First I should preface this by informing all of you that the next chapter will be posted later today, but before I do I should tell that it will be shorter than originally intended.
Initially, I had planned on covering both the start of the Second Anglo-Persian War and the Sepoy Mutiny, as well as briefly cover the other fronts of the Great Eurasian War not mentioned in Part 78. Instead, I cut it in half as it was becoming rather long for my liking. As such, the chapter being posted today will cover the first half of the update featuring the start of the Anglo-Persian War and the Start of the Sepoy Mutiny and I'll have the second half (covering the Baltic front, the Central Asian Front, the Far East Front, and North American Front) posted either tomorrow or on Tuesday at the latest.
And here's the updated GIF. Greece has certainly come a long way since Leopold arrived:
Wow Gian, this is truly amazing! Thank you so much for this.
Will Greece get its debt forgiven or will the interest on the debt be lowered?
Part of the treaty Greece signed with Great Britain involved a review of Greece's debts, which will more than likely result in the forgiveness or lowering of some of their current debts.
If i am not mistaken there some lingite deposits in elassona just south of the river aliakmon..do the new borders include this area?
Yes, Elassona should now be a part of Greece as it is south of the Olympus Range.
Greek Congo maybe?
Looks like we might break out the immortal line from
Patríkios Loumoummpa from 1960: "Δεν είμαστε πλέον οι πίθηκοί σας." /"Den eínaste pléon i píthikí sas." (We are no longer your monkeys.)
I think it is ASB...
The only colonial adventure that was given any thought in OTL was Cyrenaica, due to its proximity, strategic location, low population density for settling farmers and sponge fishing.
Yeah true,honestly greece can gain all the resources it needs from Britain and Russia(given the relation that it has with them)its not that difficult and it will be much better than engaging in expensive colonial ventures.
Furthermore I can see how such an action can spark outrage in the greek population("we overthrew the turks,so that we can overlord other ethnicities a world away")really if greece engages in colonial ventures it will be over islands that it can use as trade depots around the world and further its trading interests.
Dont get me wrong Greeks can understand Strategic and economic value and if there was such a colony they would perhaps acquire it,but why would they need colonies for prestige,The only prestige that they want is Rhomania,Konstantinoupolis
I can see some lease happen with Ethiopia given that they are both Christian nations,where greece helps Ethiopia modernise and Ethiopia gives trading privileges to greek merchants.(though such a thing would probably be unlikely given that there are other much better alternatives (ie britain,france) ).
And that only very limited thought. Although back in shwi-isot I had created a Greek Congo. Or the beginnings of one anyway. 🙄
I can confirm that Greek Congo isn't going to happen ITTL, but Greece might dabble in a little imperialism during the late 19th/early 20th Centuries if it plays its cards right. That said, it will be very limited (if it happens at all, I haven't decided on this yet) and would likely be limited to Cyrenaica or a few isolated islands to use as coaling stations for their merchant fleet.
So, is Sazan still greek after the changes in the map?
Technically yes, as they are considered a part of the Ionian Islands, but in reality it will likely fall under the occupation of the Ottoman Empire as per OTL as it is still too far from Greece's holdings in Northern Epirus and too close to Ottoman Albania to be realistically held by Greece at this time.
Will the Japanese embassy to Europe pass by Greece given that it is quite the Trade giant in the European Markets(hellenic steamship company)?
Cultivating a relationship with an ascendant oriental power is something that greece ought to do
en.m.wikipedia.org
Yes, there will be some interaction between Greece and Japan, but it will likely be limited to commerce and trade for the immediate future.
Will Greece be making a lot of money from supplying the British?
Without the French in the game, the British have to find alternate sources of supplies, ranging from fodder to food, alcohol or canvas. Everything the British need must either come from Britain or bought locally. Normally, the OE could provide the vast majority of british needs, but now with the battles fought in imperial territory and the need to massively expand and supply its army, I guess they cannot provide for the British as well. Lastly, the british will have to use the greek ports and charter greek merchantmen for logistics. Without the French, the British will have to either pull out more of their own merchantment from their lucrative trade routes or charter greek ships to support the Black Sea theater. I guess many Greek shipowners will make a fortune hauling cargo for Old Albion.
Yes, Greece will definitely make a good amount of money as it will essentially provide whatever the Ottomans and the British can't. While this may not seem like much on the surface, the British logistical network during the OTL Crimean War was an absolute nightmare of ineptitude and inefficiency especially during the first winter outside Sevastopol. The biggest issues for the British in OTL were a shortage of winter clothes, firewood/coal, medical supplies, food, and drink, all of which Greece can provide to varying degrees. That said, Greece's material support of the British won't fix all their issues, as most were a result of needless bureaucracy and poor planning (the use of Balaklava as Britain's main port in the Crimea was a terrible decision), but it should definitely help especially since the fighting is limited primarily to Bulgaria and Eastern Anatolia right now.
With the Greeks providing copious supplies to the British, what are the chances that many veterans pick up a taste for Greek wine or even ouzo?
I'd say that's almost a certainty.
Been away for a little while, but damn has Greece been busy! That’s one hell of a land grab from the Ottomans—the Ionians we all expected, but Thessaly? Epirus? They got really lucky.
Lucky enough that I really want to say that I expect the Ottomans to react to the changed situation, rather significantly. IOTL the divvying up of Ottoman Europe, negotiated by great powers, didn’t even begin until 1878. Here it’s twenty years earlier, and arguably in more core territory; Yanina at least was at one point a rather significant part of the Empire. Losing all of this territory, without even fighting for it mind you, should cause something of a panic in Kostantiniyye. I understand they’re not in a position to do anything about it right now, but once the war’s over I would not be surprised to see an earlier rise of Young Turks, or something like them.
