Armenia's coastline. However the ports of Lazistan were small and at that time unusable for much of the year, and it was considered entirely unfeasible to build a railway into Lazistan (the Pontic alps being in the way).
It was eventually decided that a substantial part of Trebizond Vilayet would also be adjoined to Armenia, despite the fact few Armenians lived in the region and both Trebizond's Turks and Greeks were opposed to such a move. This was decided upon by the Committee upon the Arbitration of the Boundary Between Turkey and Armenia on purely economic grounds, though it is amusing to note that even the city of Trebizond was adjudged incapable of serving as an independent Armenia's main port (again, as no rail line could connect Trebizond to interior cities) - Tirebolu would instead serve as Armenia's port.

Or it would have, had Wilsonian Armenia survived into the interwar period.
Well it's certainly interesting what would've happened if many of the proposals at the Peace Conference would be accepted, and if they are accepted, they actually be fulfilled. Turkey really wasn't all too connected with itself before a certain electrician-turned prime minister came along. Maybe Armenia would have built a railroad or other road to Trebizond if they did, or maybe the Pontus Greek Proposal would've gone through
 
Well it's certainly interesting what would've happened if many of the proposals at the Peace Conference would be accepted, and if they are accepted, they actually be fulfilled. Turkey really wasn't all too connected with itself before a certain electrician-turned prime minister came along. Maybe Armenia would have built a railroad or other road to Trebizond if they did, or maybe the Pontus Greek Proposal would've gone through
According to the same document(s), the plan was to construct a railway to Tirebolu. Trebizond was hemmed in by the Pontic Alps, making a rail connection financially impossible (especially for a nascent republic). Tirebolu apaprently had better pre-existing connections with the Erzurum/Erzincan/Bayburt region.
The Pontic Greek proposal stood no chance. Again, according to this American source, when Venezilos rejected Pontus as being too isolated (and impossible for Greece to defend against a vengeful Turkey) it was apparently the wish of the Pontic Greeks to remain as an autonomous part of Turkey. It was their least favourite idea to split the region between two countries (Turkey & Armenia), especially as it wasn't clear that Armenia would be any more amenable to Greek interests than Turkey was.

You can take that apparent wish with a grain of salt - it is just as likely Venezilos wanted Pontus to remain a part of Turkey so all the Pontic Greeks would have to leave the region - and conveniently populate the abandoned farms and homes of evicted Turks in Macedonia & Thrace. Depends how cynical you are, I guess.
 
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"The Chinese territory after the victory against Communists and Russian" -- Chiang kai-shek's ultimate "plan" to retake China and after

Supposedly this is an authentic and very ambitious Chinese war plans map. Found via Tumblr in the collection of the National Museum for Taiwanese History. If anyone can read traditional Chinese, maybe the notes for the four states/zones of expansion in the former Soviet Union might reveal some interesting details.
 
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Supposedly this is an authentic and very ambitious Chinese war plans map. Found via Tumblr in the collection of the National Museum for Taiwanese History. If anyone can read traditional Chinese, maybe the notes for the four states/zones of expansion in the former Soviet Union might reveal some interesting details.
Someone made a map a while back combining this with other proposals to radically expand China’s borders:


All the Chinese "National Humiliation" maps plus the Kuomintang's proposal to annex Siberia and Central Asia combined into one t h i c c China
View attachment 521298
Note: Had to create some provincial borders to make it more equal in size.
 
Would the area in the middle of the Pink Map be administered as a separate colony or would the entire area from Angola to Mozambique be administered as one?
 

Crazy Boris

Banned
Would the area in the middle of the Pink Map be administered as a separate colony or would the entire area from Angola to Mozambique be administered as one?
I don’t think it would be a single colony, but it might get split between Angola and Mozambique down the middle
 
Would the area in the middle of the Pink Map be administered as a separate colony or would the entire area from Angola to Mozambique be administered as one?
I expect there might be several large tributary states. Then again, the Portuguese suppressed their own centuries long allies in Angola, so maybe not. Probably depends on wheand where the Portuguese find out about the gold and diamonds in the areas, as well as their need for a free (as in unpaid) work force.
 
Would the area in the middle of the Pink Map be administered as a separate colony or would the entire area from Angola to Mozambique be administered as one?
Hard to say, IRL, in the year(s) just before the ultimatum:
-The parts of central Zambia/Middle Zambezi upstream from mozambique were explored from the town of Zumbo, and more generally to the province of Tete
-The parts of Shonaland/eastern zimbabwe which were occupied at time by portugal (or its ally in the region, the warlord Manuel Antionio de Sousa) were part of a "Province of Manica" (modern Manica and Sofala)
-The parts of western Zambia in Barotseland were explored and contested from Moxico in Angola

I doubt the portuguese would consider any long term recognition of Indirect rule over Matabeleland and Barotseland and they will probably get invaded eventually - like the Gaza empire, which was nominally a vassal since 1885 was invaded a decade later.

Before 1910, control of the interior would be theoretical for the most part, after it...
Attitudes of the first republic favoured *some* level of autonomy (which was never achieved) and decentralisation of the colonies, but that policy was quickly inverted in the 20s, beside the revolution may never happen ITTL

The Eastern part of the Pink map will probably fall under the same concessionary regime as early colonial mozambique, especially since the british would still have interest there and they'd probably dividing part Portuguese africa into largely british owned companies, it isn't hard to imagine central and south eastern Zambia and parts of Malawi (if the british don't enforce some compromise for the scottish missions for the latter) fall under similar companies to the Zambezia company, and the "Province of Manica" (which would probably come to encompass much of Zimbabwe) was also envisioned by the portuguese as a colonial public company. Meanwhile "Barotseland" would be closer to angola and probably in it.

I don't see a third, central african, colony being made until the boom of mining in the copperbelt, which would probably happen later than IRL
 
I can only speak for my own state, but, while this might have been true in 1973 (and I don't think it really was), it definitely is not today.
Culturally and economically, Jacksonville and the area of what is now Florida north of a line from Jacksonville to the Gulf should be part of "Piedmont". The Tampa/Orlando metro area has more in common with Miami than Jacksonville or Georgia. It could even be argued that the Dade-Broward area could be a separate state (some might even suggest a separate country)
That's the problem with a map like this. People move. Economies change.
 
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