Prime Minister Mosley?

IIRC Britain's last pre-war election was 1935, with Baldwin winning. I seem to recall that the BUF boycotted this election. If we utilise some applied handwavium and have Mosley win, there are a few things to consider in foreign politics: Italy, France and Britain are at this point semi-united in the Stresa front, and Italy's rather dodgy invasion of Ethiopia is going sufficiently badly that they're prepared to sit down with France and Britain to sort out a compromise. Given the French political situation, you might see another rightist party or coalition gain power there, and the three countries forming a pro-status quo in Western Europe alliance.

There tends to be a distinct difference in conduct between political movements in opposition and in power, and I don't see any reason that the BUF would be any different - Mosley isn't a traitor, and Britain hasn't been overrun by panzers, so I don't see any real reason for an alliance with Germany to be on the cards.
 

Typo

Banned
1. The fact of the matter is that, while realpolitik more often than not dominates the foreign policies of major powers, there are many instances in history where it is trumped by ideology.
The ideological choices are almost always reversed pretty quickly

Mosley's Britain would probably be one of these. Mosley was himself a great admirer of Hitler (the Fuehrer attended Mosley's wedding at Goebbels' villa) and very much wanted to remold Britain in Germany's image, which he viewed as incredibly successful.
Mosley's Britain well also no be autocratic enough for Mosley himself to completely dictate British foreign policy


2. I doubt that Mosley's would be an exact copy of Hitler's, but it would be modeled off of the Third Reich, which Mosley saw as the near-perfect example of a thriving fascist nation, infinitely wealthier, more efficient, and militarily stronger than Mussolini's Italy.
But interwar Britain is not Weimar Germany, the condition to create a copy of Hitler's government does not exist, no matter Mosley's personal feelings

3. As uncomfortable as it may sound, fascists can be pretty idealistic. A London-Berlin-Rome Axis based on fascistic brotherhood, anticommunism, and neo-imperialism could actually provide a reason for Britain playing buddy-buddy with Germany.
And Fascists are more often harsh realists, Hitler had no problem allying with the USSR when it suited them, Mussolini opposed Hitler until he realized he can't, and unlike Mussolini's Italy, germany can't really affect British imperialism much

Britain finds itself more closely aligned with Italy
As long as Britain is ok with Italian adventurism for more territory
 
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Wolfpaw

Banned
The ideological choices are almost always reversed pretty quickly

Mosley's Britain well also no be autocratic enough for Mosley himself to completely dictate British foreign policy

This is only assuming the interests of the countries involved are conflicting/opposed. Mosley (and most Britons) did not see German aims and British aims as conflicting (at the time, c. 1936). Nor, for that matter, did Hitler.

As to whether or not Mosley is strong enough to dictate foreign policy, well that very much depends on how he comes to power. If he manages to dissolve Parliament with some sort of Reichstag Fire-esque scenario and get some sort of Emergency Act passed, he would probably be strong enough to do just that. And let's not forget appeasement. Most Britons at the time were in favor of appeasement, and that includes many leaders of the major parties. Maybe Mosley may be unable to directly align with Hitler (though I'm sure an anti-communist pact wouldn't be out of the question) but you'll surely see Anglo-German relations warming considerably.


But interwar Britain is not Weimar Germany, the condition to create a copy of Hitler's government does not exist, no matter Mosley's personal feelings

I pretty much agree with you here; it won't be an exact copy. But again, this is all very dependent on how exactly Mosley gets power. Again, if he is granted dictatorial powers by Parliament due to some national emergency, well...

And Fascists are more often harsh realists, Hitler had no problem allying with the USSR when it suited them, Mussolini opposed Hitler until he realized he can't, and unlike Mussolini's Italy, germany can't really affect British imperialism much

Bear in mind these examples are those of powers who were intially opposed to one another and realism forced them together (temporarily for the USSR and the Third Reich, permanently for Italy and Germany once Mussolini and Hitler realized they liked one another and realized that their country's interests weren't all that competetive). A Mosleyite Britain would want to work with Germany from the outset since, again, the BUF (and most Britons) did not see British and German interests as opposed.

As long as Britain is ok with Italian adventurism for more territory

Mosley was okay with it (he lauded it, actually), but whether or not Britain gets involved (or how involved it does get) is all very circumstantial.
 

Eurofed

Banned
Mosley was okay with it (he lauded it, actually), but whether or not Britain gets involved (or how involved it does get) is all very circumstantial.

One possible goal for Mussolni's adventurism that surely Mosley would not give a rat's butt about is Yugoslavia.
 

Dure

Banned
Do you think Mosley would be satisfied with sending Jews and Gypsies up the chimney or do you think he would want to start on the Irish as well? What about the blacks of empire? I suspect they are in for a bit of a change in status.
 

Eurofed

Banned
Do you think Mosley would be satisfied with sending Jews and Gypsies up the chimney

The chimney was the solution that the Nazis picked because of war constraints. The original plan was deportation. ITTL Mosley and Hitler likely make a pact to shunt their "undesirables" to some distant corner of the world. Britain has already created nations with its deportees, I expect the pattern would repeat. Well, at least an Israel with German and British Jews is going to have one kick-ass of know-how, in whatever forgotten corner of Africa or Asia it shows up.

or do you think he would want to start on the Irish as well?

I dunno, what was the BUF's position on the Irish ?

What about the blacks of empire? I suspect they are in for a bit of a change in status.

Say "welcome back" to chattel slavery, Britain. :eek:
 

Wolfpaw

Banned
I don't believe the BUF was at all Hibernophobic. A handful of leading members of the BUF (William Joyce and Tommy Moran, for example) were of Irish stock. Mosley himself was quite fond of Ireland and its people. Obviously they favored Unionists far more than Nationalists, but I don't forsee any emerald-colored ashes coming out of any camps under the BUF (unless they were IRA fellows).

Though who knows? Given time, the Mosleyites may think that the whole of Ireland really ought to be reabsorbed by the UK.
 
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