I decided to look this up a little bit, and although it’s true that the Albanian national movement hadn’t really hit its stride yet some sources say it had already begun as an intellectual movement in the 1830s-40s, much like elsewhere in the Balkans. However, it’s definitely early enough in the timeline to affect it significantly, and I can see something of a path forward where the southern Albanians end up courted by the Greek cultural sphere and join their Souliote cousins in assimilating without too much issue. On the other hand, the diehard Albanian nationalists that will inevitably exist eventually will claim all of the Albanian-speaking land, and I can see TTL’s debate of the Albanian national identity focused on its northern half. If we want to get really weird—a conflict between Greece and Serbia over it?
Glad to have you back Cmakk. Indeed, Greece got more than even I expected them to get initially, but in all honesty it was probably a fair deal for all involved, although I'm sure the Ottomans don't see it that way. Thessaly and Epirus were not exactly the most prosperous or populous provinces within the Ottoman Empire during the mid-19th Century and while their loss will certainly sting for the Sublime Porte, not having to fight a two front war is certainly worth it, provided they manage to survive relatively intact. That said, there will definitely be growing resentment towards Greece in the Ottoman Empire once the war is over.
man idk of Greece messed up or not but that shit right their is extortion in my book and you can bet your ass Britain and the Ottoman Empire will remember that. Especially if Russia loses, you can expect groups in both empires will look at little Greece and think about how to punish it for its... impudence seems appropriate.
You'd think they might, but if you look at it from another angle, it's kind of a win-win for both countries as the Ottomans cut their losses on two hick regions that are more often than not a hornet's nest of rebels and rabblerousers (at least they kept Macedonia and the rest of Albania), while Britain saves itself from another quagmire in the Aegean that it has to deal with, especially with Russia still around (not to mention saving the Anglo-Greek alliance from falling apart).
Nationalists will never see losing any land, even hick, poor, rebellious land, as a good. There’ll inevitably be at least a faction in the empire that sees these losses as disgraceful and, honestly, something to be reversed if they can, much like with Egypt. I’m very curious to see what happens with the Bulgarians as well on this front in a few decades.
Britain won’t care much imo. They organized the whole thing as it was easier and cheaper than another front in the war for them. The ottomans will likely be divided. But if the Russians win I’m sure the larger part of the country will be happy to have paid a bribe to prevent something worse from happening.
As for the Albanians, I can absolutely see southern Albania joining up and identifying with the Greeks in this world. Maybe even central Albania to an extent. Right now the only people in the Balkans with progress towards freedom are the Greeks. Hitching your wagon to theirs isn’t the worst decision you’re could make, especially if it doesn’t come with a mountain of pressure to change every single thing about your culture.
Britain in general, will accept mollifying Greece as a necessary evil to keep them on side and out of the war, especially with said war not going in their favor right now. While they may not like the manner in which the Greeks acted during their negotiations (the sabre rattling didn't really help), they understand that the Greeks were playing the hand they were dealt to its best potential. The Ottomans will definitely have a harder time accepting territorial concessions to Greeks however, and will generally have poorer relations with the Kingdom of Greece going forward. That said, the Porte will recognize that they have underestimated Greece, and keep a closer eye on it going forward so as to prevent such a situation from happening again. There will definitely be long term ramifications for all involved which for better and for worse, will set the stage for events to come once the current conflict is concluded.
Does the Church of Greece have authority in the new territories?
Not yet, but it probably will once the war is over and Greece formally annexes these new provinces.
One thing I noticed though about Ireland
@Earl Marshal (and maybe
@Lascaris):
The potato famine IOTL all but destroyed the Irish language, as many of the most devastated regions (and where many emigrated from to the U.S., Canada, and other places) were primarily in the western Irish-speaking regions. To basically quote Wikipedia (emphasis mine):
Essentially, with the worst effects largely averted and a Dominion of Ireland (which may come about as a consequence to the Great Eurasian War) established, the Irish language may play a more significant role alongside English (probably along the lines of Welsh in this regard, at least by the 1920s or so)
As of now, I'm not really planning on doing anything different with the Irish language ITTL. The Famine was still rather devastating for Ireland and the language was slowly being replaced by English even before the Famine hit. The Dominion of Ireland may have some impact in saving the language, but I'm honestly undecided about it at this point.
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I take no credit for the graphics, also something to note is that the graphics are based on the Ottoman Census, so they may be slightly biased, other demographic estimates for the Vilayet of Aydin have the Greek population significantly higher, but the general jist of it is that it'd be very difficult for the Greeks to justify expanding too far inland. I went ahead and took Armenians into account as being point in the Greeks favor rather than the Ottomans, although obviously if a Armenian state exists then the slight advantage the Armenian population gives the Greeks is lost to an extent. More demographically defensensible borders exist, these are just what I would imagine are the absolute maximum Greece could expand to
Thank you for linking these, I will definitely put these to good use in the future.
I find it unusual that leopold would keep the coat of arms of Saxe-Coburg und Gotha ,given that in otl he had as an escutcheon a quartering of the british coat(given that he was a consort of Charlotte the princess of Wales before she died) and the wettin coat(he is a descendant of the house of wettin after all) while using as the main shield the lion of Belgium(Leo Belgicus)
Is this coat of arms only valid during the reign of Leo I or will it be used by the house after his reign I wonder
Given Contantine's nature ,I would expect a double headed eagle to make an appearance on the greek coat of arms during his reign.
That is Leopold's personal Coat of Arms. Whether it remains his family's Coat of Arms going forward will be determined by his son Prince Constantine.